# Considerations on my first santuko



## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

I am steadily moving away from an old (matched, sorry!) set of Henkels and toward select Western-style japanese knives. I currently have an Mcusta nikiri, a Shiki gyoto and a short Shun chef (which I detest, for some reason). 

I want to get a santuko next. No, i don't watch Rachel Ray; I just like the design of the tip, especially for all the onion work I do. 

I know how to sharpen, and all of my blades (except that miserable Shun) can fall straight through a sheet of paper without being drawn, so edge sharpness (or the ability to achieve and hold it) is important. 

I was looking at the Glestain, but another thread on this site discounted it as overpriced for what ti is. 

I don't want to pay too much for bling (I did on the Shiki), but aesthetics matter. I hold the knife properly with two fingers on the blade, so some of the knives that pretend to be shaped to your hand move your hand too far back. 

All that, and, oh... would like to stay under $200.

Ideas?


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/products/gesshin-uraku-165mm-skd-santoku


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

millionsknives said:


> https://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/products/gesshin-uraku-165mm-skd-santoku


Thank you for the reply, but as indicated, I am looking for Western-style. Plus all of theirs are well over $200.


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

look at one of the togiharus http://www.korin.com/Knives/Style-Santoku_3

PS they usually have a 15% sale in december if you can wait


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## scott livesey (Jan 25, 2013)

see what is available local. go to Tar-mart or Walget and see what they have that fits your hand. then try local restaurant supply store. since you sharpen well, steel and maker are only for bragging rights. geometry cuts, what a santoku is asked to do won't dull any steel till after days of use. so you end up with a sharp knife that goes dull a little quicker, but can be restored to max sharpness with a few strokes on a stone.


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

Just burn a $20 bill and save your time


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

millionsknives said:


> Just burn a $20 bill and save your time


I have no idea what that means or to what you are referring.


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

Starting to narrow things down the more I learn.

I know I want a flatter santuko, not a rocker.

50/50 bevel

I had a long, detailed talk with someone who really is a knife geek and they said to consider a powdered steel or "nitrogenized" steel instead of V-10? Said it was less brittle than V-10 but every bit as strong. I'm not sure I'll find one in my price range though (<$200). I may let that one go. 

I'm skipping Granton style for now but would like a hammered Damascus (yeah, mostly for looks).


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

I agree w/ Scott.

toshhasa16.html ... $31

They've got a bunch of others for good prices too.


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

Any Takamura https://www.chefknivestogo.com/takamuraknives.html

This one has the length https://www.japaneseknifeimports.co...oducts/gonbei-180mm-hammered-damascus-santoku


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

Dual bevel, Western-style...

Rick, yours came closest. Just wish that was hammered Damascus -- yes, aesthetics but some functionality in terms of food not sticking quite as much. Your Takamura is the first PM I've seen at that price.


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## scott livesey (Jan 25, 2013)

like I said, go where you can touch the knives and see how they feel. PM steel is just the latest fad in knife materials. the steels work great for knives that turn old bulls in bologna or tires into mulch but don't excel as very thin(0.03" or less 1/2" above the edge) low angle(10 degrees or less per side) slicers which is why you chose a santoku. see what is available in AEB-L or 13C26, the steel most folks shave with. 
try these https://radakitchenstore.com/collections/all-cutlery/products/cooks-knife https://radakitchenstore.com/collections/all-cutlery/products/cooks-utility-knife both knives with shipping will probably set you back $30. they are well made and will slice veg see thru thin out of the box. if you don't like them, good gifts for December holidays.


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

Those are both good choices for the $$$. If I was gonna suggest anything further, I would say to get the black resin handles. Maybe it's just me, but I _HATE_ metal handles for their slippyness.


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

Or you could just burn a 20.

You know I do believe the OP clearly intimated he was all set for plain, course-grained soft-steel black-handled knives with thick edges.


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

That tojiro looks decent but I've been burned by their KU finished shirogami so I'm wary of recommending it. OP wants western handle anyway.


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## scott livesey (Jan 25, 2013)

rick alan said:


> Or you could just burn a 20.
> 
> You know I do believe the OP clearly intimated he was all set for plain, course-grained soft-steel black-handled knives with thick edges.


i guess you never used a Rada knife. hard to have a thick edge when the blades are flat ground and only 0.04" at the spine. just an alternative to Master Baka's super Rimbyo with steel made from ore harvested with magnets during a full moon.


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

rick alan said:


> Or you could just burn a 20.
> 
> You know I do believe the OP clearly intimated he was all set for plain, course-grained soft-steel black-handled knives with thick edges.


 Sure doesn't feel like you are contributing genuinely to this conversation, unless I'm missing something.


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

Oh but I have used .040" spined knives (they actually tend to be more like .044+) with thick edges, thick so far as I was concerned, and the OP also I had gathered. Though when you come across them for 25 cents at the church flea market these do make fun little fixer-uppers to eventually gift to someone who uses Ginsu along with some really clunky stuff people get gifted often enough, and the like.

Skipll, I didn't notice anywhere that you even vaguely intimated you were interested in $10 knives, especially given your previous vote of appreciation for my input. Was I, or Millions fro that matter, then missing something here?


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

I _LOVE_ Ginsu knives. You need to understand them and accept them for what they are. Great value for what they do.


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

Yes agreed, especially when you get them for 25 cents at the church flea market.

The Ever Sharp brand is actually the best of the bunch I've come across, in terms of steel anyways.


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

rick alan said:


> Skipll, I didn't notice anywhere that you even vaguely intimated you were interested in $10 knives, especially given your previous vote of appreciation for my input. Was I, or Millions fro that matter, then missing something here?


I did appreciate your input. I just am not getting this "burn $20" part.


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## scott livesey (Jan 25, 2013)

i think he was referring to the fact that you could buy both Rada Santoku style knives for less than $20. I brought them up as a low cost option that in my kitchen had surprising performance.


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

Got it...your point, not the $10 knife. 

If I had more utilitarian sensibilities,that might make sense. 

It’s like looking down the shaft of a new golf club driver on the first tee. Some cheap ones might work but you have to like what you see.


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## scott livesey (Jan 25, 2013)

SkipII said:


> Got it...your point, not the $10 knife. If I had more utilitarian sensibilities,that might make sense. It's like looking down the shaft of a new golf club driver on the first tee. Some cheap ones might work but you have to like what you see.


i understand. my main thought is find the knife and hold it before buying. see if there are any knife makers in your area who might make you one for $200. if you do mail order, make sure there is a no questions asked return policy. you will be dealing with 3rd parties that did not make the knife and can only refund your money.


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

benuser said:


> https://japanesechefsknife.com/coll.../jck-natures-deep-impact-series-santoku-175mm
> Have used the 210 gyuto from this series. By far the best heat-treated Aogami Super I've seen. Finely grained, no brittleness at all. Very thin edge out of the box. Put a conservative edge on it and you have an outstanding performer with exceptional edge retention -- even on crappy poly boards. The only reason I sold mine was that I was in need of some cash and didn't want to sell my larger gyutos.


Thank you. I like JCK as a company. I bought a Shiki grotto from them. My only concern is whether the santuko blade is flat enough along most of its length and whether the angle to get the tip on the board is too steep. I do a lot of work with onions and such, so I like to do tipwork.


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## SkipII (Oct 31, 2017)

benuser said:


> P
> Perhaps you better have a look at 180mm gyutos. Some are very narrow, others are not. My own Masahiro Virgin Carbon is well balanced. If you're open to plain carbon steel, of course. Steel is much harder than the Misono's, and not reactive at all once a patina has got installed. Highly right biased. F&F at Fujiwara level, not splendid as with Misono, but OK. Sold by JCK, who doesn't advertise them. Price the same as with Misono.


Original post already indicated that I have a gyoto. I will look at their santuko, however I am left-handed. Thanks.


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