I didn't know that PETA was a real association, I just thought it was a joke, that's why I'm took the signature. I can't open the posted link, but could you please tell me more about this group, are they anything like green peace ??.
I'm sick of them, the environmentalists, the anti-gun lobby. Ph*que 'em all. Otherwise I'd have a small practice in Lone Pine, California. Those groups are responsible for the deifcit of jobs plaguing that state. ...bunch of trust fund hippies. Grrrrr.
No, coolj they aren't. I liken each member to a Sith Lord of the Dark Side. I'd much rather join your organization: People Eating Tasty Animals. Now there's something to be proud of!
They're a conglomerate of misguided anomalies that have plagued mankind for too long.
They are a direct threat to us all, especially the culinarians. Purveyors of fine cuisine that include animal flesh. I take great offense to ANY organization that threatens my bank account. F**k 'em all.......................
The problem with these PETA is that they are so fanatical. I have agreed with with some of their issues in the past, but their fanaticism makes most of their platforms just a bunch of rantings and ravings. Any time a group becomes fanatical they make themselves and their cause seem all that more stupid and insignificant, whether it is the fundamental right, fundamenal christians, the Islamic Jihad or any such group that takes their message to the extreme.
Do I feel that some of our farming practices are cruel to animals? Yes. do I feel that using animals to experiment on, in certain cases, is wrong? Yes. Would I ever throw my hat in with the likes of PETA? Maybe when **** freezes over!!! PETA loves to criticize, but they often don't offer viable solutions other than for the entire world to become tree-hugging vegans.
I think its important to acknowledge the role that we as people living in the culinary world play in livestock production and conditions. Buy locally. Know your growers, your distributors, etc. When you hear of something that seems unethical, do your part. Don't buy Chilean Sea Bass if you hear its going extinct. Etc.
I do feel PETA is extreme, but they also don't make up the facts. Some people aren't bothered by animals being treated with inhumane conditions. Like my friend says, well, they aren't human, are they? It just depends what your attitude toward them is.
My friend Melody is a vet student. To learn surgeries, they do practice surgeries on animals. The PETA people protest and ended up getting their major animal resource taken away. But would you want a vet to do a surgery on YOUR animal if they'd only read about in books first? Probably not. She has had to endure people spitting on her as she walks to class, which is disgusting.
Yes, I am a vegetarian. But also proudly not a member of PETA. I think as long as I use dead animal and plant bodies to drive down the road (its called OIL people, and I think PETA people still drive) and dead trees to live under, I will have to acknowledge that we also use dead animals to live on and to keep us warm.
I could quote a lot of statistics, but that's beside the point. People assume sometimes that since I am a vegetarian I am a PETAhead. I've also had the assumption made that since I believe in God that I am a fanatical right-wing hide-in-my-basement and kill-abortion-doctors person, which woudl also be incorrect.
Having a conviction is different from being a fanatic. Leave room for others around you with different beliefs and convictions, and you'll do just fine!!
I couldn't agree more with what's been said so far and in many cases very eloquently. Makes me proud to be a member of the group, because normally, as Groucho said "I wouldn't want to be part of any group that would have me as a member"!
Well said people!
Right On!, Shimmer. You stated your case beautifully and I agree with you.
Someone once told me they felt that groups like PETA and Greenpeace serve the very useful function of garnering public attention to relevent issues. They carve the way for other groups with more political and scientific clout and credibility (such as the Nature Conservancy) to do the quiet, but necessary work of protecting and securing our natural resources.
While I do eat some meat (necessary for me to prevent persistent anemia) and wear leather shoes, I also speak out about the brutality and ostentatiousness of wearing fur and consuming foie gras. While I believe it's a necessary evil to kill animals for food, I also believe it's unnecessary to torture them to do so.
One doesn't need to lie to distort the truth. Many times it is all in how you say something, or facts that you chose to omit. I trust very little of what PETA has to say. They, like so many fanatics love to only believe the theories, statistics, etc. thay support what they believe, and are very quick to condemn findings that oppose their views. Thus much of what they write is very one-sided, and only based, often times, on partial fact.
As for PETA fabricating evidence, I remember a case that went to court 10-12 years ago, regarding the use of monkeys for entertainment. They had fabricated evidence that steel pipes were used to beat them, which was later proven to be untrue. PETA claimed that the only way to really prove abuse was to peel back the skin of the monkies to see evidence of bruising, which the court denied them. Ironic, isn't it? They lost and the 'trust fund hippies' had to pay a few mils. I'm sure it was appealed and probably dragged on for a few years but I lost interest....
PETA, has also been known to donate funds to FBI-declared domestic terrorist group such as the Earth Liberation Front. If it's credibility they're looking for, that's just not the way to get it....
Okay, I managed to open the posted links to PETA and the KFC stuff. I really don't believe all this stuff about the chickens being treated inhumanely. A big thank you for bring this info to my attention.
I think that in the production of meat (and poultry in particular) there is undeniably some cruelty involved. We consume such massive quantities that to think otherwise is being unrealistc. I have seen battery hens crammed into tiered cages and fed a diet of chemicals to promote the production of eggs. They spend their entire productive lives in that condition. But I still eat eggs without a second thought. I love foi gras, and so on.
The bottom line is, people are cruel to animals whether consiouslly, deliberately or not. Most of us are indifferent to it and some protest by not eating meat. Not me. I am a full, card carrying carnivor. I trust that with modern practices the meat I consume is sustanably farmed and the animal is treated humanely.
The fact of the matter is, we are at the top of the food chain. A lion or an eagle doesn't stop to ponder the ethics of eating their prey alive. They need to sustain themselves just as we do.
I abhor wanton or gratuitous cruelty. However, it is the chicken's lot in life to provide me with sustenance. I don't question that any more than the lion or the eagle does.
As for PETA, they are out of touch with reality.
Confinement farms are horrific. I had the guts to ask for a tour when I was on a state dept of ag task force trip....CoolJ it is real.
Chickens are debeaked so they won't peck their neighbors...I'm not great with computers but check and see if National Geographic articles on it from a couple of years ago aren't accessable.
Hog farms....pigs are put into small stalls and they get bored and chew on their neighbors, so tails are removed. Their spaces are tiny and dark and on cement. It is a horrible exstense. Many animals are shot up with anibiotics or fed them so that they won't get a disease wiping out the lot of them.
Turkeys are so inbred that they cannot breed on their own....they also are so immune deficient humans are required to suit up before going into their barn.
*I eat eggs, I eat meat....I just buy as much as I can from farmers that raise animals humanely...let them touch the ground and have suficent space....not automatically fed antibiotics. I buy cage-free, anitbiotic hormone free eggs at the "regular grocery" and pay $2.39 a dz. So about a buck more...
Meat, I buy pork, lamb and some beef from farms I visit...people I know are treating them right.
I've seen it with my own eyes....I've talked to alot of people that are farming many different ways. PETA is extremist, alot of us that are not members are VERY concerned about the food system. I'm sure several years of my rants are in the archives....
Shroomgirl, I agree with you. There is a lot of cruelty in the way much of our meat is raised. I applude you for purchasing as much of your animal products from smaller farms that don't practice confinement farming, but I don't think that that is an available option for feeding the masses. I don't believe that we have the land or the resources for all of our meat and dairy products to be produced that way. It also ups the cost of such products considerably. Something I don't think the general public would stand for. Until this country (and I have to include myself in this as I am as guilty as most everyone) decide to change our consumption habits, what is a viable alternative to such farming practices? I am willing to pay more, per pound, for free-range chicken, or yard-kept pork, but I don't think many people feel the same way. The type of farming you are talking about is getting more and more expensive, yet small time farmers can't get the prices they need because of the big corporate, confinement farms, and the prices that they can sell their meat for. And once again, herein lies my big problem with PETA. They are more than happy to point out the errors of our ways, yet, not once, have I ever seen them offer up some sort of solution other than for the world to give up leather, fur, meat, eggs and dairy.
I'd guess that the vast majority of people who eat animal products have no earthly idea of how the animals are treated. If asked where chickens come from many would say, the meat counter at Safeway.
And for those who are aware on some level, it becomes a matter of, Out of Sight - Out of Mind.
These concerns do not even touch the problem of the environmental impact of such large factory farms.
The hog waste lagoons in NC are severely polluting the rivers and estuaries that flow through the coastal areas and into the sounds and oceans. This severly harms marine habitat. All is takes is a heavy rain (remember hurricanes Fran and Floyd?) and the lagoons burst.
Can you imagine the smell from these lagoons if your property borders one of these farms. Definately enough to put you off your food.
Pete, I think I illuded to the past raves.....our tax dollars are financing in many ways industrial farming....check out the latest farm bill....as FNF said environmental clean up, tax insentives for Japanese industrialists to put up a monstrous barn....It is so much deeper and bigger than just buying from a small local farmer. You are paying in many ways. Many are claiming antibiotics in meats are decreasing resistance and adding new strains of disease to consumers.
So, consider the environment, our health, tax dollars,foreign countries that are shipping in cheap foods (Argentian meats),
our foods that are warpping the 3rd world.
Many of us believe that sustainable farming is a viable solution to feeding the world. Think of all the food produced, then all the waste. Shoot just check any restaurant to see what is pitched.
I'm kinda foggy tonight, been working on contracts all day and just am not all here, hope this made alittle sense.
I am in total agreement with you shroom. My point is, that I feel for sustainable agriculture to work, there needs to be a major shift in the consumption habits of the modern, industrial world, and mostly in the US. As for the fact that we are paying in many ways, I understand that, but I wonder if the vast majority of the people do? They don't understand that they pay one way or another, all they see is the price tag at the market.