Wondering why new pizza crust tastes different

Joined Jan 25, 2013
Made pizza from scratch last week and tried a new recipe. The biggest difference with other recipes is that you mix your water and flour in one bowl, 1/4 cup of water and the yeast in another, then let it stand for 45 minutes before combining the flour and yeast then adding salt and oil. knead, let double. divide, let rest 30 minutes, shape, let rest 30 minutes, add toppings, cook in 500F oven till done. The result was lighter and more tender than any other crust I have made or found in a pizza place.
recipe was
6 cup flour
2 1/4 cup 90F water
2 teaspoon salt
1/2 teaspoon sugar
1 package yeast
2 tablespoons olive oil.
what's the science here?


Staff member
Joined Mar 29, 2002
Salt inhibits the yeast. You also have more time for less yeast to grow equaling starting with more yeast without the pre ferment.

The yeast that starts from the dried state is often considered less tasty than yeast that split from other active yeast. In sour dough terms, this is akin to washing the starter so you have the best most active yeast to build your bread from. Instead of yeast that was in survival mode for who knows how long.
Joined Dec 18, 2010
It very well could be that 30 min rest between shaping and topping/baking that is what you are noticing. That's enough time for the yeast to continue leavening and the gluten tightness from shaping to relax. Everything else seems rather routine for a neo-Neapolitan type pizza crust. What flour are you using?

If you want to experiment a bit, try replacing the sugar with equal amount of dried malt extract (DME) that can be sourced from any homebrew supplier.
Joined Jan 25, 2013
the flour was store brand all purpose. the biggest difference from what i have done in past was mixing the flour and water and letting that stand for 45 minutes before adding yeast and other ingredients.
Joined Dec 18, 2010
That "autolyse" period really makes the dough come together better and makes it easier to control the hydration. I use grocery store AP also for pizza. Some day I might try 00 but my local purveyor won't mark that shelf with a price. I'm afraid to ask!

The oil also tenderizes. I sometimes double the oil.

The other aspect you may be noticing is because of how the dough was shaped. I've rolled with a pin and got tough results. Rolling with a rest helps a lot but pressing by hand is better for a tender crust.
Joined Aug 4, 2000

I'm thinking that Buddy's being in the business of making a good product and making a big profit can't be messing around too much. The dough needs to be made early and be ready by the time the lunch crowd arrives. Everything has to be made in big batches and divided up for portion control. Any differences from one location to another probably stems from operators although my mom said that something as simple as humidity can wreak havoc on the dough rising properly. The Warren location is pretty consistant.

Things we are sort of sure of:

10X14 inch well seasoned steel pan that is never washed-just scraped clean and re-oiled.

Oiled with either O.O., veg oil or canola oil.

Bromated flour or bread/cake flour.

Stanislus tomato sauce; heavy w/ basil, 7/11 or full red with very little seasoning added and thinned out

Margherita brand coarse grind pepperoni. 4 slices of pep per slice of pie-32 slices for large 8 slice pie.

Most likely a top secret Mozzarella/White Cheddar cheese blend that's near impossible to buy unless your Buddy's.

15 ounces of cheese-although I found that depending on the day, that may be a bit much-sometimes it doesn't all melt.
The cheddar might melt more thourougly.

Dough on bottom then pepperoni then cheese then sauce on top. Pepperoni is put on bottom so it doesn't char.
All other items placed on top.

Orignal Buddy's used Blodgett ovens-newer locations use conveyer type ovens.

Square pizzas are taken out of pan and served on round trays. (Weird, Huh?)

**SIDE NOTE** Since this thread is mainly about Buddy's, I think I have their salad dressing real close.
these proportions are what I use to make a batch.
32 ounces of high quality red wine vinegar.
16 ounces of veg oil. The label on Buddy's carry out bottle says they use soybean oil. Couldn't find it at my local Kroger.
1 yellow onion- about the size of a cue ball or a little smaller, peeled, sliced.
1 lemon. cut ends off and discard. Slice the rest thin.
1 heaping teaspoon of preminced garlic from jar.
1 teaspoon of ground peppercorn. I used a small electric coffee grinder.

Add all ingredients in a jar or other container that can be shook well without it spilling.

Shake well twice a day, then its ready in a week. When ready to use, strain through whatever you have.

1 head of iceberg lettuce, 1 tomato sliced into 6 slices,1 handful of deli ham,1 salami and1 mozz cheese.
Add a ladel of dressing -Enjoy!


Bake at 475F for 15 minutes

Or bake at 450F for 30 minutes.
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