after cooling the top surface of cake shrinked

Discussion in 'Pastries & Baking' started by satimis, Nov 11, 2015.

  1. satimis

    satimis

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    Hi all,

    After baking a smooth dome was formed on top.  But after cooling the top surface shrinked as shown on photo.  The cake is super soft with nice texture

    Ingredients:

    I)
    60g      butter, melted
    80g      cake flour (plus 1-1/2 tsp baking powder.  Sift)
    80ml     skim milk
    1 egg + 5 egg yolks

    II)
    5 egg whites
    75g        sugar
    pinch of salt
    1/2 tsp    cream of tartar

    Direction
    1.  Preheat oven at 170 deg C for 15 mins.

    2.  Beat 1 egg + 5 yolks until creamy with pale yellow colour & fluffy on high speed for a few minutes or until it double its original volume. Add in flour & alternate it with milk. Add in melted butter and mix well. Set aside.

    3.  Beat egg whites on high speed until white & frothy for about 40 sec – 1 min. Add in salt, cream of tartar and sugar, a bit at a time. Beat for about 2 mins until it's stiff & thick foamy. Once mixture clings & does not drip, it is ready.

    4.  Fold 1/3 whites with egg yolk batter with a spatula till well combined. Take another 1/3 egg whites, repeat the same step. And same for the last 1/3 egg white.

    5.  Pour batter into fully lined baking pan. Give the pan a few good shakes to remove air.

    6.  Bake a preheated oven 170 deg C for 10mins, then reduce heat to 150 deg C for another 20 min and done tested with cake tester.

    8.  Place the cake on a wire rack to cool completely, remove baking paper.

    Please advise how to fix the problem.  Thanks

    Regards
    satimis

     
  2. phatch

    phatch Moderator Staff Member

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    What's your elevation?
     
  3. satimis

    satimis

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    Hi,

    About 1 inch.  The cake batter is about 3 inches high.  A smooth dome was formed after baking.  It shrank after cooling.

    The cake is cotton soft with nice taste

    satimis
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2015
  4. phatch

    phatch Moderator Staff Member

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    No, I mean where you live and cook, how high are you above sea level. Higher elevation baking is a tricky thing. i live about 5000 feet above sea level and there are things the elevation effects. 
     
  5. satimis

    satimis

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    Along seashore at about 15' above sea level.
     
  6. berndy

    berndy

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    Did you cool the cake in the refrigerator ?  Cooling it too fast could be the cause .
     
  7. fablesable

    fablesable

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    Your order of direction is backwards and there are a few extra things to take into consideration.

    Your recipe should read like this:

    I)
    5 egg whites
    75g        sugar
    pinch of salt
    1/2 tsp    cream of tartar

    II)
    60g      butter, melted
    80g      cake flour (plus 1-1/2 tsp baking powder.  Sift)
    80ml     skim milk
    1 egg + 5 egg yolks

    Then your direction should be as follows:

    Direction
    1.  Preheat oven at 170 deg C. Always preheat well in advance of baking so that oven is at optimal temp. The '15 mins' part in the previous direction is redundant.

    2.  Beat egg whites on high speed until white & frothy for about 40 sec – 1 min. Add in salt, cream of tartar and sugar, a bit at a time. Beat for about 2 mins until it's stiff & thick foamy. Once mixture clings & does not drip, it is ready. Set aside.

    3.  Beat 1 egg + 5 yolks until creamy with pale yellow colour & fluffy on high speed for a few minutes. Add in flour & alternate it with milk. Add in melted butter and mix well. 

    4.  Fold 1/3 whites with egg yolk batter with a spatula until JUST combined. Take another 1/3 egg whites, repeat the same step. And same for the last 1/3 egg white.

    5.  Pour batter into fully lined baking pan. 

    6.  Bake a preheated oven 170 deg C for 10mins, then reduce heat to 150 deg C for another 20 min and done. DO NOT OPEN OVEN UNTIL ALL TIME (full 30mins) IS DONE. 

    8.  Place the cake on a wire rack to cool completely, remove baking paper.

    Okay so this cake is a VERY delicate cake and any extra fuss you put into it will make it do just what it did. So here is the main things to take into consideration:

    1) Do not open the oven at any time when baking for the full 30 mins. When it says to check doneness do not poke it with anything, it will be about bounce back when slightly pressed from the top of the cake. 

    2) Get an oven thermometer to ensure your oven is at the correct temperature as all ovens tend to be out slightly. This will effect baking time and your finished product. If your temp is correct then your cake should be ready at exactly 30 mins.

    3) Do not over mix. You are over mixing the eggs and getting WAAAAY too much air in them so it ends up collapsing.

    4) Your collapse is also due to the fact that you should not mix your ingredients with the leavening (baking powder) and then set aside while waiting for other things to mix as the leavening will react with the wet ingredients straight away and then by the time you have mixed it all and are baking it, the leavening ability is gone. This is why I have restructured your ingredient use and technique.

    Try this complete restructure and see how you do. Let us know how it turns out /img/vbsmilies/smilies/wink.gif
     
  8. satimis

    satimis

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    No.  Cooled the cake in room temperature.

    satimis
     
  9. satimis

    satimis

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    Hi,

    Thanks for your advice.

    The origin receipt does not call for baking powder nor cream of tartar.  I just added them.  Later in my search on Internet discovered that it may be a problem.  The air on beating egg white causes the rise.  If adding baking powder the cake will double rise.  Shall I leave out the baking powder and cream of tartar?
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2015
  10. fablesable

    fablesable

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    Yes most definitely if the original recipe does not call for it then do not add the baking powder and cream of tartar as it is the duty of the eggs to do the leavening work. I would then retract what I have said and make the recipe as it stands in the original form. I did wonder about that as it did seem a little overdone on the leavening. The way baking is done is first try the original recipe as is to determine what the ultimate outcome is supposed to look like, taste and feel. Then, and ONLY THEN, do you adjust according to baking ratios and ingredient used. So if it is just eggs for leavening then leave be, if it is full fat milk instead of skim milk then leave be. Do not play with a recipe that you do not know. Baking is a science not an art. Every ingredient has its reasonings along with the technique. Delete or add ingredients just because will change the outcome drastically. 

    So give the original recipe a whirl first as is then let us know how it turns out and if you wish to change the outcome. We can help you from there /img/vbsmilies/smilies/wink.gif
     
  11. satimis

    satimis

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    Thanks for your advice.

    I followed the origin recipes except adding baking powder and cream of tartar including the baking temperature and baking time.

    Regarding sugar the origin recipes calls for 120g and I reduce it to 75g as I expect the sponge cake less sweet.  Besides it calls for 80ml milk but without indicating skim or whole milk

    satimis
     
  12. fablesable

    fablesable

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    Like I have stated, do NOT change the recipe AT ALL until you have made the original recipe just once to see what the outcome is. THERE IS A SPECIFIC REASON FOR ALL THE INGREDIENTS AND THEIR APPROPRIATE AMOUNTS. I say this in capitol letters as I cannot express how crucial it is to leave a recipe the way it is unless you are trained in the science of baking. 

    If you take 45g of sugar away then there must be something to replace what you have taken away. When a recipe says MILK then that means regular milk (which is 2% or standard milk, all depending on where you are from) or it would have stated skim milk. The fat content is important. 

    @satimis  From what you have stated you HAVE NOT followed the original recipe AT ALL. You added ingredients that did not need to be there and used less of the ingredients that needed to be there and then expected a proper outcome. If you want a less sweet cake then look for a recipe that has a less sweet cake, don't take a recipe, not follow it exact and expect the outcome to be as they say it would. Again, BAKING IS A SCIENCE. 

    There are some great books out there that teach the fundamentals of baking that explain why you do what you do in baking and how each ingredient is utilized. Search this great site up at the top you can see a tab for reviews and there are loads of reviews from all of us about what books are the best for what type of learning you wish to do. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif
     
  13. satimis

    satimis

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    Hi all,

    Have another round adding ingredients in following order. Ingredients quantity is same as original recipe except sugar 75g instead of 120g

    I)
    5 egg whites
    75g sugar
    pinch of salt

    II)
    60g butter, melted
    80g cake flour
    80ml skim milk
    1 egg + 5 egg yolks

    Steps performed

    i)
    1. Preheat oven at 170 deg C monitored with an oven thermometer.

    2. Beat egg + 5 egg yolks at high speed until it changes to pale yellow in color and put aside.

    3. Mixed melt butter, cake flour, skim milk and finally the beaten egg yolks

    II)

    Beat egg whites at high speed until white & frothy. Add in salt and sugar, a bit at a time. Beat until it's stiff & thick foamy.

    III)

    Fold 1/3 whites with egg yolk batter with a spatula until just combined. Take another 1/3 egg whites, repeat the same step. And same for the last 1/3 egg white.

    IV)

    Pour batter into fully lined baking pan.

    V)

    Bake the cake in a preheated oven at 170 deg C for 10 mins, then reduce heat to 150 deg C for another 30 min and done without open the door of the oven.

    VI)
    Place the cake on a wire rack to cool at room temperature.

    After baking finished a smooth dome was formed on top. At cooking it cracked and fell.

    The cake texture is NOT so good compared to previous baking result. The cake is cotton soft but dense.

    satimis


     
  14. panini

    panini

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    @satimis  ,

    Baking is frustrating at times. Your cake looks a little pale to me. Make sure the temperature in your oven is correct. Check it with an oven thermometer.

    Also, egg white can't touch any type of grease. So don't whip them in a plastic bowl. The plastic is porous and can retain oils from previous items. Make sure

    the bowl you whip in is completely clean and dry. Let your whites set out for a while to almost room temperature. Don't grease or spray your tube pan, that

    also needs to be clean and dry.

    Just some tips, you may already know. Doesn't hurt to mention though.
     
    flipflopgirl likes this.
  15. flipflopgirl

    flipflopgirl

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    Pray tell WHY (after all of the great advice from @Fablesable  ) are you continuing to short the sugar content?

    Anyway.....

    Try inverting the pan on a bottle to cool.

    Looks like the weight of the cake smooshed out all of the air trapped within the batter (you may be folding with a heavy hand as well).

    If you still have problems move on to a different recipe (and follow it EXACTLY) as you are just throwing good money after bad.

    If the new recipe is still a disappointment then you might wanna just buy your sponge/angel food cakes.

    Like macarons some people just cannot pull off every type of baked product (IMO).

    Not trying to be a mean girl..... /img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif  just dispensing a bit of tough love.

    mimi
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2015
  16. flipflopgirl

    flipflopgirl

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    pan..... what do you think about the melted butter?

    Could that be a problem?

    mimi
     
  17. fablesable

    fablesable

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    Thank you so much you guys for taking the time to help @satimis. I was on the verge of a 'smacking my forehead and shaking my head' moment so I could not answer back without losing it. I really dislike taking the time out to explain to people to only have them turn around and completely disregard EVERYTHING you just took the time to type out for THEM.....OY!

    Here is why sugar is important in recipes that call for it. Taken from Fine Cooking website:

    Just to be clear, I’m talking about the kind of sugar we use most in baking: the dry, crystalline sugars that are collectively referred to as table sugar. (It comes in several forms, such as granulated, brown, powdered, and turbinado.) When you understand how this ingredient behaves in recipes, you’ll be on your way to becoming a better baker, because many baking disasters can be traced to one little mistake: tinkering with sugar. Using less (or more) sugar than a recipe calls for (or even substituting honey for table sugar) can really affect your results.

    Sugar stabilizes meringues

    Whip egg whites with sugar and what do you get? Meringue. More than just a fluffy, white pie topping, meringue gives lightness and loft to mousses, sweet soufflés, angel food cakes, and even some frostings.

    Sugar stabilizes meringue in two ways. First, it protects the egg whites from being overbeaten. As you whip air into egg whites, the egg proteins bond and form thin, strong sheets that stretch around the tiny air bubbles, creating foam. Adding sugar slows down this foaming, so you’re less likely to overbeat the egg whites.

    Second, sugar protects the foam from collapse. The sugar dissolves in the water in the bubbles’ walls, forming a syrup that surrounds and supports the bubbles.

    Sugar affects texture

    When sugar molecules meet water molecules, they form a strong bond. This union of sugar and water affects the texture of baked goods in two important ways.

    It keeps baked goods soft and moist.  The bond between sugar and water allows sugar to lock in moisture so that items such as cakes, muffins, brownies, and frostings don’t dry out too quickly.

    It creates tenderness.  Baked goods get their shape and structure from proteins and starches, which firm up during baking and transform soupy batters and soft doughs into lofty muffins and well-formed cookies. But because they build structure, proteins and starches can potentially make baked goods tough, too. The sugar in a batter or dough snatches water away from proteins and starches, which helps control the amount of structure-building they can do. The result? A more tender treat.

    It is here that tinkering with a recipe’s sugar can have a dramatic effect. When, for example, a loaf of pound cake has a nice shape and an appealing texture, the sugar, proteins, and starches are in balance. But if you tip that balance by using more or less sugar than the recipe calls for, the result could be so tender that it lacks the structure to hold its shape, or it could be shapely but too tough.

    It’s best to dust moist cakes with confectioners’ sugar right before serving, because over time the sugar will attract even more moisture and become sticky.

    Sugar leavens

    No doubt you’ve noticed that cake and quick bread batters rise during baking. Well, sugar helps make this happen.When you mix up a cake batter and beat sugar into fat, eggs, and other liquid ingredients, the sugar crystals cut into the mixture, creating thousands of tiny air bubbles that lighten the batter. During baking, these bubbles expand and lift the batter, causing it to rise in the pan.

    Sugar deepens colour and flavour

    Thank sugar for the appealing golden-brown color of many baked desserts. As sugar gets hot, it undergoes a cascade of chemical reactions called caramelization. In this process, sugar molecules break down into smaller and smaller parts and begin to turn deeper shades of brown and develop more complex flavors.

    Sugar adds crunch

    In the heat of the oven, moisture evaporates from the surface of baked goods, allowing dissolved sugars to re-crystallize. This creates the crunchy, sweet crust that you’ve probably enjoyed on such items as brownies, pound cakes, and some kinds of muffins and cookies.

    In conclusion, find another recipe to use that has already been adjusted for less sugar or make the original recipe you have as is. Hope this explains it better!
     
  18. flipflopgirl

    flipflopgirl

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    Well put !

    I even learned a thing or two.

    mimi
     
  19. panini

    panini

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    No

    @Fablesable  is spot on. I didn't realize the sugar was shorted again. You just can't do that with Angel Food cake for all the reasons Fablesable mentioned. The stability is reduced in the merengue

    so it will act more like a mousse then a cake. I like my angel cake sweet because I usually use a sour fruit over it. Some of my recipes I sometimes put sugar in the yolks as well.

    I'm not sure if Fablesable mentioned but Don't change the recipe!/img/vbsmilies/smilies/surprised.gif There are a bizillion recipes out there, just find one with less sugar. I wouldn't use powdered sugar either. I sometime grind my granulated in my spice blender.
     
  20. satimis

    satimis

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    Hi,

    Thanks for your advice.

    The temperature of the oven thermometer indicated 180 deg C, 10 deg higher than 170 deg C.

    I used glass bowel for beating the egg white.  The bowel and the whisk have been thoroughly cleaned and dried.  They have been wiped with clean paper towel.

    The eggs were at room temperature, taken out from the fridge 2 hours before whisking.

    I used parchment paper not grease.

    Regards

    satimis