# All Clad - Clad or Naked?



## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

While the stainless steel clad All Clad looks great - nice and shiny - does it actually cook any better than the Master Chef or MC2? I recall reading somewhere that the "naked" MC2 actually uses a thicker aluminum than the SS sandwhich, and that in, at least some instances, may be a better cookware choice. What advantage, besides cleanup and looking pretty, does the SS clad cookware offer over MC2?

Shel


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## mezzaluna (Aug 29, 2000)

Oh dear! I didn't know I had a _naked_ MC2 brasier pan in my cupboard! I also have a stainless steel 12" saute pan. They work equally well for me, a home cook, and the MC2 was a bit less expensive. I like the finish on the MC2 as any scratches or small dings are less obvious.


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

I'm not familiar with the Master Chef. But in my experience, All Clad has done an incredible marketing job that allows them to charge incredible prices which aren't supported by either the quality of their products nor their lack of customer service.

You couldn't give me another All Clad item, let alone get me to buy one.


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## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

Hi,

This is the second or third post I've seen from you in which you have complained about All Clad. What are your specific complaints? What did you find wrong with the quality and the customer service? Which pot(s) did you have?

Shel


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

Shel, I had bought one of their chef's pans; 3 or 4 quart, I forget which. 

There was a problem with it--a strange sort of staining that looked as if the metal was delaminating. It was so bad I was reluctant to use the pan. Several emails to their customer service department were ignored. And their so-called customer service 800 number is the next best thing to useless. 

I tossed the pot, and won't deal with them anymore.

And just so there's no understanding. I am not complaining that there was something wrong with the pot. It's a manufactured product, and, therefore, subject to flaw. So the problem isn't the problem with the pot. The problem is what happened after the problem showed up. Which is, nothing.

The real test of a company isn't the quality of its products. It's the quality of its service. And, in my case at least, All Clad failed the test.


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## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

Hi, and g'morning to you ...

I can certainly understand your frustration and annoyance. I'm sure many of us here have dealt with poor customer service at one time or another, and it's damned annoying and frustrating. I don't blame you for being angry.

Coincidentally, I'm going through something similar with LeCreuset right now. I have one of their 5-quart Dutch ovens, and a couple of years ago the lid was damaged. I found another lid, from another pot, that worked pretty well on it, but now I want a new and proper lid. I went to some stores that carry LeCreuset and they all told me to contact the company for a replacement. Thus far all my attempts (4) to contact the company have gone unanswered, 

I had some questions about the products from one of the organic dairys in the area - one that I have supported for years and which is a "friendly, family owned operation - same thing, no response. Recently I had a question for the team at Trader Joe's - I'd even gotten a card from the store saying they want their customers to know what they're getting. I had a question about who supplied their milk and was told that they don't divulge who their suppliers are. At least they answered my inquiry.

Customer service has gone down the tubes - it ain't just All Clad, or Le Creuset, or .... It's a darned shame, too, since with email and 800 numbers, and all the communication technolgy we have today, it should be easier to contact a company and getat least a response. I suspect that I won't be buying any more Le Creuset either.

Shel


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

I would say saddened more than angry, Shel. I just can't understand why I company that has put so much effort into creating a reputation would want to jeapordize it like that.

Plus, as pricey (some would say overpriced) as the stuff is, you think they'd want to go the extra mile to keep customers happy.


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## panini (Jul 28, 2001)

I just wanted to throw my 2 cents in.
I have had all-clad for decades. I don't have a problem with paying for something that will be a one time purchase. I had a problem with one of the rivits lifting a little which was uncomfortable when my fingers passed over it. I paid the postage back and within a month received a new pot with a pair of tongs and a towel as a perk. This was a couple of years ago though.
I throw away commercial and some of the name brand like disposables in the bakery. Have never thrown a piece of all-clad away. I only have and use mc2.
pan


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## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

I agree completely, although the price of the product is really not that important. I think that, overall, the people in the customer service departments of many companies are under trained and just don't care very much themselves. They're just there to get a paycheck and have no commitment to the company.

That said, if you were to look at the history of All Clad, you'll see that since it's inception, the company has gone through several ownership changes. While not making excuses for All Clad, I'm sure all the changes has had an effect on service and other aspects of their business. The pans are clearly getting more "stylish" and flashy, that's for sure, and while they may still be well constructed and excellent cooking tools, I do think that All Clad is moving into a different market.

Their Copper-Core pans, while they may be excellent, are designed to "show off" the copper and to make a style statement. IMNSHO, the exposed bands of copper are just a way for the consumer to "show off" their expensive purchase. Useless ... 

Shel


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

Pan, I feel exactly the same way. But when I pay as much as All Clad charges, I expect that it _should _be a one-time purchase. And that if something goes wrong, the company should address the problem, not ignore it.

Shows you how inconsistent their customer service can be. They not only fixed your problem, they threw-in a couple of gifts by way of apology. Now, almost a year later, they have yet to even acknowledge my problem.

I also discovered, once I had the problem, that there is a large community of people like me, who feel that All Clad's reputation is more air than substance. There are also people on the other side of the issue, who believe All Clad is the greatest thing since sliced bread. But I'd be willing to bet that most of those defenders of the faith have never tried getting a problem fixed.


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## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

And that's really the big issue, isn't it. We all lnow that there can be problems with goods of any sort, and it's often how the company handles the problems that makes or breaks their reputation, especially with someone who has had a problem.

Shel (still have not heard back from LeCreuset after another cintact with them)


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## carlaird (Jan 16, 2007)

Customer service has gone down the tubes EVERYWHERE! (Your calling India for Circuit city????)
I love my All Clad set I bought it because I saw Marth using it so I assumed it was THE BEST!
THEY ARE HIGH MAINTENCE (Stainless)
And the handles HURT when you hold to clean!


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## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

Hi, for me, the handles are just fine - I guess I'm one of the lucky ones with the right sized hands.

Stainless is high maintenance?! How so? It would seem to be easy to clean and resist staining. Am I missing something?

Shel


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## panini (Jul 28, 2001)

You may thank your politicians and your government for the lack of customer service now a days. Especially if it is a small business( which our fearless leader would consider 12 million or less). It has become increasingly harder and harder for a small business to even stay afloat much less hire people for customer service. This Gov't. would be very happy to see all small business go away. This way the big guys can get their tax breaks, line the politicians pockets, and monopolize to a point to where they don't need to service the customer because the customer no longer has the option to take their business elswhere. Why? because the mother company ( monopoly) will own all the entities.
The big guys can take their customer service out of the country. It's great!!!
Less tax, educated employees working around the clock for minimum wage.


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

Don't hold back, Panini. Tell us what you really think. :lol:


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## panini (Jul 28, 2001)

You don't have the time or the ear!!!!:lol: 
I just hate hearing how people are dissappointed with business while they sit back and contribute to these huge monopolies. If you want service, support your small business. They might only be around for another decade or so. Don't be lazy and conform to conv9ience/medeocre product supplied by some large monopoly.
BTW
all-clad is just for me. I really give my pans a work out everyday cooking for family. My burners are always on high. I'm plunging them white hot into water so as to clean as I go. I give myself 20-25 minutes to cook a complete meal and have all cooking equipment cleaned and food put into serving dishs. This way my 15 yr old puts the plates in the washer and covers food and we're done.
pan


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## jannie (Mar 17, 2007)

I've had several All clad pans, they're okay but I've never been wowed by them. There 1qt saucepan is really handy and I regret forgetting mine on a hot burner when I went to answer the phone and it warped beyond use. 

When I got them I did think they were better than the stainless Cuisinart pans I'd been using. They MC2 get lots of reccomendations from cooks I've talked to when asked what they prefer to use at home. 

Side by side though, I have a Mauviel copper/stainless 1.9qt saute and a All Clad MC2 2qt skillet and the All Clad hardly ever gets used anymore. There's just something that I'm more comfortable with regarding the Mauviel. 

I used to be a photographer and shot many food oriented commercials. I was always asking "what is the best" and in later years most often it came up, MC2 All Clad, before that everyone was wowed by Calphlon anodized which I've had a lot of also, but I've filmed in many commercial kitchens over the decades and have never seen anything but commercial grade equipment, never anything as fancy or as nice looking as what you'll find at your favorite kitchen store. 

One of the things I finally had to learn when choosing is that most professional cooks/chefs, use gas ranges both at work and at home and I've always had to live with electric ranges. Having had the opportunity to spend a lot of time with a gas range I'd say that there is a huge difference in the way I learned to cook, and might choose different pots and pans as a result. And I can't really describe it but cooking on an electric range after using a gas range everyday for a month is like driving a car with only three wheels. 

Anyway from what I've seen and experienced, it seems as though All Clad is the stuff that prety much everything else is compared to and if you don't mind the price, with the occasional exception, I doubt you'll be dissappointed.

I've become a die hard copper/stainless fan for most of my cookware. I did buy a really inexpensive 5qt saute pan made by Tramontina at Costco the other day, it's stainless with a very thick aluminum core bottom and I'm kind of blown away by it's eveness on my electric range, very thrilled by this one and it only cost me $29.95...I've needed a large saute pan but the over $300 price range of the Mauviel kept me from doing it...fantastic! I also have kept a Cuisinart 3.5qt stainless satute pan from an old set and this new one is waaaayyyyyy better, even with the larger bottom which hangs far beyond the edge of the burner.

Jannie Newbee  :roll:


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## crema (Mar 18, 2007)

You can use it on an induction range/cooktop, because the outer layer of stainless is magnetic.
And as far as stainless being "high mantenance" is concerned, if all you want to do is get it clean, it isn't, really. But if you have spent the $ on stainless AC, you want that mirror finish to gleam, and you don't want any cloudiness or haze to sully the interior. That means more work. And if you are a lunatic like me:crazy: , you sometimes take it out into the garage and use the buffer on it!


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## crema (Mar 18, 2007)

I am very happy with my All Clad SS, but you couldn't give me another piece of their NS, it is WAY too easy to kill.


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## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

I doubt that I'd want to any such thing ... thanks for the tip on the SS getting cloudy. I don't think that would bother me very much.

Shel


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## jbone (Mar 25, 2007)

You mean you tossed the pan because of that? What you were seeing was perfectly normal. I'm not much of a chemist but it's a natural reaction some foods have with the metal, it's not bad for you it just makes the surface look cloudy in spots. A sprinkle of Bar Keepers Friend shines it right up. My All Clad does that sometimes too. Since they use 18/10 steel there isn't any kind of laminate or coating, it is bare metal which is what makes it so great for cooking (especially pan sauces oh yea!). Ah man I can't beleive you tossed it. Bummer.


Jason


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## suzanne (May 26, 2001)

I never have paid full list price for All-Clad -- either bought it at store that offers deep discounts, or bought direct from A-C with a professional discount. But if I had to pay full price, would I? Probably. I am very happy with their performance and ease of cleanup. My oldest A-C is about 10 years old: a Master Chef Chef Pan, and I swear it will outlive me no matter how I treat it. I also have a few LTD and a few SS, only because those were priced the best for the pieces I wanted. I cook in the inside of the pan, and as long as there is not so much gunk on the outside that interferes with heat transfer, I don't care what the outside is like. My pots are for cooking, not for show. Which is why when I have the choice, I get MC. Not sure about whether MC2 is equivalent, though.

I also have a KitchenAid nonstick sauté pan I literally picked up on the street -- someone had tossed it, I presume because there were a couple of scratches in the coating. Huh?  Man, if I beaned somebody with it, I'd do some serious damage.


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

Bzzt! Wrong! Thanks for playing.

First of all, there most certainly are laminates. Or maybe you prefer the word layers? Straight stainless steel, because of how it conducts heat, is the next best thing to useless as cookware. AllClad, depending on models, uses three laminates consisting of either SS-Aluminum--SS or SS--Copper--SS

Besides which, I didn't say it was actually delaminating. I said that was the visual effect.

Jason, I have a cabinet full of stainless, from an assortment of makers, and have never seen this sort of staining before. It was not cloudiness. It was not the blue and brown you sometimes get from high heat. It was nothing I recognized. Looked more like a fungal attack, and you had to rub it with your finger to convince yourself that the metal wasn't stripping off.

Barkeepers Friend did not solve the problem, thank you very much.

But the point isn't whether or not the pan was still usable. The point was that AllClad ignored multiple attemps to get the problem resolved. And to me that adds up to a worthless company, whose products I won't buy again.

Suzanne, the problem _was _on the inside. And, again, AllClad's refusal to address the issue tells me exactly what the company is worth.


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## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

I may be mistaken as i don't have the AllClad brochure in front of me, but I believe the the Coper Core uses five layers - SS-AL-Copper-Al_SS. Can someone verify that?

Shel


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## kitchenexpert (Mar 28, 2007)

Back to the topic - All Clad. I have several pieces and do not like it. I have no maintenence issues. I don't like it because it doesn't balance well in my hand and the handles are uncomfortable. The last piece I have was given to me as a gift - it is still in the box. I'll give it to my first kid that has an apartment of their own.


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

You may be right, Shel. After my bad experience I'm not interested enough to check. But the point was, of course, that it is made of layers. Conceivably they could delaminate (although I've never heard of it happening). 

KitchenExpert: Of all the brands I've used, the worst handles are on Cuisinart, IMO. On the other hand, I really like the hump-backed design of the Henckels skillets. comfortable, hand-filling grip, great balance, and total control. I only wish more of their stuff was available in open stock.


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## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

A few days ago I stupidly left an empty AllClad pot on the stove with the heat turned up pretty high. I was away from the stove about three or four minutes before catching the mistake and removing the pot from the heat. I thought for sure that the pot was ruined - I've ruined lesser pots through similar accidents. But the pot is fine, seemingly good for another 25 or so years of service. Phew!

However, I'm now looking at Viking and CIA cookware for my next purchace. I want to replace my sauté pan, and these brands seem to be at least as well built as AllClad - maybe even better in certain areas of construction - and less expensive. The CIA collection is 7-ply construction, heavy and thisck, and has a copper core from the bottom up the sides to the top. The Viking looks to be of similar comstruction.

Shel


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## jbone (Mar 25, 2007)

I wasn't referring to the layers as the laminate. I was stating that the cooking surface itself doesn't contain any kind of special coating. That's odd that it got a nasty like that. Either way All Clad should have replaced it. A good way to get under their skin is to post a thread about the experience complete with details and wait for others to respond about their hassles as well. Then email All Clad with a link to the thread and let them know how many thousands of people are in this forum. That might piss 'em off a little. haha. Either way too bad about the experience, I hope it doesn't happen to me since I've had nothing but good experiences so far.


Jason


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

>Either way All Clad should have replaced it.<

Replaced it? I'd have been happy if they even responded to any of my emails. Or made their so-called customer service phone system actually useful for anything more than selling me something.

>A good way to get under their skin is to post a thread about the experience complete with details and wait for others to respond about their hassles as well. Then email All Clad with a link to the thread and let them know how many thousands of people are in this forum. <

You obviously have them confused with someone who gives a s***!

Look up at my header, and see what I do for a living. When they tick me off they are also ticking off my readers. Do they care? If they did they would have been more responsive.

Trust me, it's already cost them far more than the replacement price of the item in lost sales. And will cost them more in the future.


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

I don't begin to know what happened in that first quote.


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