Looking for Vegan Sorbet Stabilizer

Discussion in 'Professional Pastry Chefs' started by jellly, Sep 5, 2011.

  1. jellly

    jellly

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    I was disappointed to find out that the Cremodan Sorbet Stabilizer I received has gelatin in it.  Some of the supplier websites I view do not include much detailed product info and my rep isn't much better.

    I get enough vegans in my restaurant that I like to at least be able to offer sorbet in addition to fresh fruit if requested, so I would prefer to use a stabilizer that doesn't have gelatin.  

    Is anyone out there using a brand they would recommend?
     
  2. panini

    panini

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    Jelly, There is a brand, something like Pinkas? It's in a tube. I'll go find it. I know it's vegan.
     
  3. thetincook

    thetincook

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    You could just blend your own. I've got a formula written down somewhere.
     
  4. thetincook

    thetincook

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    A quick look at my sources says that you can use ~0.2% of Xantham gum, ~0.3% Guar gum, or ~0.35% locust bean (carob) gum.

    I've got a blend written down somewhere, just have to find it. Xanthan gum is pretty easy to get retail. The celiacs use it instead of gluten.
     
  5. petemccracken

    petemccracken

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  6. jellly

    jellly

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       I have used just xanthan gum before, I just don't have the guar or locust bean gum handy to mix in.  Sometimes the minimum order on those things are rather large.

    Thanks for the input.
     
  7. chefedb

    chefedb

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    Modified Tapioca starch
     
  8. chefpeon

    chefpeon Kitchen Dork

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    This may be a dumb question, but do you actually NEED a stabilizer to make sorbet?
     
  9. thetincook

    thetincook

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    Unless you're going to spin it every service or have a paco, I say yeah, to get the highest quality.
     
  10. chefpeon

    chefpeon Kitchen Dork

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    So did you try the modified tapioca starch? Did it work?
     
  11. jellly

    jellly

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    No, I didn't try the tapioca starch.  But I did find out that Chef Rubber brand stabilizer is vegan, so I may order that.
     
  12. nightscotsman

    nightscotsman

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    Here's what I use:

    22 g guar gum
    8 g xanthan gum
    70 g glucose powder

    Gives me the same results as the Cremodan.

    You can buy small quantities of guar gum and xanthan from Barry Farm here: http://www.barryfarm.com/thickeners.htm . Some Whole Foods will also carry guar and xanthan for the gluten free people.

    .
     
  13. foodpump

    foodpump

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    Some sorbets with a high fruit fiber cotnent don't need a stabilizer, i.e raspberry, pear, or cherry.  Some, like lemon, need something  to bulk them up.

    Not a stabilizer, but fiber, as in natural fiber that raspberries naturally contain.

    You can go the stabilizer and funny chemicals route, but I'm with Chefpeon on natural ingredients.  Starch is one, but an even more unrefined form of starch is what I use in "thin" sorbets like lemon or lime.

    Rice.

    Regular Thai long grain rice.

    I trust you've had congee?

    I learned this trick from a very southern Italian:  Make a syrup from sugar, water, lemon juice,zest, lemongrass,lime leaf, etc, and add in the raw rice.  Basically boil the crap out of it, blend smooth and strain.  "Freshen" or brighten up with fresh lemon juice/zest and freeze.

    Guaranteed vegan..... 
     
  14. thetincook

    thetincook

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    Haha!

    I was thinking of trying glutinous rice as a stabilizer since waxy starches are more freeze stable. Good to know it works with long grain rice.
     
  15. foodnfoto

    foodnfoto

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    You should try a solution made of powdered guar (or clusterbean) and water. You don't need much, we blend about 2 tablespoons into a quart of water for a nice, this jelly like consistency.Then use only a 1/2 cup or so to a gallon of mixture.

    Totally natural, odorless and tasteless and is tolerated well by celiacs and vegans.

    Works great with our pops and adds a beautiful, silky mouthfeel.
     
  16. nightscotsman

    nightscotsman

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    Starches and rice will work as stabilizers for sorbets but there are drawback vs. gelling agents:

    - Starches do not have good flavor release, so the fresh flavor of the fruit will be a dulled and not as clean. Think of the flavor of canned pie filling.

    - Starches are not as freeze/thaw stable. If storing frozen products for more than a couple days they will take on a kind of "spongy" texture.

    That said, cornstarch is a traditional stabilizer for gellato in some regions of Italy. It gives the ice cream a dense, creamy mouthfeel, but gellato is meant to be eaten very fresh - usually the day it's spun.

    I totally agree with foodpump about fiber content leading to a better texture (though I would still use some stabilizer for other reasons). If you don't want to use commercial stabilizers, then I would suggest using pectin rather than a starch. Pectin will give the sorbet some body while having much better flavor release than starch, though not as freeze/thaw stable as stabilizer gelling agents.

    And as for using "funny chemicals", most gelling agents used for stabilizers are as "natural" as refined white sugar (sucrose). Xanthan gum is made from fermented corn syrup, locust bean gum is made from ground locust beans (otherwise known as carob), guar gum is the ground endosperm of the guar bean, and carrageenan is made from seaweed. The main reason for using more than one in a blend is they can have synergistic qualities when used in combination that improve the gel texture - using just one like xanthan or guar can make the texture "snotty" really fast.
     
    chefpeon likes this.
  17. jellly

    jellly

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    These are some great suggestions. I definitely want to do some taste comparisons.  You guys are the best!
     
  18. wyandotte

    wyandotte

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    I have heard of people using Slippery Elm Bark, finely powdered.
     
  19. icecreamgal

    icecreamgal

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    Hi--so how much of that stabilizer mix would you use for, say, a 6-qt run of sorbet? Does it have to be heated, or can it be used in a cold-process sorbet? Thanks.
     
  20. icecreamgal

    icecreamgal

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    Hi--is it guar gum or locust bean gum in the recipe (meaning the xanthan is the constant)? And how much of the resulting stabilizer mix do you use when making the sorbet base? And can it be used in a cold-process sorbet, or does it have to be heated? Thanks.