How safe is dried mushroom powder, raw?

Discussion in 'Food & Cooking' started by TonyRockyTiger, Jul 20, 2018.

  1. TonyRockyTiger

    TonyRockyTiger

    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exp:
    Home cook
    I am making a recipe that has mushroom powder and will be using the Nom Nom Paleo Magic Mushroom Powder product (https://nomnompaleo.com/post/10533354... - now available at Whole Foods), which I think tastes awesome and works well in cooked foods. The recipe, which is a sauce/condiment, will be raw/uncooked, and will be served to a crowd.

    Is anyone aware of any potential food safety concerns for dried mushrooms or powders derived from dried mushrooms? To give you an idea of how 'paranoid' I am as a home cook, when it comes to food safety (again, cooking for a crowd), when making raw recipes using cilantro, I usually soak the cilantro in a bleach-based water bath (learned this from Alton Brown) for 20 minutes, which hopefully kills most harmful bacteria.

    This recipe also contains nutritional yeast and coconut aminos - any concerns here as well?
     
  2. phatch

    phatch Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    8,496
    Likes Received:
    477
    Exp:
    I Just Like Food
    I make my own mushroom powder and have never had a problem. It's a technique that is millenia old.

    I learned to make and use mushroom powder from Jeff Smith's cooking programs in the 80s
     
  3. sgsvirgil

    sgsvirgil

    Messages:
    389
    Likes Received:
    219
    Exp:
    Retired Owner/Operator
    You're adding bleach to your diet and you're worried about problems with mushroom powder? :confused:
     
    chrislehrer and millionsknives like this.
  4. chefross

    chefross

    Messages:
    2,730
    Likes Received:
    384
    Exp:
    Former Chef
    OY!
     
  5. happyhound

    happyhound

    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    23
    Exp:
    Former Chef
    Depends on the mushroom. Porcini, more than likely safe raw. Morels, not so much. General rule of thumb is never eat a mushroom raw. That being said drying does render some volatile compounds inert. I would refer you to David Aurora's definitive mushroom guide, Mushrooms Demystified for further clarification. Best of luck.
     
  6. chrislehrer

    chrislehrer

    Messages:
    2,011
    Likes Received:
    182
    Exp:
    Cook At Home
    According to the website, it's based on dried porcini, so I really don't think it's either raw or dangerous (until you put bleach in it).
     
  7. brianshaw

    brianshaw

    Messages:
    3,071
    Likes Received:
    330
    Exp:
    Former Chef
    “General rule of thumb is never eat a mushroom raw.“

    There are hoards of people who eat raw mushrooms and have lived happily ever after.
     
    millionsknives likes this.
  8. pete

    pete Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    4,318
    Likes Received:
    891
    Exp:
    Professional Chef
    You are safe consuming cultivated mushrooms raw, but with many of the wild mushrooms you are better off cooking them first. One of my friends, an avid mushroom hunter and amateur mycologist once told me that many wild mushrooms do contain trace amounts of substances that are not good for us. Many will just cause minor digestive tract upset. But cooking wild mushrooms destroys these substances. Don't know if there is any truth in what he told me but since then I've always cooked any wild, foraged mushrooms that I have, with the exception of taking small nibbles of them, but not eating them raw in any quantity.
     
  9. TonyRockyTiger

    TonyRockyTiger

    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exp:
    Home cook
    I knew I was going to get this reaction! I follow the bleach soak with an equally long clean water bath, followed by another water bath. I'm going for a sterilizing of any bacteria that can cause illness. When serving for a crowd, I try to keep cold foods below 40F and hot foods above 140F using chafing dishes (ice + water for the former, chafing fuels for the latter), but I can't guarantee that those temps will hold, thus the need to get rid of as many baddies like ecoli/salmonella/clostridium/etc before they can grow in the danger zone.

    I have seen sources using baking soda or vinegar and I'm tempted to give those a try. Though if bleach is good enough for Alton, it's good enough for me:

     
  10. TonyRockyTiger

    TonyRockyTiger

    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exp:
    Home cook
    Thanks for the reply! I'm actually more concerned with bacteria/spores that could grow on the mushrooms rather than any compounds within the mushroom itself. My guess is that during the drying process, those compounds are typically made harmless (just conjecturing, no science study behind this idea at all). I know that some bacteria are extremely hardy and being out in the danger zone (40F>140F) has given me concern that there might be enough bacteria growth to cause illness.
     
  11. TonyRockyTiger

    TonyRockyTiger

    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exp:
    Home cook
    Thanks for the reference - I'll check that out!
     
  12. TonyRockyTiger

    TonyRockyTiger

    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exp:
    Home cook
    I'm not familiar with his work, but will check him out, thanks!
     
  13. maryb

    maryb

    Messages:
    2,494
    Likes Received:
    176
    Exp:
    Semi pro/retired now
    Simply washing then draining well is all you need. Surface bacteria will be washed away. I never heard of being paranoid about cilantro... if you are really worried grow your own in a sunny window!
     
  14. TonyRockyTiger

    TonyRockyTiger

    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exp:
    Home cook
    Here's one link: http://www.foodsafetynews.com/tag/cilantro/#.W1YLhj9Khds

    ... personally, I have a suspicion that the Chipotle e coli issues stem from their local-based sourcing of produce like cilantro, and at the time, a lack of standardized practices on how to deal with those items in a way that is safe for general consumption. Again, I have no evidence on this and you can definitely accuse me of wearing a tinfoil.
     
  15. maryb

    maryb

    Messages:
    2,494
    Likes Received:
    176
    Exp:
    Semi pro/retired now
    Simple washing will remove bacteria from the surface... I would taste the bleach no matter how well you rinse, it leaves behind a medicinal flavor...
     
  16. rick alan

    rick alan

    Messages:
    2,373
    Likes Received:
    143
    Exp:
    Cook At Home
    Have to believe maryb here. You can't rinse it off your fingers, it has to wear off. And it's very reactive. I would think even seriously denaturing any leafy plant stuff you adulterated would still not rid you of the vestiges.
     
  17. TonyRockyTiger

    TonyRockyTiger

    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    0
    Exp:
    Home cook
    EDIT: the link is down you YouTube. Here's the official one from FoodNetwork:

    https://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/alton-brown/tarragon-chive-vinegar-recipe-1951927

    I won't be adding more to this thread, but if anyone else has thoughts I would love to hear them.