Sous Vide cooking

Discussion in 'Food & Cooking' started by dagger, Jul 21, 2018.

  1. dagger

    dagger

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    We called this boil n bags in the 70s, is it for real. Their is talk of restaurants cooking this way, how everything takes hours to days. Who is going to order a steak dinner that will be ready in 2+ hours. Would not a pressure cooker give you the same results in fraction of the time. In the time of drive thru can't see this or why anyone would pay extra for a stick that does what a pot if boiling water on a stove does.
     
  2. phatch

    phatch Moderator Staff Member

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    It's about a very precise temperatures managed over a period of time. Most of the modern systems have remote inter face so you can start and stop them from your phone when you're not even home. Or can be programmed to start at a given time.

    So you can put your vacuum bag steak or chicken on ice with a little bit of water in it and start it two hours before you get home. You walk in the door all you have to do is sear it. you can make soft-boiled eggs that are beyond anything you can achieve on a pot on the stove.

    Well except a lot of modern induction burners have a suos vide temperature gauge for your pot to manage the burner underneath it giving you a two in one appliance.

    Sous vide cooking isn't about speed it's about results that aren't available in through other methods.
     
  3. mike9

    mike9

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    I have two setups. #1 is Joule an immersion circulator and #2 is a PID controller I use with a hot plate. I can insert the probe into the pot to control the temperature of the hot plate. This is my stock making rig - 200f for 40hrs = nutritious and delicious broth that is clear as a bell since it never boils.
     
  4. Pat Pat

    Pat Pat

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    What kind of stock is it? Why do you cook it for so long?

    I never went longer than 12 hours @ 190°F; well, maybe 20 hours max if I'm really busy with something else.
     
  5. someday

    someday

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    :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: I can't tell if this is a serious post or not. Sous vide is nothing like boil in a bag, as stated above it is about precise temperature control over time to achieve results that aren't possible by any other cooking method. If you're really interested in learning more about it, I'm happy to help. But I'm not going to waste time typing info if you are just trolling.
     
  6. chrislehrer

    chrislehrer

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    As others have mentioned, you're misunderstanding (assuming you're not just trolling). Take the steak dinner as an example.

    Sous vide allows you to cook that steak to a very precise temperature, considerably in advance--even a day in advance. When you're getting toward service time, you drop the bag back into water that is a little below the target temperature, where it will sit without doing anything at all for some time.

    Now somebody orders a steak. You pull a bag, dry the steak thoroughly with paper towels, season nicely, and sear it blazing hot on a grill or in a pan. You're not trying to cook the steak, just to get a great crust. As soon as that happens, the steak is ready to go, and barely needs to rest.

    So while the total time is certainly very long, the time from ordering to delivery is no longer--and probably rather shorter--than the traditional method.

    So far, you might say the method is fairly pointless. But what if you could cook something completely differently? For example, if I cook slices of squash sous vide for a couple of hours at very low temperature, it will cook completely through but not fall apart. Or I could cook a very tough cut of meat--something you'd normally cook as a pot roast--for 24 or even 48 hours at a steak-type target temperature, and when I sear and slice it at the end, it'll be as tender as a filet.

    Used properly, sous vide does two things: it allows you to cook things very precisely in advance and have them ready to go for service (this is mostly useful for professionals), and it creates some possibilities for cooking that simply cannot be done by almost any other means (this is useful for anyone who's interesting in creative experimentation).

    What sous vide is not is a magic bullet. It doesn't make you a better cook, and it's not good for everything. Like any other cooking method, it requires knowledge, practice, and taste.

    Hope that helps.
     
  7. dagger

    dagger

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    Would not a pressure cooker also tenderiz the meat same way in a fraction of the time. I'm guessing the meat can't be flovered or any type of liquid could be used in the bag. I get low and slow microwave chef long time ago explained reason not everything should be cooked fast in one. I also heard their are some bacteria that grows in a vacumm so wondering if multiple hours cook time would make a perfect environment for this.

    No this is not trolling, grow up. I'm not a professional chef wasn't trained in and culinary school just home cook. Now it seams every few days a new gadget comes along claming its the ultimate cooking device along with You Tube video's detailing it as a must have. Well i have jumped from stove to toaster oven to air fryer and gas range to induction, still part time pressure cooker so this is new and reads waste to me nothing specialspecial.

    My question is what the vacumm bag is supposed to do besides keep the water out. The meat will release gas while it cooks but haven't see any bags showing this in the video's
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2018
  8. chrislehrer

    chrislehrer

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    Pressure cooker is high heat, not low.

    The vacuum bag just ensures maximally even contact with the water surrounding while keeping the food separate from that water.

    Yes, in theory, the situation inside the bag could become a breeding ground for anaerobic bacteria like botulism. But basic food safety will prevent that-- above all, don't leave the sealed bag sitting around somewhere for months! (But why would you?)
     
  9. phatch

    phatch Moderator Staff Member

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    The items cooked do release liquid and a little gas. The bag also contains that flavor against the item cooked which is a bonus. Additionally, since the item is cooked at a lower temp it releases much less liquid than traditional methods so it's juicy without brining and such.

    Normally you cook chicken breast to 160 in the center. The exterior may be 175ish. Sous vide you cook it at 140 and keep the extra juice. Pasteurization is an upper angling graph, the time decreasing on the bottom and temperature increasing on the way up. Salmonella dies instantly at 160 at 155 it's something like 10 seconds. At 140, it's 30 minutes. But you have to factor in the time for the chicken to come to 140 through out itself, usually another 30 minutes. Since there isan even temp gradient through the meat, you can carve without resting as a generalization.
     
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  10. chrislehrer

    chrislehrer

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    Another example that follows from @phatch is confit. Instead of cooking a duck leg in deep fat forever, seal it in a bag with just a little fat and set the temperature to the final target, around 145F. Let it cook for a good long time, then put the bag in ice water to chill fast, and refrigerate. The results will be less greasy than most confit, rivalling really excellent products, with a cleaner flavor profile and better texture than you could normally achieve.
     
  11. mike9

    mike9

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    The extra long simmer extracts everything from the bones and you can practically crush them at that point. It's something I tried, it worked so I keep doing it. This long simmer is for "Bone Broth". Stock is a different thing altogether I don't cook stock that long depending on the intended use.

    Bone Broth - 200f for 40hrs.
    [​IMG]
     
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  12. riffwraith

    riffwraith

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    Sorry to butt in here, but what is the diff between stock and broth? I always thought they were one an the same?
     
  13. dagger

    dagger

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    Modern day Pcs let you pick from high to low pressure does that have anything to do with temperatures..
     
  14. phatch

    phatch Moderator Staff Member

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    Temperature and pressure are related. 15 pounds pressure boils at 250, and is set up to release excess pressure so the temperature also stabilizes.
    10 pounds boils at 235.
     
  15. dagger

    dagger

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    Ok so that brings us back to PK doing the same thing faster. Kind of like smoker slow cooked meat.
     
  16. phatch

    phatch Moderator Staff Member

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    No, because you only have two temps, and you're cooking to conventional doneness temps. You can't cook a rare steak or medium rare prime rib in the PC. And have that even shade of pink across it. Can you soft boil an egg under pressure?

    With sous-vide you can "boil" an egg with any kind of yolk finish you want. White at 140, the yolk fully hardens at 160. But time can add structure without setting the yolk at lower temps too. And still not overcook the white.

    https://www.seriouseats.com/2013/10/sous-vide-101-all-about-eggs.html

    Certainly the PC has its uses. I love it for risotto for example. But these are very different tools and different results.

    I've seen efforts to build a curry sous vide. That particular example was a waste of time. They just attempted regular technique via sous vide. Lots of extra work to no point. A pressure cooker would have been better suited.

    As with all tools sous vide has best uses and poor uses.
     
  17. dagger

    dagger

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    I make hard boiled eggs in my air fryer, 250 degrees for 15 minutes in the shell. How many hours does Sous vide take, yes that was a shot . I guess for the home don't see much of a practical use and think this is one bandwagon not jumping on.

    Not a fan of crock pots because meat shrinks does this type cooking have that problem
     
  18. teamfat

    teamfat

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    Stock is what cooks have been making for many centuries. As is broth. One usual distinction is that stock is a building block, a foundation. Broth is something that can consumed as is, with added aromatics, salt and such. Bone broth is stock that is liberally infused with trendy buzzwords, hipster attitudes and such.

    mjb.
     
  19. someday

    someday

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    You're completely missing the point. If you want to hard boil eggs, then you should hard boil eggs. But if you want to coddle an egg at a specific temperature so that, say, the white is set but the yolk is runny, then sous vide is best. You can do it right in the shell.

    If you want a braised style short rib, then braise a short rib. If you want a steak-tender short rib cooked medium rare then use sous vide.

    Pressure cookers are good tools that can be used for many things, but are totally different than a sous vide setup.

    And it's not a bandwagon, been used in kitchens for literally decades, and has been ubiquitous in fine dining for close to 15 years. Just because you haven't heard of it until recently doesn't make it new.
     
  20. chefross

    chefross

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    Ah Dagger........I thought as you, but my curiosity got the best of me and I went out and bought an Aveno Sous Vide stick.
    It clips to the side of my stock pot and with my vacuum sealer, away I went. Yes food takes longer to cook, but the results will amaze you. Think of it as another tool in your kitchen.
    Now, I still have an issue with Sous Vide cooking, as now I have to cook something twice, once in Sous Vide, then on a pan to brown and or finish. Sometimes the idea of cooking something twice makes me not want to bother. But when the day is right, and I've got the patience, the product comes out better than restaurant quality.