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How much should a line cook be paid?

14K views 79 replies 21 participants last post by  jimyra 
#1 ·
I am currently working $12 per hour for a 40 hour week. Do you think this is a fair wage? Should I ask for a raise?

Servers in my restaurant are making $8 per hour + tips. They are making three times the minimum wage vs. me making just above average wage.

Thoughts? Comments?
 
#5 ·
We probably need more info. 12 an hour isn't bad, but it is not great either. A lot depends on where you are, what type of restaurant it is, how much experience you have, what station you are working, etc. 

But I would say that 12 an hour isn't egregiously low or anything. Welcome to the wonderful world of professional cooking!

Minimum wage is only 7.25, so you make well above that. Unless you live in a state which has higher min wage. But again, you don't say where you live. 

And I would also add, make your peace with not being paid as much as servers do. I agree that it is one of the biggest negative issues facing our industry...that is, the wage gap between front and back...but it doesn't seem like it will be fixed anytime soon. There are a few pioneering restaurants out there that are trying things to close this gap, but they are few and far between. 

If you want to make a lot of money, unfortunately, best to find another career. If you want to make ends meet, you'll most likely need 2 jobs or 1 that pays overtime, at least until you get bumped to sous and/or head chef and make a "livable" income. Be prepared to pay your dues. 
 
#6 · (Edited)
I am in Wisconsin. I work 40 hours, 5 days a week + overtime. Besides cooking full time, I am involved with the day to day operations with prep, cleaning and inventory. My starting wage was $8 per hour.

I would not want to be a server. I prefer my career. I love what I do for a living. The lead cook and I click. We have a lot of fun in the kitchen and we make our own rules. We communicate without even speaking. We basically can read each others minds. I'm usually ahead of him before he asks, unless some unforeseen complication throws us off our game.

We do have perks. We can eat whatever we want. Take breaks when needed. We can even drink alcolhol if we wanted to during our shift. I laugh my butt off when he loses his shit and starts throwing french fries at people whenever they piss him off. He is a lovable pain in the ass.

It is rewarding, despite the long hours, hard work and personal sacrifice. I feel that long term, I have more job security whereas servers come and go. Besides, I don't have the patience to deal with the guests BS needs and demands. Their loud, ear piercing, screamy kids would drive me insane.

I just wanted to know from my peers if this pay rate is normal for a person like me, a line cook.

Does $12 hr. seem like a fair pay rate?

Personally, I think our servers are overpaid trash, but that is only my opinion.
 
#11 ·
All experience, duties, minimum wage, and special skills/schools/training aside, IMO what youre worth, what you should be paid for being there, all reduces down to how valuable, and hard to replace an asset you are for the place youre working for.
And there are two sides to that equation....how THEY guage that, and how YOU guage it. Ideally, everyone's happy, give and take equally, you work your ass off, their profits and growth reflect a good investment in you, and you feel exhausted but fairly compensated.
Of course the two viewpoints dont always agree, thats when a sitdown is needed to level the field, or a new job search is in order.
FWIW....
Youre in a common cooks predicament--you love what you do, love who you work with, but dont feel youre paid quite enough for it. But if you leave, you could end in a higher paying job you hate.
Been there done that, as have most chefs and cooks in here I'd fully wager.
 
#15 ·
To better understand why cook wages suck,please read the thread on what a restaurant can expect for a net profit margin. When you realize that the average million dollar unit makes 1.8%, or $18,000 profit, you will understand.
That's only part of the story though. I know you are an owner (and I 100% respect that and what you do) would have a different perspective than a line cook, but the bottom line is wages suck for cooks across the board.

The reason why cook wages suck is a very complicated, multi-faceted issue that can't be whittled down to any one thing...including profit margin. It's even in some ways a societal issue that can't be resolved until we see some major changes in how restaurants charge customers.

Anyways, yes the restaurant business is tough, but it is no excuse for paying a sub-livable wage. We can do better.
 
#16 ·
I'll add a rant later, but for now...

To the original poster, you're getting paid fine for a line cook, given location etc as already mentioned. 

Otherwise, I agree with Someday. It's a complicated issue with multiple factors. And having been a restaurant owner responsible for paying my employees, I hated not being able to pay the cook more but I also listened to too many customers complaining about my high prices for various dishes based nothing more than their perception, not actual food, labor and overhead. At first I just listened but eventually I let them know I costed everything out on the computer, I didn't make them up out of thin air. And this while other places charged as much or more for the same dish. 

Alright, be back later. 
 
#17 ·
Well of course the wages suck for cooks, just stop and think how many other restaurants are within walking distance. Too much competition, so the customer is used to throwing their weight around. Combine that with the fact that the cook has no contact with the customer ( what I dont see, I dont know OR care about) and its no wonder why the customer tips the server 15%, and tells the server to pass his/her compliments along to " the chef".

No, we are our own problem, too much competition.....
 
#18 · (Edited)
Thank you for your responses. Your thoughts and opinions mean a lot to me.

Tell me what you think about the owners.

My restaurant charges $18 for five tiger shrimp deep fried in Shore Lunch. They balk at giving the guest anything more than 1/16th of a lemon wedge. I think that is absurd, but its always something with them. "Tear that lettuce in half! Slice the tomato thinner!" Its already so thin I can hardly pick one up without it falling apart.

"Don't give the customer anything unless they ask! We're not paying you to fill the bins!"I can't stress how important prep is for a busy dinner service. Not having the ingredients we need prepared in advance slows us down during service forces us to have to run harder to make-up for not having that available to us. The wait time for a ticket will increase exponently.

They just bought the building in December and did a lot of renovations, but neglected the kitchen. They bought new refrigerators and misc. but didn't bother to replace the motor for the fan on the hood/vent. It breaks down a lot. Shuts the entire kitchen down during service.

We had an issue the other day when the fryer wasn't up to temperature and she wanted me to hold the ticket and keep the family waiting on an order of wings, even though I had the sandwiches and an order of wings grilled on the charbroiler to get the order out for the hungry family waiting for their dinner. "Don't argue with me! This is my kitchen! I want consistency!" She says. She doesn't understand that sometimes you have to make exceptions when the fryers are down. The person who ate the wings ate them down to the bone, they were delicious.

They make a lot of food that goes to waste. They fancy themselves gourmets and made 24 rotisserie chickens, but only sold six last Sunday. There is so much salt and herb rub on them it could choke a horse. They don't get that these spices also cost money but our advice is not wanted.

They have fancy smoked meats and the owner insists on frying smoked pork belly on the flat top at 500 degrees and making a hell of a mess for us when we come in to work. It's already cooked. The strips of pork belly only need to have a little golden brown color. It all falls on deaf ears. He cranks up the grill without concern that we can't even brown the buns for the sandwiches at that temperature without burning them and throwing them away. The gas consumed is also a great waste.

His wife is a control freak and has to be a speed bump in the kitchen trying to help us. She constantly reminds us this is her kitchen and will do as she pleases. She interferes with the line and we just communicate unspoken words to one another, hoping she will go back to the FOH to fuss over them. She's always portioning things in baggies and the worst was putting BBQ sauce in baggies. 

I keep reminding myself I love my job, but it doesn't get any easier working for people who are so cheap, they squeak. I work hard. I've paid my dues, but there has to be another way to make more money in this business. I think we should be paid more and not have to worry about rent.
 
#19 ·
Thank you for your responses. Your thoughts and opinions mean a lot to me.

Tell me what you think about the owners.

My restaurant charges $18 for five tiger shrimp deep fried in Shore Lunch. They balk at giving the guest anything more than 1/16th of a lemon wedge. I think that is absurd, but its always something with them. "Tear that lettuce in half! Slice the tomato thinner!" Its already so thin I can hardly pick one up without it falling apart.

"Don't give the customer anything unless they ask! We're not paying you to fill the bins!"I can't stress how important prep is for a busy dinner service. Not having the ingredients we need prepared in advance slows us down during service forces us to have to run harder to make-up for not having that available to us. The wait time for a ticket will increase exponently.

They just bought the building in December and did a lot of renovations, but neglected the kitchen. They bought new refrigerators and misc. but didn't bother to replace the motor for the fan on the hood/vent. It breaks down a lot. Shuts the entire kitchen down during service.

We had an issue the other day when the fryer wasn't up to temperature and she wanted me to hold the ticket and keep the family waiting on an order of wings, even though I had the sandwiches and an order of wings grilled on the charbroiler to get the order out for the hungry family waiting for their dinner. "Don't argue with me! This is my kitchen! I want consistency!" She says. She doesn't understand that sometimes you have to make exceptions when the fryers are down. The person who ate the wings ate them down to the bone, they were delicious.

They make a lot of food that goes to waste. They fancy themselves gourmets and made 24 rotisserie chickens, but only sold six last Sunday. There is so much salt and herb rub on them it could choke a horse. They don't get that these spices also cost money but our advice is not wanted.

They have fancy smoked meats and the owner insists on frying smoked pork belly on the flat top at 500 degrees and making a hell of a mess for us when we come in to work. It's already cooked. The strips of pork belly only need to have a little golden brown color. It all falls on deaf ears. He cranks up the grill without concern that we can't even brown the buns for the sandwiches at that temperature without burning them and throwing them away. The gas consumed is also a great waste.

His wife is a control freak and has to be a speed bump in the kitchen trying to help us. She constantly reminds us this is her kitchen and will do as she pleases. She interferes with the line and we just communicate unspoken words to one another, hoping she will go back to the FOH to fuss over them. She's always portioning things in baggies and the worst was putting BBQ sauce in baggies.

I keep reminding myself I love my job, but it doesn't get any easier working for people who are so cheap, they squeak. I work hard. I've paid my dues, but there has to be another way to make more money in this business. I think we should be paid more and not have to worry about rent.
Hi BloodyMary.........Too bad your last comments were not in your original post.

What you are going through is not new at all.

This type of management goes on everywhere.

Your control freak is totally afraid of losing control, and there's not anything you can do for them as they will never change.

With all the waste you mention, it would seem like you're getting a good deal with your wage.

On a similar note, I was reading an article the other day that stated that people who run businesses that can't pay a living wage to their workers are in serious trouble these days. They are being touted as a perfect example of entitlement and should be shut down.

All I can say is "wow."

So now businesses are being attacked because they should pay more (think McDonalds and $15.00 per hour wage)

What ever happened to get a second or third job to pay the bills and make end meet? No that can't happen....we have to make businesses pay out more even though the profit margin is so thin we will lose money paying the help more.

What the heck happened?
 
#20 ·
I also run an Airbnb out of my cottage to help make ends meet. It's not bad considering I'm hardly there on the weekends.

I also do work a second job for a breakfast type restaurant.

My point is that the owners are wasteful. They overpay themselves and the wait staff, but then get stingy with us making our jobs a lot harder than it has to be. I feel that since I am doing twice the amount of work for them personally, I should be paid more.

The control freak wants to do most of the prep herself, but she only does a modest amount (or rather what she feels will be enough) and then leaves the kitchen completely trashed and disorganized. The insert pans, cutlery and tools we'll need are in the dishwashing area piled up. Food all over the floor and work areas. Every day I'll come in and the grill is black with grease and carbon. It's no fun cooking on a filthy flat top grill. So, when I clock in, I have to do a lot of extra prep, cleaning and reorganization before the rush. If this is not done, we will run out of ingredients we need to keep the dinner service running smoothly. When i clock out, that grill is spotless, the dishes are done and the floor is swept and mopped. I try not to leave prep behind because they will just use it and I'll have to cut more anyway.

When I left Sunday, We had a large sheet pan full of pulled pork. The owners took that home to eat themselves and their family. Yesterday, I did not have enough left to sell for sandwiches and tacos. I also had to cut into the expensive and time consuming shelled tiger shrimp to cover for the lack of enough smaller shrimp we use for the tacos, because they ate all that too. They just started selling flatbread pizza and we ran out of cheese because she neglected to buy enough that I asked for.

I mention that this kitchen needs to be kept clean and organized and then takes offense and she is pissy with me the rest of the night.
 
#21 · (Edited)
Hi BloodyMary.........Too bad your last comments were not in your original post.

What you are going through is not new at all.

This type of management goes on everywhere.

Your control freak is totally afraid of losing control, and there's not anything you can do for them as they will never change.

With all the waste you mention, it would seem like you're getting a good deal with your wage.

On a similar note, I was reading an article the other day that stated that people who run businesses that can't pay a living wage to their workers are in serious trouble these days. They are being touted as a perfect example of entitlement and should be shut down.

All I can say is "wow."

So now businesses are being attacked because they should pay more (think McDonalds and $15.00 per hour wage)

What ever happened to get a second or third job to pay the bills and make end meet? No that can't happen....we have to make businesses pay out more even though the profit margin is so thin we will lose money paying the help more.

What the heck happened?
You nailed it. What happened is we've spoiled a generation. They should be renamed the "entitled generation " as that fits far better than millennials. BloodMary loves his/her job but feels the pay should be better and "shouldn't have to worry about the rent". News flash, when an owner can no longer afford to pay the rent, the doors close and now that $12/hr. doesn't look quite as bad. Sound like the owners suck at his/her particular restaurant, but there are an equal number of lousy employees to lousy owners. Pre-portioning helps control waste and provides consistency, something crucial to profitability. Yes, the control freak owner goes too far with the BBQ sauce, but the OP has no idea what pressure the owner is going through to make ends meet. Most line employees have little idea of the costs involved in running a business and what goes into that $18 fried shrimp dinner, besides the rent, food and labor costs. I have a modest operation in a small building. My rent is over $3k per month, Then there's the $1500 monthly electric bill, the $500 gas bill, the $200 phone bill, the $100 internet bill, the $400 advertising bill (which should be 4x that), the $300 workmans comp bill, the $300 business policy bill, the $200 accounting bill, the $500 repair bill, the $1500 credit card fee processor bill, the $1000 paper goods bill, the $2000 credit card bill, the $500 real estate tax bill, the $400 trash removal bill, the $300 linen bill, the $500 chemicals bill.... etc, etc, etc. THEN, there's the food cost. After all that is paid out of that $18 shrimp plate, I have to pay $12 to $18/hr plus 15% payroll taxes to the gov't, for dishwashers, prep, and short order cooks, many of which complain about their low wages just like BloodyMary, yet think nothing of walking in 20-40 minutes late into their shift, work 15 mins and cut out for a smoke every 30 minutes, text on their phoned all day long, pull from the new product letting the old rot beside it, argue with the servers thinking they all make too much money (never thinking that on days where we do 20 covers the cooks wages don't suffer yet the servers are paid sub-min. wages). After ALL THAT, an owner hopes there's a penny or three out of every dollar to pay him/herself some compensation for the many hours working both in and out of the restaurant, the pressures and responsibility of running an operation where so many people rely on its very existence, and the huge risk one took to get it open and hope it stays that way.

/end rant.
 
#22 ·
Mary.

     My only suggestion is that you find another job. I won't respond to everything you posted in detail, just that you are in a bad environment and should find somewhere else to work. 

FOH and BOH should be working together. This is the responsibility of management. Losing tickets, taking random dishes from the pass, etc are not acceptable behaviors and the staff should have been trained how to interact in a more appropriate way with kitchen. 

The kitchen neglect and clueless interference on the part of the owners tells me they have little to no quality experience in operating a restaurant. 

A good restaurant operates as a complete team, including both FOH and BOH working together in a systematic, controlled way. FOH is not your enemy and BOH is not the enemy of FOH.

What money they make is not your concern. How to work together to provide a seamless experience for the customer is. 

Others have brought up good valid points regarding costs and the difficulty of paying a "living wage". Certainly things to think about. 

But overall, your situation will not change unless the owners do and that won't happen soon enough. 

You might learn the proper way to do things by doing the opposite of what you are shown in a bad environment

Or you can learn by observing how things are done the right way in a well-run, professional environment. 

From all you've posted, it would seem you are in the former. Look for the latter and move on. 
 
#23 · (Edited)
This is why I asked, not out of entitlement but to get some honest feedback about wages.

I'm living on $12 per hour. Our perspectives are different. At my restaurant, I believe servers are overpaid and we are underpaid by comparison and the BOH suffers for it.

It's too bad that many restaurants operate in a non-communicative manner. I am truthful and tell it like it is. Some people don't like that. They only hear what they want to hear instead. If I talk frankly I am accused of being argumentative.

I am trying to compensate for the ignorance and neglect of the owners. I work hard. I am never late. I am busting my back trying to make a career out of this, but I can see where its going because the owners are consuming their profits. If I should leave here to go work for someone else, I would just be facing the same opposition elsewhere.

As for breaks, I should be entitled to one when Im working a long shift to use the bathroom, or stop for ten minutes just to catch some air, or smoke a cig. We are not slaves. We are only human. Sometimes I am so busy I can't even stop to drink water. If I do, that control freak senses it. She comes in and lectures about keeping our drinking water covered in the kitchen at all times so I take water and drink it immediately just to avoid that. She's quite a handful.

I am comparing the shrimp to other restaurants that serve more for the same price as we do. If the customer gets shortchanged, they wont order it and they will go elsewhere for a better deal. For example, Bubba Gump Shrimp Co. offers 8 tiger shrimp for $18 plus fries, dip and a lemon wedge. It is popular and it sells. We sell a standard five with no extras.
 
#25 ·
Originally Posted by BloodyMary

At my restaurant, I believe servers are overpaid and we are underpaid by comparison and the BOH suffers for it.
Early in my career, I waited tables for about 5 years. The reason I did it as long as I did was because I recognized what a racket it is. I was making 1/2 of minimum wage but absolutely killing it in the tip department. My mother tried to talk me into going back to college. I told her that even though she had a 4 year degree in education and had been teaching for numerous years, I was making more money as a waiter than she was as a teacher.

Facts that haven't changed in my 40+ years in the biz

1.) FOH makes more money than BOH.

2.) Profit margin for restaurants is small at best *(substantiating numbers from a 2010 report / restaurants with checks under $15 have a profit of 3 percent / checks from $15 to $24.99 have a profit margin of 3.5 percent / checks of $25 and over have a profit of 1.8 percent)

3.) I don't know of any solutions that I would be allowed to implement

I am not being snarky :~) but if you know of a solution, I might consider being an owner again; until then I am cured of ownership.
 
#26 ·
You nailed it. What happened is we've spoiled a generation. They should be renamed the "entitled generation " as that fits far better than millennials. BloodMary loves his/her job but feels the pay should be better and "shouldn't have to worry about the rent". News flash, when an owner can no longer afford to pay the rent, the doors close and now that $12/hr. doesn't look quite as bad.
Whoa whoa whoa. First off, wanting to be able to make a livable wage does not make someone entitled. People rail against millenials all the time for being "entitled," or lazy, or flaky, etc. I've noticed some of these traits too. But I've also noticed those traits in baby boomers and gen-xers. I've met just as many lazy "old" cooks as I have lazy young cooks. Being a dirty, burned out, past 50 line cook is just as bad as being a lazy millenial.

Yes, millenials can be entitled as an aggregate, I agree...but painting with such a broad brush can be dangerous and disingenuous.

And if anyone in this thread thinks that cook's pay across the board isn't substandard then that's a huge problem.

I could make a /rant about entitled owners...who think it is OK to work their employees to the bone, work when they are sick, get called in on their days off, work off the clock, dock their pay...all for $8 an hour...and I could go on. And the carrot dangling at the end of all that hard work and sacrifice...what, an extra .25 an hour after 6mo? A year?

And I'm pretty sure BloodyMary's suggestion about "not having to worry about the rent" was not having to worry about HER rent (i.e. I can't make rent on my apartment this month cause I make $12 an hour) not the business's rent.

Anyways, this isn't a simple problem. There are a number of contributing factors to low wages beyond owners vs. cooks. A lot of it is societal..meaning the tipping system, immigration, and expectation of cheap food. Some of it is "tradition" based bias...i.e. "I had to start at the bottom and work my way up."

But again, lets not pretend that most cooks are appropriately compensated. I spent too much of my career cleaning my couch for gas money to make it to work, or juggling all my bills so I could still have a roof over my head.
On a similar note, I was reading an article the other day that stated that people who run businesses that can't pay a living wage to their workers are in serious trouble these days. They are being touted as a perfect example of entitlement and should be shut down.

All I can say is "wow."

So now businesses are being attacked because they should pay more (think McDonalds and $15.00 per hour wage)

What ever happened to get a second or third job to pay the bills and make end meet? No that can't happen....we have to make businesses pay out more even though the profit margin is so thin we will lose money paying the help more.

What the heck happened?
You don't think that businesses have an obligation to pay their workers fairly and at a livable wage? Again, this is a HUGE issue, but the Federal minimum wage is STAGGERINGLY outdated, and has no bearing on any type of livable wage in any part of the country. You simply can NOT live on $7.25 an hour. Many states try to mitigate this by increasing min wage a bit, but it does little to help.

And yes, a second or third(lol) job is an option, for some people. My argument would be that this is the United States of America, the greatest(?) country on earth, and if we need to tell people that they need 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet then that is a problem. That is also an ass backwards way of looking at it. We (as an industry) should be looking at solutions for ways for people to earn higher wages, not just working more hours at crap wages.

There are also ways to have more pay equity for FoH and BoH without affecting profit margin. The simplest is to add a service charge to the bill and then distribute the money among the employees. This model, unfortunately, has not really proven to be successful (outside of extreme high end dining) in this country, but it is an effective method.
 
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