bread does not rise properly

Discussion in 'Pastries & Baking' started by satimis, Oct 27, 2012.

  1. satimis

    satimis

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    Hi all,

    Based on following thread;
    http://www.carina-forum.com/ricette/bread/bread/0000040_en.php

    Modified recipe as follow:

    Ingredients:-

    75 g chestnut puree*
    225 g mineral water (substituted with water for cooking chestnut,86g + tap water, 110g)
    400 g wheat flour (substituted with plain floor)
    25 g rye flour (substituted with plain floor)
    1 tbsp beetroot molasses (omitted)
    7 g oat malt (substituted with honey)
    6 g fresh yeast (substituted with 3g instant yeast)
    1 tsp salt
    Pinch of nutmeg (1/2 tsp ground nutmeg)
    1 tbsp vegetable oil
    50 ml dry black currants (50x1.57=78.5g)
    50 ml black currant liquor (substituted with Scotch Whisky)

    150 ml milk, full cream, for cooking chestnut


    Steps performed
    ===============
    Following steps are performed manually:

    - Soak the black currants in Scotch Whisky for 1 hour (minimum)
    - * for the chestnut puree, cook the chestnuts with milk in pressure cooker at high pressure for 5 min and blend into a puree
    - Rub the yeast into honey, stir in a bit of water mixture and leave for 10 min. Pour in the rest of the water mixture and stir well


    Afterwards put all ingredients in the baking pan of the bread machine. Start "Basic Bread" cycle to bake the bread.
    Weight of bread selected 750g
    Crust selected medium

    kneading, 1st (slow) 3 min
    kneading, 2nd (fast) 31 min
    rise 1 - 26 min
    kneading, 3rd (fast) 15 sec
    rise 2 - 25 min
    kneading, 4th (fast) 15 sec
    rise 3 - 55 min
    Bake 50 min

    Photos:
    chestnut_bread_01
    http://ubuntuone.com/2C3RHmi38zGOTvtvIRlJhi

    chestnut_bread_02
    http://ubuntuone.com/1KGHHcQZpXh23GUB3Jn6hf


    I'm prepared to make another round.  Please shed me some light how to adjust the ingredient quantity?

    tap water to reduced by 20g ?
    instant year to be increased to 6g ?
    drain currants after soaking in whisky?

    Thank in advance

    B.R.
    satimis
     
     
  2. pcieluck

    pcieluck

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    instant yeast is obviously not as powerful as fresh yeast, not even close.  you've omitted molasses, therefor giving your yeast less food to cause rise, malts also feed yeasts longer than honey.  that rise time seems unnecessarily long.  when making bread in a small volume with instant yeast an initial rise, and one punch down is usually sufficient. your rise, as you stated, isn't right, so you clearly don't need to punch it down so many to keep it from falling flat.

    honest, i've never used a bread machine. I make a bread for 100+ customers every morning without the use of even an electric mixer so... there's a lot of steps happening out of yours hands that im unsure how to diagnose what else might be going wrong...

    I will always suggest too, whenever your bread isn't quite what you wanted, start trying to find a flour with higher protein or high-gluten.  HG flour is really an unfair advantage that bakeries have, and so is fresh yeast.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  3. satimis

    satimis

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    Hi pcieluck,

    Thanks for your advice.  I already sorted out the problem by increasing yeast.

    I heard "sourdough starters"-"no knead bread" quite sometimes but never having a chance to test it.  Because I don't have a baking oven, only a microwave oven.  If I can sort out the space problem in my kitchen I'll get a "Microwave/Baking" oven.  I already have done some home work on its selection.  I found a Panasonic model with steam inject.  Or dump my Panasonic microwave oven to get space.

    The convenience for using a bread machine at home is:
    Put all ingredients in the machine, set the time and program and next morning you'll have fresh baked bread for breakfast.
     
  4. mtbfan101

    mtbfan101

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    Satimis,

    I may have missed it in your post, but how is it that your bread is not rising properly? Not doubling in size? Not rising at all? Being that I am American, I have difficulties conceptualizing how much 3 grams looks like, so it might be that you didn't have enough instant yeast. Though it is true that fresh yeast have a lot higher cell count than instant, the latter is still upwards of 25% more viable than active dry yeast(which I've never had an issue with), and actually unless you know for certain how old your fresh yeast is, it's not really worth getting as a home baker because it generally only has a shelf life of about 2 to 3 weeks(according to Peter Reinhart).

    Perhaps you could make a "sponge" with 2 tsp of instant yeast, 1/2 cup of flour and 1/2 cup of milk? I also agree with pcieluck in regards to flour. Getting yourself some nice high gluten flour is much better. I really like King Arthur's Unbleached Bread Flour. Bread flour is typically much higher in gluten, and ever since I made the change, I've had much better results!

    Keep us posted,

    Pat
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2012
  5. satimis

    satimis

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    Hi Pat,

    Thanks for your advice.

    It is only the problem adjusting the quantity of yeast used.

    Up to right I have no problem making sponge cake using the egg white foam method without adding yeast nor any chemical. I use the bake-only program on bread machine baking the cake.

    I can't sort out the problem making Ciabatta bread on bread machine. I suppose it is not the right equipment making such kind of bread. I can use the bread machine baking different kind of breads also making jams.

    B.R.
    satimis