Technique

Discussion in 'Professional Chefs' started by icmc6119, Dec 6, 2013.

  1. icmc6119

    icmc6119

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    Hello all. After a hiatus of about 12 years in a full time gig ( I had a few catering gigs ) I find myself back in the kitchens once a cook always a cook also nice to be able to fall back on it. I have found that some things have changed and am hoping for some direction. Last when I left when heating a base for seafood chowder I marinated whichever seafood product I had in the coolers cooked the product and added it to the base the place I am working at now has forbidden me to use this method and add the seafood directly to the base and heat the soup with the raw fish. Also when preparing chicken they use the old school method of frenching the bone there way and thus exposing the marrow and blood and I am sure some bone fragments as well also there does not seem to be any "cooked above raw" procedures in place along with some other practices I question quietly I am a journeyman cook and have about 19 years of experience I am not at all interested in climbing the ladder been there done that I am wondering if these practices are the normal new way of preparing the items I have listed. Thank you for your time.
     
  2. kuan

    kuan Moderator Staff Member

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    You just have to pick at the bone to make sure there are no bone fragments.  As for dumping the seafood into the base well, what base are they using?  Powdered cream soup base out of a bag?  If so, I wouldn't bother arguing with them.
     
  3. chefwriter

    chefwriter

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    Could you re-phrase the problems? What do you mean by marinating the seafood when making soup? 

    When heating the soup, the raw fish would end up cooked. Held in the hot soup for a few minutes and at proper temp for service, that doesn't seem to pose a problem. 

         Frenching the chicken leg is a very old practice to enable easier eating and doesn't by itself present a problem. Rinsing the legs should remove any bone fragments. 

    What do you mean by "there does not seem to be any "cooked above raw" procedures". Are you serving raw food? No one serves raw chicken but obviously seafood served raw is sushi/sashimi. 

    I'll await your clarification. 
     
  4. icmc6119

    icmc6119

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    Thank you for your reply's for a little clarification the seafood I marinated or a better term was seasoned before cooking it off and adding it to our chowder base which we make in batches around 30 to 40 liters' roux base with potatoes the mirexpoix and clam nectar. As for the cooked above raw procedure we were always trained to have all raw product below any cooked food so any liquid does not have a chance to contaminate the cooked product.I checked with a cooking school and they do not French the bone by that method any more they now clean and scrape to the bone. Thanks again for your direction
     
  5. chef torrie

    chef torrie

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    I'm confused as to what the old school v new school method of frenching is?
     
  6. someday

    someday

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    Punctuation. Paragraphs. These are your friends. You will have a hard time getting responses if your thoughts and posts aren't better organized.  
     
  7. icmc6119

    icmc6119

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    Someday: that's your contribution to this topic ?
     
  8. kuan

    kuan Moderator Staff Member

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    Think instead of whacking off the knuckle people are just cutting the skin and separating the tendons from the knuckle and pushing the meat up the bone?
     
  9. beastmasterflex

    beastmasterflex

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    Sounds like you might have landed in a bit of a sloppy kitchen, few things scare me more than mishandling raw meat. You're definately supposed to keep raw meat under prepared foods.

    I think both ways of cooking fish into a chowder are accepted, each with their own merit. Searing your fish with seasoning will give it a deeper more complex flavor, but it can also dry it out. Cooking raw fish into chowder is a gentler way, and if the fish is seasoned ahead it will still stand out in the soup.
    Do you mean taking the leg tips off with a cleaver? Or cleaning the wing bone connected to the breast?
     
  10. chefsia

    chefsia

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    As a fellow chef, I cannot stress the preservation of product integrity more. I trained under some of the giants in the industry and as somone with over 25 years of professional experience I would suggest you discuss this situation with a higher-up in private. I never advocate the use of purchased bases for Soup's or sauces. The "frenching" of carcasses is a fundamental technique for creating a stock, but using it in a soup may expose consumers to an unacceptable level of bacterial contamination. Animal bones require a minimum of 4 hours of a bare simmer to destroy all the bacteria as well as extract the maximum flavor and collagen which is essential in giving a soup or sauce its body. If they listen that's great, but if not, you may want to reconsider your position in such an operation.
     
  11. someday

    someday

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    If I could better understand and make sense of what you wrote, instead of a wall of text, I could better help you. 
     
  12. beastmasterflex

    beastmasterflex

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    Getting rude now.
     
  13. kuan

    kuan Moderator Staff Member

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    Yes.  I do not see the point of criticizing one's communication style.  Let this serve as a reminder.  Please have a little respect.
     
  14. icmc6119

    icmc6119

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    Thank you all for the insight. When Frenching the breast and leg portions yes they remove the knuckle with a cleaver and clean to the bone. The difference is that the knuckle does not get removed in the way I used to do it .