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OK ... Well that says you've obviously never worked in a bar. There is NO place to put 40-lbs of raw wings anywhere in a bar kitchen. You can put them very simply bagged the freezer after they've been cooked. The difference in MY kitchen is minuscule between the fresh cooked and the cooked from frozen wings. Nobody has ever been unhappy and as I've said before ... NONE ever come back.



"We work in kitchens ... It ain'te rocket surgery.".

You're pretty defensive.

How can you say there is no place to put 40 lbs of raw wings when your method includes storing 40lbs of raw wings in buttermilk before they are floured and fried? Obviously there is space so I don't understand.

You can obviously cook your wings however you want. I'm sure they are very good. But there are many many ways to cook things and your way is just one.

Don't EVER confuse bar chx-wings with haut cuisine.

For the record, I don't think the simple act of cooking wings from fresh to order somehow constitutes haute cuisine. If that is what you think haute cuisine is then, well...I hope you don't actually think that.

Also no one has used that term in 20 years.
 
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Ice man, i feel as if cooking them all the way then freezing can lead to dry wings and they shrink significantly by the second fry, im not saying crispy wings are bad which im sure they come out nice and crispy, but with that being said (for me) kansas state law requiring reheating back to 165. Ive seen fully cooked and frozen wings and fryed, become crispy little burnt pathetic of wings before reaching 145 internally.. my most effective for me personally has been salting, baking at 235 for 25 mins, then individually freezing, we only due this due to low volume and our wings go bad.
i dont think anyone is confusing the two, only some seek per perfection while having to maintain time and date sensitivity in ever changing volume. ( hotel restaurant for me).
if you dont have space for 40 lbs and freeze, you must be in a small low capacity bar and or have low volume.i couldnt imagine a busy bar 200 capacity plus without space for 40lbs of wings, then again your capacity could be 30. Every gigs different. honestly sounds like a poor kitchen design if the freezer has more space than the walkin,.
i think in the end techniques and taste is subjective, figure out what works, what the customer wants and likes.

also someday said it right, out with the freezer!!!! gordan ramsey would want the same. LOL
 
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OK ... I'll explain some more ...

There is a big giant difference in 2 sealed 5-gal buckets sitting on a rack shelf and give or take 8 trays of wings. The buckets take up much less space and they are sitting there overnite without anyone going in and out. 40-lbs of pre-prepped raw wings can get nasty faster than you might think. They just can't be sitting around. As for the "haut cuisine" comment that I made ... I guess sarcasm is lost on you.

Freezing and recooking doesn't cause any shrinkage or dryness in My kitchen. I'm sorry if it does in yours. Also ... cooking a dozen frozen wings in a fry-basket for 8-minutes brings them up to temp just fine in My kitchen. Again ... I'm sorry if you can't get those results in yours. My kitchen is designed just fine, and there is enough space for our customer turnover. I don't know where you work but I'm in Chicagoland. Are you telling me that you only salt and bake your wings? Are you kidding? I'd love a shot at your customers. For you, Ramsey and anyone else ... there is nothing wrong with proper use of the freezer. Rookies... LOL.
 
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I dunno about wings, but if I didn’t have a freezer for my pastry stuff, I’d need a staff of at least three. (I work solo in a hotel with 80 ala carte seats and bqting of up to 200 per day)

A freezer is a tool, not a bank safe, and like any tool it can be abused or used to make great products quickly and rationally.
 
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There is a big giant difference in 2 sealed 5-gal buckets sitting on a rack shelf and give or take 8 trays of wings.

You could dredge in flour to order...no need to dredge then spread them out on a sheet tray. So all you'd need to do is drain off the buttermilk from the wings and store in a clean 5 gal bucket in the walk in. Pull from there to store on the line.

40-lbs of pre-prepped raw wings can get nasty faster than you might think. They just can't be sitting around.

But, you said you went through 40 lbs of wings a day...so that would mean they wouldn't be "sitting around." I'm confused. If you have that type of volume then there shouldn't be any wings that last more than a day or two.

Freezing and recooking doesn't cause any shrinkage or dryness in My kitchen. I'm sorry if it does in yours. Also ... cooking a dozen frozen wings in a fry-basket for 8-minutes brings them up to temp just fine in My kitchen. Again ... I'm sorry if you can't get those results in yours. My kitchen is designed just fine, and there is enough space for our customer turnover. I don't know where you work but I'm in Chicagoland. Are you telling me that you only salt and bake your wings? Are you kidding? I'd love a shot at your customers. For you, Ramsey and anyone else ... there is nothing wrong with proper use of the freezer. Rookies... LOL.

Holy crap, haha. So defensive. Someone offering different advice or trying to parse out a method or better method for cooking chicken wings isn't a personal attack. If you and your customers like the way you do your wings, that's great. Yours isn't the ONLY way to do them.

One of my favorite methods for wings is to confit, ripen, then pull from fat and directly fry them until crispy. Toss in whatever sauce you want. Amzing. Works with duck wings too. I didn't suggest that because it probably wouldn't be doable in the OP's kitchen.
 
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You're right ChefBuba. Thank you. Someday ... you speak as a person with NO bar-kitchen experience. Maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt it. I'm not explaining anything to you any more.
 
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You're right ChefBuba. Thank you.

Why are you acting like you’re not the one who got super defensive for no reason? You suggested your method for wings, other people suggested theirs...you seemed to take it personally.

I'm not explaining anything to you any more.

That’s ok, you did a shoddy job the first time around so I don’t feel like I’m missing out.
 
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Joined May 30, 2015
OK ... Well that says you've obviously never worked in a bar. There is NO place to put 40-lbs of raw wings anywhere in a bar kitchen. You can put them very simply bagged the freezer after they've been cooked..

OK ... I'll explain some more ...

There is a big giant difference in 2 sealed 5-gal buckets sitting on a rack shelf and give or take 8 trays of wings. The buckets take up much less space and they are sitting there overnite without anyone going in and out. 40-lbs of pre-prepped raw wings can get nasty faster than you might think. They just can't be sitting around.

You could just as easily portion bag them raw and put them in a bucket in the walk-in. That's what we do where I work. Why would you put raw wings on a sheet tray? Just bag them, put the bags in the bucket and cook fresh to order. Nothing wrong with portioning and freezing raw, but any method that includes double-cooking destroys the wings.


Freezing and recooking doesn't cause any shrinkage or dryness in My kitchen.

Because it's somehow immune to the laws of science?

I'm in Chicagoland.

Maybe it's immune to the laws of science because it's not really in Chicagoland. It's in Magicland.

Don't EVER confuse bar chx-wings with haut cuisine.

It has nothing to do about being haute cuisine. It's called having quality standards.
 
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I was going to quit this squabble ... but you clowns just gotta continue. OK ... that's my fault too I'm sure. You guys don't have any bar-kitchen experience. You just don't know. I didn't take this personally until someday became the Pope of chx-wings. In good regular bars you don't spend the time or make the mess to cook chx-wings "to order". You pull them out of the freezer bag and drop them in the fryer. They're cooked plated and served in 10-minutes. I've never seen a bar that bakes their wings. "Cook to order" baked wings that take half an hour?!? Nobody in any bar wants naked wings. I've never understood how "BuffaloWildWings" has stayed in business so long. Their wings are mediocre/poor at best. Every bar I work uses the large wing sections; drums and flats. The wings in the freezer are breaded and cooked. You don't leave trays of raw breaded wings sit in the walk-in. You don't portion and freeze raw because you have NO idea what your orders are going to be. That's just stupid. Double cooking doesn't destroy anything. You just don't do it right. NO ... MY wings don't shrink and dry out. I'm sorry yours do ... maybe it's because you're not very good. There is NO science involved ... it's SKILL. In Chicagoland nobody puts up with bad wings. I've been doing this for close to 40-years. I have NO idea of either of your pedigrees ... but in this instance neither of you know what you are talking about.

Learn some reading comprehension skills too ... for the second time ... the "haut cuisine" statement was SARCASM.
 
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I wasn't going to add anything to the current discussion but this thread has been going quite long and I'm getting itchy.

I've worked in a few bars/gastropubs and I have to say that we did the wings similarly to what iceman does.

At one of the places, we even won "the best wings" award, so I can confirm that doing the wings that way is more than okay.

With any food, the end product matters more than the process of making it, I believe.
 
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I suggested there might be other valid ways to cook chicken wings other than cook/bag/freeze/cook...all of a sudden I'm "pope of chx-wings" :lol:

In good regular bars you don't spend the time or make the mess to cook chx-wings "to order". You pull them out of the freezer bag and drop them in the fryer. They're cooked plated and served in 10-minutes.

You stated earlier that you cook your chicken wings for 10 minutes (so that they are fully cooked)...so clearly you think you can cook an order from raw-cooked in 10 minutes. I don't care what you do, all I'm saying is you said yourself it can be done. You just choose not to do it for a multitude of reasons--which is fine, I don't care. I am merely pointing out the fact that you yourself said you go from raw to fully cooked in 10 mins.

I've never seen a bar that bakes their wings. "Cook to order" baked wings that take half an hour?!?

The baking, and I hope someone will correct me if I'm misquoting here, but that was about par cooking the wings so that the pickup was faster..i.e. cook to 75% done and then chill/store and drop on the pickup. I don't think anyone suggested baking wings to order and then serving them. You seem to have misunderstood. (You suggested reading comprehension for several of us, maybe it's you that needs it?)

Nobody in any bar wants naked wings.

Well, maybe not in Chicagoland but since you only work in Chicagoland how can you say no one wants naked wings when your experience is only in Chicagoland? Maybe people in Detroit, or Philly, or Dallas want naked wings. If you've only been in Chicagoland how could you speak to what everyone wants?

I've never understood how "BuffaloWildWings" has stayed in business so long. Their wings are mediocre/poor at best.

Hey, look! I agree.

You need to seriously get a grip. This forum is for people to ask questions, and have a multitude of answers of probably differing opinions about how to proceed, and then decide for themselves what to do. If the OP decides that your way for wings is the best or the one they want to use, great. Maybe they'll decide to go a different route. There are many ways to get to a delicious cooked chicken wing. I don't know where that enormous chip on your shoulder came from, but maybe a little self reflection is in order....?
 
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OK ... since you love using quotes ...

YOU:
"I actually have never done wings in a professional capacity before ..."
YOU:
"EVERYTHING YOU SAID IN POST#19."
YOU:
"EVERYTHING YOU SAID IN POST#25."
YOU:
"That’s ok, you did a shoddy job the first time around so I don’t feel like I’m missing out."

Thank You, Mr.Pope of Chx-Wings.

Everything you've said is asking for a fight since the VERY FIRST THING YOU SAID WAS "I actually have never done wings in a professional capacity before ...". You're a perfect example of some guy who talks big without any experience on the subject. Maybe you should get the grip and not act like you know anything about a subject you have NO experience with. With NO working experience your opinion doesn't stack up to anyone with experience. Every part of what I said I do is done during prep before the bar opens. YOU DON'T HAVE TIME TO DO THAT STUFF DURING SERVICE. Book-smarts don't always work in the real world. When rookies keep giving OPs their "maybe" kind of opinions they're only going to get hammered at work. In my 40-odd years I've worked in numerous cities all over. I used "Chicagoland" as a reference. A major highly-populated food city, not whatever place you come from where you can get away with what you do. You can take all your "different routes" right to getting a new job. This is the "Professional Chefs" part of the forum. I don't have any chip ... I've got skills and experience.
 
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CDBBC8DB-30A8-4521-A189-E360CED42FE0.jpeg Haha holy crap. :lol:

I don’t need to justify any of my experience to you or anyone else. I don’t need your permission to suggest an alternate way of doing something. At no point did I denegrate what you said you did, I only offered another opinion.

I’m more than comfortable and confident in the food I do, the guests I serve and the wonderful people I work for.

I don’t think the fact that I’ve never cooked in a bar somehow means I can’t have an opinion on the subject. That’s an absurd thing to think.

I don’t know what triggered you...but you’re embarrassing yourself.
 
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Joined May 30, 2015
You guys don't have any bar-kitchen experience. You just don't know.

I work in a bar/steakhouse and 50%+ of our sales are deep fried bar apps.

I've never seen a bar that bakes their wings.

I agree with you on this - baking is unecessary. Our wings are portioned raw in bags, dusted & fried (completely raw) to order - 8 minutes in the fryer.


You don't portion and freeze raw because you have NO idea what your orders are going to be.

Lots of places use production planning and can get a good base number. It's not perfect, but it's better than winging it.;)
 
1,832
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Joined Aug 15, 2003
I'm truly surprised I didn't get a "I've forgotten more about food than you'll ever know" line from him. I was waiting for it.

:lol:
 
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