boiling water start, hard boiled eggs

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it's a really bad, incomplete, inaccurate article.

the site is selling pressure cookers.
if the only tool you have at your disposal is a hammer, _everything_ looks like a nail.

1 - the dude has never heard of the membrane on a egg
2 - the dude has not the first clue of what affects the color of the yolk
3 - "...musty 7-10 day old " - really?  the dude needs a clue
4 - "online previews" / Modernist Cuisine - go to the references, search for the word "egg" - "NOT FOUND" - really good resource.
5 - "Pressure steaming an egg at higher pressure, will result in the cracking of the shell prematurely, causing the whites to ooze out and be immediately cooked as they exit the shell . . . " - really?  you put an egg - the interior of which is at atmospheric pressure into a pressure cooker - the environment of which is higher that atmospheric pressure, it cracks, and the whites, from the low pressure egg interior, ooze out into the higher pressure area . . . the dude needs to work on his physics - things do not "ooze" from a low pressure area to a high pressure area.
6 - "open the pressure cooker and place the eggs under cold running water..." - this is why they peel cleanly.  you can boil them, steam them, nuke the, bake them, set-in-sun them, it's the chill shock that condenses internal moisture between the coagulated whites and membrane (the dude does not know there's a membrane there....) that results in the clean peel.
7 - ..."inflating it and separating the white from the shell." - really?  the due does not understand basic physics, the basic construction of an egg, nor what/where/who/how/why the "air pocket" gets bigger, what make the whites 'stand taller' - etc and et al.

the dude is not doing food science - the dude is doing food "let me sell you a pressure cooker" mysticism.
What the hell are you talking about?
 
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Oh wow, i didn't mean to start a major fight. 

just wanted some times, 

Theory aside, if either of you have actually done it in the pressure cooker, empirical observation is what verifies (or better,  falsifies) the theory and its derivative empirical hypotheses. 

In either case, for personal convenience (the pot takes up less space, the pot is easier to get at than my pressure cooker) i'm interested in the hot water method, and am not so interested in perfect accuracy, but in a reasonably consistent result, neither too green, nor too goopy.  I don;t have a restaurant. 
 
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The eggs done in a preassure cooker - the time starts when it is up to preassure.



You set the eggs on a steamer rack so they aren't touching the water... the water boils, the eggs remain cool.  Preassure seals the unit and within half a minute the entire pot is 15psi and 250F... 



6 minutes later give or take a minute depending on your size of eggs and desired level of doneness and you are finished.



Here is a good article with pictures that walks thru the process.  (you don't need the improvised little cups... a regular steamer basket works great.


http://www.hippressurecooking.com/cracked-soft-medium-and-hard-boiled-eggs-in-the-pressure-cooker/

I have used this exact method many times using 5-6 min and pressure with 5-6 cool down and it works very well
 
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I heartily agree that heating an entire oven for just a few hard-cooked eggs is overkill and wasteful.

However, it's possible to use a mini-muffin tin and a counter-top sized oven for as few as two eggs. Otherwise, the method is best for a large number of eggs. I use it when I'm making a dozen or more, usually 18 eggs, for egg salad for a crowd. The cooking is easier, but even better, the peeling is far easier and less frustrating for this home cook. 
 
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Waste of energy, boil a pot of water add eggs bring back to boil turn off heat, leave covered for 15 minutes then chill, perfect every time if for salad or sandwich mix, Matthew.
 
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Waste of energy, boil a pot of water add eggs bring back to boil turn off heat, leave covered for 15 minutes then chill, perfect every time if for salad or sandwich mix, Matthew.
so we have ten minutes, eleven minutes and fifteen minutes. 

i guess either you all use different sized eggs or there's a large margin of error/img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif
 
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You forgot my 13 minutes Siduri. Now i'm deeply offended. 

Of course, an invitation to spend a week in Rome can cure all offenses... ehem...

Nah. Seriously. Get 6 eggs, your usual sized eggs. Get a pot big enough, your usual pot. Boil the water, your water. Put the eggs in the pot. Close the stove. Pick up the first egg at 9 minutes and chill out, the second at 10 minutes, etc. etc. and see which one you like the more. No theory will help you more than a pragmatic experiment like this, with your eggs, your water, your pot and your own timing because the variables are too many.
 
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Oh no, Ordo, my friend!  I KNEW i was going to forget one.  I just didn;t feel like re-reading them all over again when i replied.  Next time i'll do just that.  Why didn't i think of pulling them out at one minute intervals - i'm usually good at that sort of thinking, but somehow i thought i'd have to do the whole batch several times to find out.  Maybe because the heat dulls my brain.  /img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif

The medium sized eggs i did at 11minutes  were good for eating like that, but could have used a minute or more for egg salad or stuffed eggs..
 
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I heartily agree that heating an entire oven for just a few hard-cooked eggs is overkill and wasteful.

However, it's possible to use a mini-muffin tin and a counter-top sized oven for as few as two eggs. Otherwise, the method is best for a large number of eggs. I use it when I'm making a dozen or more, usually 18 eggs, for egg salad for a crowd. The cooking is easier, but even better, the peeling is far easier and less frustrating for this home cook. 
Sorry everyone is being so mean about the use of the oven.  I use the oven to warm up a slice of left over pizza and think nothing of it.  /img/vbsmilies/smilies/peace.gif

Siduri, you're looking for exact minutes?  That's up to you.  You can't go wrong with the 12min mark for fully cooked yolks.  It gets tricky if you want a different kind of yolk.  Sometimes I want a 6min egg, and I follow the same procedure every time and guess what.... I get a different result every time.  You can get as scientific as you want, but it's not an exact science.
 
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Thanks Koukou, but no, i wasn't looking for exact times, just an idea, knowing as i do about all the variables.  In fact i was a bit secretly gloating over the lack of precision that is inherent in all cooking .  But really, i had no idea if i needed 6 minutes or 20, so a range of  ten to 15 is pretty good. 
 
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To confuse it even more I use the cold water start bring to a boil cover and let sit for 20 minutes, yes 20. Eggs come out perfect, no green ring etc.
 
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Try just a single egg in your pressure cooker ... the difference in peeling will be amazing.
 
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To confuse it even more I use the cold water start bring to a boil cover and let sit for 20 minutes, yes 20. Eggs come out perfect, no green ring etc.
Yeah, i know that method, it's the one in every cookbook and all over the internet.  But the reason i started this thread is that it requires you to hover over the water to know the exact time it begins to boil.  Whenever i've tried it, and have gone to do one of the hundred other things to do when it's time to eat, I go back and find it boiling happily away, with no idea how long it's been doing that.  But no way i will sit around watching water boil. 

How do you know when it's started boiling?  Do you stand over it and watch?  I'm usually chopping onions, washing greens or checking email  /img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif
 
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I cheat, if it looks like it is about to boil I turn off the heat and put the lid on.
 

dillbert

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>>no way i will sit around watching water boil.

which is why you need to ditch the whole concept.

boil some water.  maketh no difference if it's been boiling for 1 second or 1 hour.

lower the eggs in, set the timer.

it will take you a minor bit of experimenting to know that lowering in 3 eggs is a one minute return to boil, lowering in three dozen eggs is a seven minute return to boil - but mebethet you can master that.

then there's the "time-at-a-boil-until-perfect" - egg size and starting egg temps are the only variables.  easy to master.

and that's why all the Granny-Science fails in real life - too many variables for the 128 character Tweet . . .
 
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>>no way i will sit around watching water boil.

which is why you need to ditch the whole concept.

boil some water.  maketh no difference if it's been boiling for 1 second or 1 hour.

lower the eggs in, set the timer.

it will take you a minor bit of experimenting to know that lowering in 3 eggs is a one minute return to boil, lowering in three dozen eggs is a seven minute return to boil - but mebethet you can master that.

then there's the "time-at-a-boil-until-perfect" - egg size and starting egg temps are the only variables.  easy to master.

and that's why all the Granny-Science fails in real life - too many variables for the 128 character Tweet . . .
not sure where you're coming from Dilbert, but maybe you didn't read my first post.  I said that IS the way i do it, i just wanted to know the times, since i don;t feel like experimenting with perfectly good eggs and i have a whole lot of people here who certainly have experimented and who can give me a rough rule of thumb for the boiling-start egg cook.  I don;t understand why pretty much all cookbooks and all websites seem to say start with cold water.  It never made any sense to me.  I may be a granny but i have two jobs and do all my own cooking.  No time to watch water boil. 

Science begins with observation, and contrary to what they believed in the Renaissance, ANYBODY can observe*.  Theories and explanatory hypotheses begin from observation, and their verification (or falsification) process ends in observation too.  There is no Granny-science, but just science and observation.  But i AM too old to tweet - reality is too complex for 128 characters/img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif

______________________

* see Steven Jay Gould's The hedgehog, the fox and the magister's pox for what i'm referring to - In the Renaissance they thought if you were smart and an ancient man (e.g. Aristotle) you must have been right, and that there is no need for individual observation - that's the mentality Galileo was up against, not, as most think, the medieval mentality, but the renaissance mentality.   Here's to Galileo and dropping stones from the tower of Pisa, in front of the other professors of the University of Pisa who were reading to their students from Aristotle that the heavy rock will fall faster, and to Galileo's young assistant yelling "same time" from below to the chagrin of the professors.
 

dillbert

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the underlined "question is" is msg #1 I read as

bring to a boil and turn off the gas and let sit.

that's not the method I'm talking about - as you see, there's a lot of different minute periods suggested....

and there's a long list of perfectly good reasons why one person's timing is different from another.

I bring the water to a boil, pierce the big end, put the eggs in, and do not turn off the gas/heat - after recovery from the chill shock the pot continues at a soft boil for the whole "cooking time" - when the timer rings, dump the boiling water, refill with cold water & ice cubes - the ice water shock is the bit to make them peel easy - but it also stops the cooking much faster than letting them sit in ex-boiling water - and how fast that water cools in another variable.

once you 'learn' the cooking time 'at the boil' for

the egg size and

starting egg temperature and

your preference as to 'how hard is hard boiled' -

the other 'variable' is how long it takes your pot of water to come back up to a boil after the cold shock to the water of putting in the eggs.

for me I like 15 minutes at the boil - I have "learned" that using my usual pot and 2-3 eggs, the 'recovery to a boil time' is about 45 seconds.  so, water boiling, eggs direct out of fridge, pierced, into boiling water, set timer for 16 minutes.  perfect every time. eggs into ice water chill shock when the timer rings.

for holidays, we do deviled eggs - a dozen in a batch.  bigger pot, sames method, and I know it's going to take 4 minutes for the water to come back to a boil - timer is set for 19 minutes.

I'm not talking down Granny Science - it's good stuff - however a lot of it does not work in different kitchens because of the variations in (so many things.)  my Grandmother cooked on two huge coal fired stoves - she would not let anyone "stoke" her stoves because she had her own way of creating super-hot to less-hot 'zones' on the cook tops.  gas is quicker.....turn the knob....
 

dillbert

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>>chaotic

uhmmm, must be misunderstanding something.

I'm an at home cook.  I do not cook/prepare the same thing everyday, a hundred times a day.

if one works at IHOP, I'd bet one would learn when to flip a pancake or pull a waffle in one's sleep.....

if you're a broiler cook in a steak house, no problem you've learned how to sense "done"

if one is cooking stuff at 500-700'F - timing is everything - well, other than starting over.

but that's not my case.  and there's little worse than having a house full of company / guests and suddenly discovering:

the meat is bloody

the meat is burnt

the biscuits didn't rise

the pasta is still hard

the salmon could pass for orange granite

Mr. Green Bean is limp

I'm really not against learning how to do things with my kitchen and my pots and my stove and dag-gum-it, making a note of what works best so I can repeat it next month / quarter / year.

so for me chaos is _not_ a good thing. 

which is why I went to weighing things

half a cup of rice - at least as my dear wife pours / measures it - varies by weight more than 20%

- so 'zactly how much water I need?  - low end rice + high end water, risotto - not pilaf....

yes, I also weigh the water . . .

bread baking - questions?

>>so for me chaos is _not_ a good thing

aahh nuts.

baking is a science

cooking is an art

and yes - the seasonings / flavor combinations of 'stuff'  I do chaotically vary just so it's not exactly the same time after time.

but for example I do know that 15 minutes of an egg boil works best for me

I do know that 20 minutes at a boil makes green yolk rings in my world

I do know 13 minutes at a boil makes for too soft yolks in my world.

your world may differ - but differences are not chaos - chaos is uncontrolled.
 
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Time for an experiment under controlled parameters.


For misterious reasons beyond my comprehensibility, egg number 4 is still simmering.
 
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