# Step closer to opening shop and I need some solid oven guidance



## mbcakes (Apr 5, 2002)

I just read information that said a convection oven in no good for baking cakes. This totally confuses me since everything I've read so far said a 2 speed convection oven is what you want for cakes. On other sites(some of you know which I'm referring to) they said Deluxe is the oven to have and I'll agree that after talking to the company rep it sounds like a great oven(too expensive though) but is it a professional oven or one better suited to home baking? And why hasn't any commercial equipment dealer ever heard of these ovens? My shop will be small scale but I want something that can handle my baking needs and will stand up to constant use. Ok maybe I'm just freaking out a little under the stress of waiting to hear from the building permit dept., getting cold feet, whatever. I thought I had all this equipment stuff figured out. I thought for small scale business, convection is the way to go. Do they teach you this stuff in culinary school? Is that why I feel so lost on this stuff? I took 1 course at the CIA and they used deck ovens for everything and well I just didn't think to ask about ovens when I was there. Take pity on a self taught baker and enlighten me before I buy anything...70,000 btu regular depth 2 speed convection...good choice or stupid? 

Oh and on the other site someone said to use a pan of water in the convection oven while baking cakes? Does this really make a difference in moisture retention?


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## momoreg (Mar 4, 2000)

I prefer convection ovens for cakes. 

No pan of water is necessary. Some people use a pan of water for bread baking, but I've never heard of it used for cakes.


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## momoreg (Mar 4, 2000)

Sorry, I don't know anything about the Deluxe oven.


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## w.debord (Mar 6, 2001)

I don't know anything about that oven either. What is it about that one that they like so much? I haven't ever seen that brand in a comerical kitchen. 


I bake anything in a convection with-out problems. It would be really nice if you found one where you could turn the fan completely off. The low speed still blows foil around...but that's the only hassle. You just adjust. You can produce alot of baked goods with a double stacked convection. 

I think one of the things that throws most people with convections ovens is they don't realize you have to adjust down your temp. about 25 degrees. That doesn't sound logical....because the oven is calibrated. But there is a difference and you'll be ruining items if you bake on too high of a heat....which is why people say "it's dries out my cakes" because the fans are making the oven bake hotter then their used to in non-convections.

The pan of water is for cheesecakes...reg. cakes bake fine for me too.


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## lotuscakestudio (Jun 28, 2001)

The only thing I have to offer is that in any place I worked, cakes were baked in convection ovens and bread in deck ovens. No pans of water for cakes, just bread. 

The other thing I have to offer is: breathe mb, breathe. *inhale, exhale*


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## panini (Jul 28, 2001)

of course I have to disagree with everyone. We prefer to bake cakes and cheesecakes in decks. I feel the cakes get a better roll.
We use convections for puff,cookies etc.
I would always go with a brand well known by professionals, Wolf,Victory,garland etc. Only for the sake of repair and maintanance.


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## angrychef (Jan 15, 2001)

I sorta have to agree with Panini. My cakes, fullsheet cakes and bread in a deck oven. Cookies, muffins, bars in convection. My reasoning is that convection cooks faster because of all that hot air flowing around, so cakes and such have a tendency to cook too fast and peak(yes, even at 325F). Works great on cookies and muffins though.
I think a compromise would be to choose a convection oven that has the option of turning the fan off, just like Wendy said. We have brand new Montague with a HI and LO switch, I still wish there was a FAN OFF switch though(sometimes my parchment corners fly into the cookies and deform them). 
Other great ovens I've worked with are Wolf and Blodgett. 
Good luck!


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## momoreg (Mar 4, 2000)

Funny, and I can't bake muffins in a convection, because they end up pointy and lopsided. It really is a personal preference.


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## panini (Jul 28, 2001)

Momo,
I absolutely agree. I should have said anything with a batter in the deck. Don't ya just love the tongues ands bumps on the corn muffins and cupcakes in the convestion.


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## breadster (Feb 23, 2001)

we bake everything from cookies, cakes, cheesecake, bread, etc. in an 18 pan (6 deck) revolving Middleby Marshall- i like rack ovens too


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## mbcakes (Apr 5, 2002)

Thanks for the info. I'm just gonna stay positive and go with the oven I decided on. I sooo not good at waiting, especially when I'm waiting to see if my dream will come to fruition. I really can't take the anticipation but I've decided its probably not a good idea to call the permit dept everyday and ask if they've granted my permit yet. I'm told this town is one of the most difficult when it comes to getting a building permit but that if they really don't want your business in the town they make sure you know it right from the start. They've been really nice so far and extremely helpful so hopefully its a good sign but since I am a pessimist...God, this positive thinking stuff sucks! Breathe*****breathe**** hey Lotus, this isn't working so I'm going for some soy ice cream(I can here all you dairy eaters gagging already lol

ps just found out my insurance co will insure me for national distribution, mail order, etc!!!! Now I need a good name for my distribution co! Micheline


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## spoons (Nov 10, 2000)

Wow, thanks for the info too! 
I posted this same question in the "Equipment" section, didn't get this much response. I too am looking to purchase a large commercial oven. 
At the CCA, we baked all our cakes in the deck oven. We never had the chance to sample cakes in a convection oven. The convection's were in a different class. Cake's came out wonderful though using the deck's.
Who makes a convection oven with a turn off fan switch?
Anyone have experience with a gas Wolf convection oven?
Husband's client rep's Wolf.
You should see our new Wolf BBQ Grill, awesome.


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## panini (Jul 28, 2001)

mb,
National dist, manufacuring etc. You might check with the local health dept. I know where I am I have a seperate permit, health inspection from the state. They usually follow the same guidelines in general but the state really concentrates on labeling , ingredients, additives,etc.
Oh yea, you pay a fee for this one as well:bounce:


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## angrychef (Jan 15, 2001)

Momoreg, you are right on the muffins coming out lopsided in the convection oven. But my batter is pretty thick since I use yogurt as the liquid, and bake it only on the LOW fan setting(trust me, everytime we get new ovens, they need to pass the muffin test!).

Spoons, just call equipment distrubutors to send you info. on the ovens. The same brand will usually carry several different models. An example are the new ovens we got: For both kitchens my boss ordered Montagues with the off-fan option. Due to the height of our hood, we couldn't have that model and had to opt for the hi-lo fan switch model. I was so bummed.


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## mbcakes (Apr 5, 2002)

Hey Panini,

Don't you remember me? I bombarded you with emails, asked you a million questions, how could you forget? Just kidding. I never post my name here anyway so you wouldn't recognize me even if you remembered me. It's Micheline from the "other" message board. WDeBord turned me onto this site and it's been a great source of info. I actually getting my permit through the dept of agriculture because if 51% of business is wholesale a business here is covered under the dept of ag. The health dept will just check on me to see my books and if I ever go 51% retail then they take over. Kind of a crazy system but I didn't make rules, just have to follow them! Anyway, the first year of business will tell me where I stand and just in case I need to go retail I've followed all of the health dept rules so I won't have to make any changes to the shop. Thanks for the info though!


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## panini (Jul 28, 2001)

Micheline,
Acually I did put it together. I'm very glad to see you are almost there. This site is a well that is so deep with knowlege that sometimes it can be overwhelming. Most professionals in this industry have little time for debate so when you ask questions and things like that, they will pop on and answer to the best of their ability, and if they don't have first hand experience they will usually not say anything at all, not like some of the boards. So I would suggest that you use this board wisely. Kinda like a apprenticeship or a liver, absorb everything, keep what you like and pass of the rest. You have my e-mail or pm anytime. I hope you only have a minute or two a day to pop on, because you'll be so busy. good luck
jeff


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## anna w. (Nov 27, 2001)

I will be in the market for a new oven in the near future, also, and wonder if any of you have any opinions on electric vs. gas and how much quicker does a convection oven bake anyways? Are there advantages of a deck oven vs. a shelf oven? Thanks!! 

P.S. Good luck Micheline!


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