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Serious Health Issue - Rat Poison in Oven

Discussion in 'Food & Cooking' started by dc sunshine, Jan 22, 2010.

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  1. Jan 22, 2010 #1
    dc sunshine

    dc sunshine

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    We've got a problem Houston. Just moved into new house. Gas oven. Seemed to be working ok. Finally had time to look at it properly, noticed a plate warming drawer at the bottom (it's a free standing unit). So, opened it up for a look see. Rat poison...in baking trays, oven trays, big plastic lid full of it.

    I had cooked twice in the oven and used the broiler/griller above it. We had stomach problems after this. Stopped using oven. Contacted landlord. They claim its not a problem. I think the entire thing would be thoroughly contaminated by the combination of heat and rat poison, and volatile chemicals, and unsalvagable from a health and safety point of view.

    Know what the agent said? "Well I spoke to the poisons board and they said you'd have to eat mouthfuls of the stuff for it to harm you. And it takes 10 pellets to harm a toddler." Such great concern. (And how the heck did someone find that fact out about the toddler?!?)

    Does anyone know if it is really an issue? Would a good scrub out eliminate any probs? They are really not coming to the party with a solution. What about the residual chemicals and toxins which will be lurking where they can't get into to clean it?

    Help! Advice seriously needed here. I'm cooking in the microwave, and I'm not happy. Any advice would be appreciated. :laser:I need some ammo:mad:
     
  3. Jan 22, 2010 #2
    gunnar

    gunnar

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    other then swabbing the oven and sending in for analysis i have no way of being sure...spend a coupl hundred get a new or used oven and call it a day.... with a lawsuit
     
  4. Jan 22, 2010 #3
    dc sunshine

    dc sunshine

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    Yeah that's the trouble with renting <sigh> I spoke to the Poisons info line and quizzed them about it. They say you need to actually ingest it to be at any risk, and that there would be no risk, once the oven had been cleaned out properly.

    Thanks for your reply. I do feel like ripping it out and putting a new one in. I think once they clean it I'll crank it up for a few hours to burn anything the heck out of there. It was just really nasty to find that in there. I like warm plates when I'm serving, and was pleased (at first!) to find a warming drawer. Now, it just feels, well you can imagine.

    P.S. When I returned my incoming report with other complaints - they said they house had been "professionally cleaned" ummm...no, I would be ashamed to be claiming that....lol.
     
  5. Jan 22, 2010 #4
    amazingrace

    amazingrace

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    Invite the agent and the landlord to dinner, and once they get there, make a big deal about removing all the food from the oven...baked potatoes, roast, bread etc. See how comfortable they are about it then. :look:
     
  6. Jan 22, 2010 #5
    phatch

    phatch Moderator Staff Member

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    While I'd be pretty perturbed about it, rat poison is a blood thinner (at toxic doses for a rat) and a diuretic. This will not cause your standard food sickness symptoms. The diuretic is to make the rat thirsty so they seek out water, usually outside of the home and die there rather than stinking up your house.

    Toxicity is basically milligrams/kilo of body weight needed. So it's mostly multiplication to know the toxic amount for said toddler

    But yes, I'd be demanding a replacement from the landlord.
     
  7. Jan 22, 2010 #6
    chefray

    chefray

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    The good news, most rat poison is Warfarin. That's a blood thinner and it's effects, in high doses, cause severe pneumonia, and then death, from capillary leakage of the lungs. The reason that that's good news is Warfarin is a carbohydrate, meaning it's made of Carbon, Hydrogen, and Oxygen(in a specific ratio). All carbohydrates are susceptible to heat degradation (think caramelization). Clean it out, scrub it, and turn the broiler on for a while. That should degrade and remaining poison into, essentially, black stuff(carbon) and water.

    Also, it's highly soluble in Acetone. Use nail polish remover to clean in between sweeping out and broiler, but make sure to let the acetone evaporate or you'll have a real fume problem.
     
  8. Jan 22, 2010 #7
    chefray

    chefray

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    It's 1.7(ish) mg/kg body weight to cause severe symptoms or death.

    I like to know everything about every product in my house and kitchen, in case you were wondering how I know so much about rat poison.
     
  9. Jan 22, 2010 #8
    dc sunshine

    dc sunshine

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    Grace - that was one question i asked the agent - would you cook in that oven? Answer: "I'm afraid I can't make comment on that." Good on him.

    Ok, I'm not going to wait for them to attend to it. I want to COOK! I'm in withdrawal. Scrub everything down as much as possible, rinse off, acetone wipe (daughter has got some lurking somewhere), rinse off thoroughly, let dry. Crank the you know what out of the oven, let burn off.

    I should insist that they do this. Pigs might fly at the moment too :)

    Thank you all for your help - at least now I have a plan of attack. All my jumping up and down is getting me nowhere, so I'd thought I'd ask people who would actually know.

    P.S. ChefRay - I'd hate to get on your wrong side - all that knowledge - dangerous :D
     
  11. Jan 22, 2010 #9
    maryb

    maryb

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    Acetone is highly flammable and the fumes could be explosive in a contained area like the oven.
     
  12. Jan 22, 2010 #10
    dc sunshine

    dc sunshine

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    Stuck between a rock and a hard place here. If I rinse *very thoroughly....oh lord I hate my landlord. Rip the thing out of the kitchen and dump it in their office is Plan B
     
  13. Jan 22, 2010 #11
    nick.shu

    nick.shu

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    Quite possibly, visit your GP and and get some blood tests sorted. Take it from a viewpoint that you have evidence and take it from there. Another method of resolving this would involve questioning your GP and informing them of the situation and what is involved.

    Im not going to make any assumptions with regard to your scenario. I dont know what rodenticide is involved, and I wouldnt know what to do in such an event. However, Iam having significant rodent problems at home would like to hear your outcomes.
     
  14. Jan 22, 2010 #12
    chefray

    chefray

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    As MaryB has stated, acetone=flammable. That's why the thorough rinse and complete dry is needed. Also, I'm about as dangerous as a whiffle ball. I just feel the need to know everything about anything that might find its way into my kitchen. I would hate to "just wing it" like some people I know and have someone end up ill from something.
     
  15. Jan 22, 2010 #13
    dc sunshine

    dc sunshine

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    Was j/k ChefRay - but you knew that. What's a whiffle ball BTW? Info is good, and necessary. I'm glad to find out what's needed here. Will post what happens....when it happens (hopefully not *if).

    Thanks again.

    DC
     
  16. Jan 22, 2010 #14
    mikelm

    mikelm

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    DC -
    Nail polish remover is one he!l of an expensive way to buy acetone! Go to your local hardware and buy a pint (or whatever you use to measure down there) of acetone. Have all your doors and windows open while you're using it and for several hours afterward. I'm assuming it's still warm enough to do that comfortably. Best if you pick a windy day so you get some real air circulation.

    Most of the people in the real estate biz are snakes - especially the landlords. I speak from forty or so years of experience. ;)

    Mike

    Oh... and don't smoke that afternoon. :eek:
     
  17. Jan 23, 2010 #15
    dc sunshine

    dc sunshine

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    Thanks for the tip Mike, its plenty warm here for that, was about 38C/100F in the shade yesterday. Lots cooler today, but got the house airing out.

    Landlords do very much take the cake- luckily, our last one was actually really good. He gave me his private home number if the agency ever mucked us around. Had to call him couple times in 3 years, and he resolved things pretty quick smart.

    These guys however......:mad: They don't know where from the sun shineth but think it shines out of...well, y'know. Mob of idiots.


    P.S. never smoke inside anyway :) makes landlords angry. Ha! Think I should light up now....
     
  18. Jan 23, 2010 #16
    mikelm

    mikelm

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    Hey, DC -

    "Ha! Think I should light up now...."

    cut that out! You got kids -

    I lost my mother and my younger sister to lung cancer; inveterate smokers both.

    Enough preaching but...please think about it.

    Mike
     
  19. Jan 23, 2010 #17
    dc sunshine

    dc sunshine

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    Mike - preaching appreciated - I'm very sorry to hear of your losses.

    Have been thinking about it seriously lately. Doing it outside lessens by far what I would normally want to do - it is such an insiduous drug. But I think, cold turkey is the only answer. I *do have my children to think about - they are the most important people in the world to me.
     
  20. Jan 23, 2010 #18
    chefray

    chefray

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    I know. I was joking back about the whiffle ball which, by the way is a hollow plastic ball about the size of a baseball with holes all around. It's impossible for kids to hurt themselves with it unless they really try hard. Strange toy really. The harder you throw it, the less distance it travels.

    I hadn't thought about hardware stores selling acetone before but, now that it's been mentioned, that would be the way to go. It should be in with the paint.
     
  21. Jan 23, 2010 #19
    foodpump

    foodpump

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    May I suggest?......

    1) DEMAND the fee the "professional cleaners" charged be returned to you. They obvioulsy didn't do what they wre supposed to do

    2) IF there was poison in the stove, there should be posion under the fridge. Mice love small, warm places with moisture/water nearby

    3) Over-the-counter rat poison is USELESS, ost rodents are immune to it now. The prson who bought it has crossed the threshold of Irrate home owner to conned pet owner--he has bought them pet-food!

    4) Start looking for entries wher the critters got in.

    But the best way to stop the whole deal is to get a cat......
     
  22. Jan 23, 2010 #20
    dc sunshine

    dc sunshine

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    Foodpump - luckily we didn't have to pay the cleaner's fees - I don't think there were any cleaners here anyway. Luckily the place came with no fridge, we put our own in. I'm hoping that we are immune to rat poison hehe - not taking the risk - gonna follow the acetone route if the agent doesn't come to the party and get it done for us. Then send THEM a bill! Haven't seen any sign of recent rodent activity but am keeping an eye out.

    Oh, and we have 3 very good mousers :D

    Thanks!
     
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