# Do chefs use other people's Recipes



## rocktrns (Mar 14, 2010)

When chefs make up a new food do they use other peoples recipes and find put there own twist on it?
When I cook I use Recipes off of line and put my own twist on the recipe is this considerd creative or do chefs figure out the ingredient amounts them selves .  How can I learn to be a chef and is following recipes off the internet considered amateurish?
BTW I want to go to culinary school once I get Graduate from high school in 2011.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Travis,

For a "leg up" for culinary school, get a job, even dishwasher, in a restaurant near you, NOT FAST FOOD, but a "real" restaurant, so you can experience first-hand what it is like in th business.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

IMHO, VERY few chefs create new dishes. The majority of the restaurant business is reproducing identical dishes in a fast, efficient manner with an extremely high degree of consistency.


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## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

Chefs have been using some of the same recipes and giving them a twist since the dawn of cooking. One caveman made oysters on the clubbed shell..then some innovative caveman added clubbed lemon squeeze.

It's been made or done and forgotten and remade again.......so what? people still have to eat.

if you haven't tried it then it's worth trying (within reason). Taking recipes off the internet is only amatuerish if you can't spot obvious flaws, no binder for doughs in a bread recipe, too much salt or other spice on another dish.

Take Pete's advice and get a real job in a real kitchen, then see if you have the call for culinary school.


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## nichole (Sep 16, 2009)

I agree with our chefs here.  Restaurants usually serve a variation of a dish, so you are right about the "added twist".  Incidentally, I am not a chef but learned how to cook by watching our chefs in action


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## rocktrns (Mar 14, 2010)

ok thanks well I been calling all over for internships ,and they have them at long horn,and outback steak house,and other restaurants,but they keep saying I have to be 18,and i'm only 17.


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## leeniek (Aug 21, 2009)

Can you get in as a bus person or dishwasher?  My daughter is only 14 and she works at the same place as I do busing tables.  One of her friends is the same age as her and she works as a dishwasher at another place in town.   I know you want to be in the kitchen, but if they have the rule that you have to be 18 before they will consider you, then try another way of getting yourself in the door.


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## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

Who said anything about an internship? get a JOB. who said Outback? they will teach you to grill and make salads and open sauce packs from the boil-in-a-bag-maker. 

Contact Country Clubs, and Restaurants. not cheap chain food places but real Restaurants. Even a small independent can teach you some excellent dishes and cooking techniques.  Look at Yelp to find a good restaurant near you.


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## eastshores (Oct 23, 2008)

To me, I consider a cook/chef to be accomplished when they do have enough experience to create a dish on their own. Since humans have been cooking for thousands of years, there aren't a whole lot of techniques that are really "new", but I suppose that's why the whole molecular gastronomy fad gets some attention, until recently that hadn't been done to the degree it is now, even though cooking has always involved some degree of alchemy.


One of the reasons I fell in love with cooking, was the fact that it is both technical and artistic. You cannot escape the fact that composing a dish is much like composing any other piece of art, striving for balance in textures, flavors, and colors. At the same time, one can imagine beautiful artwork in their mind, and without the technical knowledge of how to execute that vision, nothing will come of it.

Much like an artist must practice their technique, sketching thousands of times, trying new approaches, new paints, new canvas, new types of lenses or film, etc. you must practice. This is to me where a recipe can help, it gives you a framework to start with, but you shouldn't limit yourself at all to that framework. Study a recipe and ask yourself "why is this successful, what techniques are required to make it successful?". Over time, you will have enough knowledge to construct your own frameworks and when you have, your creativity can really be unleashed.


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## shroomgirl (Aug 11, 2000)

When we talk, we typically talk proportions or lists of ingredients or techniques....most cook's recipes for other cooks are short.  It takes into account that you know how to blanch, saute, roast, peel, cool, fold etc....there are typically few descriptions of techniques.  

Seasoning, how you use salt, how you garnish, how you combine ingredients are all individual....if you had 7 different chefs that I'm familiar with I could (probably) in a blind tasting pick out each's dishes.  

If you look at Cape Chef's dishes, Kuans, Nickos, mine, etc they'd be different....the first three were classically trained and have serious tall white hat cred....but they'd all be distinctive to that chef/cook.


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## chefbillyb (Feb 8, 2009)

No, I invented, meatloaf, Lasagna, beef stroganoff, Hamburgers, Tacos, fried chicken, and many, many, other items......................Ok, I lied, I stole them from the diner across town, darn, the cat is out of the bag.............Chef Bill[hr][/hr]


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## brudie1 (Jan 29, 2021)

I have never heard of proffesional chefs stealing each others recipes' I have been in the trade for nearly 40 years. retired 4 years, but keep my hand in


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

whoa! What a blast from the past--2010 or thereabouts, eh?


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## chefross (May 5, 2010)

brudie1 said:


> I have never heard of proffesional chefs stealing each others recipes' I have been in the trade for nearly 40 years. retired 4 years, but keep my hand in


Hey Brudie1 and welcome to Cheftalk.

40 years and NEVER heard of Chefs stealing recipes eh?
You must have been working on another planet then. It happens all the time.


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## retiredbaker (Dec 29, 2019)

We never used recipes, we knew how to cook.
Baking was completely different, always rigorous attention to measurements.


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

retiredbaker said:


> We never used recipes, we knew how to cook.


No profitable well run kitchen can use that advice.

In terms of consistency ( and staff interchangeability) you need to measure put your ingredients- regardless if for a tartar sauce, a leek and potato soup, or a braised pork shoulder.

By measuring I mean scaling out--using a scale, since all of your ingredients are sold by weight anyway. A profitable, well run kitchen will cost out each and every recipie before being implimented.


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## retiredbaker (Dec 29, 2019)

Every French restaurant I was in worked like that.
If every last ounce must be accounted for its because they're doing something impractical somewhere else. Sometimes its not the kitchen its too many managers.


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Ounces in French restaurants???
You do know that Napoleon caused the system to be developed, right? 
And after it was developed, anyone who didn’t use it got to “ experience” the guillotine firsthand....

No, recipies are written with weights for ingredients for two reasons, and both of them have nothing to do with “ impracticality” or “ too many managers”.

The first reason is consistency. With ingredients given in weight there is no excuse for ten different cooks to execute the same recipie with little to no variation in taste or consistency.

The second reason is that a well run kitchen should be able to effectively cost out a sauce or dish. 

The only way to do this is to calculate a cost per kg. for each ingredient purchased and then multiply this number by the weight of said ingredient used in the recipie. So, for instance, Gruyere cheese is purchased in 2 kg [email protected] $40.00 which means that it costs $20.00/ kg, and the recipie uses 150 grams, so the cost for Gruyere is $3.00, and now on to the next ingredient. 
You can’t cost out “ by feel”, everything has to be weighed out, but ESPECIALLY MEATS/PROTEINS.

Sorry about the caps.....


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Umm... Napoleon caused the METRIC system to be developed...


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## retiredbaker (Dec 29, 2019)

foodpump said:


> Ounces in French restaurants???
> You do know that Napoleon caused the system to be developed, right?
> And after it was developed, anyone who didn't use it got to " experience" the guillotine firsthand....
> 
> ...


yeh I worked as pastry chef in a place like that before I retired, modern American cuisine.
Sky restaurant, norwood ma. Closed permanently due to covid now.
The cooks couldn't actually cook, they followed directions, they did that well but the food was overly fussy, over reaching, ambitiously convoluted but impractical.
They were selling food vs selling the skill of the chef.
I liked the chef, very productive but he couldn't make pate, didn't know what a panade was.
I've seen a lot of that.


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## newcookchef (Feb 10, 2021)

I believe nowdays, the source of information has become very large. It's always good to look around yourself for new recipes.


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## loomchick (Jun 11, 2013)

I may be reading too much into 'use' other people's recipes. I know many chefs that can be inspired by something another chef has made. For example, here in Seattle (about 25 years ago), the executive chef at Fuller's in the Sheraton Hotel was Monique Barbeau. She won the James Beard Award as Best Chef: Northwest, was a guest on Julia Child’s “In Julia’s Kitchen with Master Chefs”, and did a number of other noteworthy guest appearances and contributions.

Monique developed a salad from watermelon, feta cheese, and sage . . . these were three flavors I had never considered combining together, but it worked . . . really well. The flavor profile was remarkable for something with so few ingredients . . . watermelon delivered sweetness, feta cheese delivered a tangy and salty flavor, and the sage contributed an earthiness. I think this inspired other chefs to try their own variations on these ingredients. Did they 'use' her recipe? Depends on how you interpret the word 'use' . . . Did they copy it? Not really. But, it did inspire similar flavor profiles in other restaurants.


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## chefross (May 5, 2010)

How about instead of the word "copy," we substitute "inspired by?" 
If I see a recipe from someone else, and change one ingredient, then it becomes my recipe.


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## loomchick (Jun 11, 2013)

chefross said:


> How about instead of the word "copy," we substitute "inspired by?"
> If I see a recipe from someone else, and change one ingredient, then it becomes my recipe.


Absolutely! I think this happens all the time. Nearly every time I eat something I really like, I think of how I would make it and what I might do differently. Unfortunately, it's been nearly a year since I've been in a restaurant due to COVID-19 . . . but, I can come here and get inspired.


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)




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## kottie (May 10, 2021)

rocktrns said:


> When chefs make up a new food do they use other peoples recipes and find put there own twist on it?
> When I cook I use Recipes off of line and put my own twist on the recipe is this considerd creative or do chefs figure out the ingredient amounts them selves . How can I learn to be a chef and is following recipes off the internet considered amateurish?
> BTW I want to go to culinary school once I get Graduate from high school in 2011.


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## kottie (May 10, 2021)

Iceman said:


> View attachment 70278​





brudie1 said:


> I have never heard of proffesional chefs stealing each others recipes' I have been in the trade for nearly 40 years. retired 4 years, but keep my hand in


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## kottie (May 10, 2021)

I was threatend some years ago by a very angry chef who accused me of copying his fish pasty.


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## Aldente (Apr 26, 2012)

kottie said:


> I was threatened some years ago by a very angry chef who accused me of copying his fish pasty.


That's almost a compliment!! Sounds like he must have liked what you did, and then got irritated that you could duplicate his dish.

There is a difference between stealing and re-creating. Stealing a recipe is taking all the ingredients in exact quantities and making the recipe using the exact same method in the exact same order and then *calling it your own. *

Re-creating is simply following a recipe. If you are given a recipe, or shown how to make something, or find a recipe and make it... none of these are stealing. And this is the vast majority of the ways people learn how to cook.

The key is when someone or some eating establishment is promoting a dish that they claim is their own, but was taken from someone else.

Professional chefs who have any sense of self-respect do not steal recipes and use them as their own, but will often use a recipe and change or add to it.

If I make an apple pie and just call it an apple pie, it does not matter where it came from. But if I call it Aldente's Apple Pie and promote it that way, it should have something special and distinctive that I changed to make it my own.

However, with something so commonly found as apple pie, it is generally acceptable to call it your own when it is made in house, even if it is a re-used recipe.


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## fatcook (Apr 25, 2017)

brudie1 said:


> I have never heard of proffesional chefs stealing each others recipes' I have been in the trade for nearly 40 years. retired 4 years, but keep my hand in


That's funny - I remember learning "cooks borrow, chefs steal" very early in my career.


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## fatcook (Apr 25, 2017)

retiredbaker said:


> They were selling food vs selling the skill of the chef.


Most customers are buying food, not the skill of the chef.


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## fatcook (Apr 25, 2017)

loomchick said:


> Monique developed a salad from watermelon, feta cheese, and sage . . . these were three flavors I had never considered combining together, but it worked . . . really well. The flavor profile was remarkable for something with so few ingredients . . . watermelon delivered sweetness, feta cheese delivered a tangy and salty flavor, and the sage contributed an earthiness. I think this inspired other chefs to try their own variations on these ingredients. Did they 'use' her recipe? Depends on how you interpret the word 'use' . . . Did they copy it? Not really. But, it did inspire similar flavor profiles in other restaurants.


This is a really good example - watermelon, feta and (usually mint, sometimes parsley) is a common dish in the Mediterranean. Sage is a twist on that making it her own.


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## sabra_1 (Jan 27, 2002)

I have worked a long time in the industry,I know for a fact chefs use other chef's recipes.
I like the word inspire,yep as chefs we might eat out at a nice restaurant and like a particular flavour.If you have a decent palate it's fairly easy to reproduce the flavour.
I love making chutneys,jams,jellies(when I have time)from food I've grown.Nothing like making up different flavour combo's. My latest recipe is Hemp Heart pesto,Summer and Winter version.


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## Cief Lonwind of the North (Jun 7, 2021)

By definition, the Chef, is the chief of the kitchen. He/she must be an expert in the types of food prep, and cooking techniques for the menu of the place that work, and preferably, be creative and know more cooing skills tan required. They must be able to plan for food purchases in the proper amounts needed, to make sure there is sufficient food supplies, without purchasing so much hat food spoils, and goes to waste, They must be able to plan, and organize for al a carte, buffets, catered events. They must be able to supervise both back and front of the house employees, making sure safe food handling, and proper cooking techniques are used by all. The chef is also responsible for the discipline, and morale of the kitchen, insisting on hard work, excellence, and proper attitude of the sous chefs, line cooks, dishwashers, servers, etc.

Though I am an accomplished gourmet cook, who has occasionally catered weeding receptions, won pastry bread, and chili contests, developed recipes for others, supervised and participated in whole hog, pulled pork fundraisers, Spaghetti fund raisers, young adult camps, and other involved cooking events, even taught knife skill, and pressure cooking classes, I am not a chef. To be a chef requires training, business, culinary, supervisory, and efficiency training. To get that completely without school, you have to be fortunate enough o have an accomplished mentor. Evam with culinary arts school, that degree is only the start of you training.

Seeeeya; Chief Longwind of the North


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## kottie (May 10, 2021)

Any British chefs on here or is it mainly American. I'm happy if that's the case, but I thought some British food might be nice.


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## buffece9 (Jun 23, 2021)

Yess, I think chef always believes in self-respect, They do use other's people recipe, enjoy it with necessarily making changes on it but never gives their own recipe name.


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## kottie (May 10, 2021)

nichole said:


> I agree with our chefs here. Restaurants usually serve a variation of a dish, so you are right about the "added twist". Incidentally, I am not a chef but learned how to cook by watching our chefs in action





retiredbaker said:


> yeh I worked as pastry chef in a place like that before I retired, modern American cuisine.
> Sky restaurant, norwood ma. Closed permanently due to covid now.
> The cooks couldn't actually cook, they followed directions, they did that well but the food was overly fussy, over reaching, ambitiously convoluted but impractical.
> They were selling food vs selling the skill of the chef.
> ...


I have just watched a program about adding flavour to minced meat, lasagne for instance, where the chef add ed offal, ground /minced heart. good idea?


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## retiredbaker (Dec 29, 2019)

brudie1 said:


> I have never heard of proffesional chefs stealing each others recipes' I have been in the trade for nearly 40 years. retired 4 years, but keep my hand in


No chef I worked with used recipes, they knew how to cook.


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

1) adding offal— heart and/ or lung to ground beef does not seem to me—imho, “ creative”, but rather a lousy way of stretching the recipie. Even so, the customer should know that dish does contain offal, ie steak & Kidney pie, poached tongue, braised sweetbreads, etc, and not have it hidden in the ground beef.

2) Professional chefs write recipies and expect their staff to follow said recipies for two main reasons:
a) to ensure consistency. Take for example a Caesar dressing, or a cream of tomato Soup, it’s got to be the same, no matter who makes it.

b) to ensure costs are kept to the calculated recipie. Take for example cook A adds 50 gr ( 2 oz) Parmesan to a dish—as stipulated, and cook B adds 100 gr (4 oz) Parmesan, or double the amount, knocking the costing for that dish way out of balance.


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## sarosbardining (Jan 7, 2022)

rocktrns said:


> When chefs make up a new food do they use other peoples recipes and find put there own twist on it?
> When I cook I use Recipes off of line and put my own twist on the recipe is this considerd creative or do chefs figure out the ingredient amounts them selves . How can I learn to be a chef and is following recipes off the internet considered amateurish?
> BTW I want to go to culinary school once I get Graduate from high school in 2011.


Possibly. I can share my experiences as a chef and restaurant owner. Many chefs utilize other people's recipes since consumers prefer similar foods, but the difference is in the chef's expertise, which makes the dish unique and stands out from the competition.


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## teamfat (Nov 5, 2007)

Actually this thread brought to mind the episode of Kitchen Confidential where a chef from another place has a dinner at Jack's restaurant, then some of Jack's staff go eat at the French chef's place and the special is an exact duplicate of what he had at Jack's place. Things escalate from there, and I'll just leave it at that.

mjb.


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## cheflayne (Aug 21, 2004)

One of my early mentors told me that "self taught or original" is just a figment of an misguided ego. We all learn by watching others and tasting their work and that is how we start to build our own style. He concluded by saying whenever you think you have created something new and that you are a genius and God's gift to the culinary world, somebody...somewhere...has already done it.

Carl Sagan said, ‘If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe’.


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## cheflayne (Aug 21, 2004)

The first time I boiled water, I was an unsure novice that had no clue about what I was supposed to do or how to do it so I well imagine I copied/followed/stole someone's recipe. To whoever it was...*thank you!!*


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