# Smoking - Pro/Cons



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

So Oldschool1982 gave me the idea to start up this topic on what everyone thinks about smoking and then being in this industry. 

There are so many people out there, high in the bergaide and low, that smoke, and you cant help but say, isnt that killing your palate? Doesnt everything you put in your mouth have a faint taste of ash? 

I mean sure its an excuse to be able to go take a 5 min. break outside before service starts but still.


----------



## oldschool1982 (Jun 27, 2006)

Myyyyy Gaaawwwwwddddddd Quinn!:crazy:

As if I didn't have enough of a "spite" following already.:lol::bounce:

Not helping my cause here but I never got to go out and take a 5 minute break before service??????? Maybe cause I didn't smoke. Several of us would joke that we should take it up so we coupld get that 5 minute break every 2-3hrs. Doohhh!!!!


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

Hey Im not going to take all the credit for an amazing idea thats going to get everyone all riled up. :talk:

My friend and I never smoked but we always used to tell the other guys who did smoke that we were going out to burn one but wed just sit on the table outside and watch the golfers at the driving range (I worked for a restaurant inside a country club). I dont think they ever figured it out becuase they always would let us but when the other kid tried it they told him no since he didnt smoke to begin with.


----------



## chrose (Nov 20, 2000)

Aside from the health and taste bud aspects of smoking what smokers don't realize is how they smell after a smoke. As a former (non-militant about it) long time smoker to me I always smelled "toasty" after a smoke. It wasn't until I quit that I realized how bad it actually is. Even worse I imagine when I smoked Swisher Sweets!
I can't help but think that delicate foods will pick up the odors from your chef coats and hands even if you wash them.

That being said, I will say that I was quite surprised to see that pretty much all the contestants on Hells Kitchen were smoking. I am also surprised frankly that Gordon Ramsey would even allow a smoker in his kitchen, nitpicker that he is.


----------



## [email protected] (Mar 16, 2008)

PROS -- It is their body, not yours.
It is their money they spend for ciggies, not yours.

CONS -- They hurt themselves, not you.

I got friends who smokes. I do not agree that they should but they are great guys so it does not matter that they smoke...as long as they smoke upwind from me. And they always do...


----------



## ras1187 (Oct 3, 2006)

5 minutes every 3 hours??? Try 20 minutes every 1-2 hours for some of my cooks & chefs.

I personally never had a desire to start, nor was I curious or experimental about it in my younger days. I am too old to start now as I have no valid reason to.


----------



## chef.esg.73 (Dec 10, 2007)

Love smokes, could careless about anyones opinion of me smoking, how I smell, what the health risks are, and definetly dont care when people get upset about smoke breaks, I actualy enjoy when smoking bothers people mostly when I smoke my Cohiba Habanas(cigar)..I do get pissed when people smoke the wacky tabacky, danger to us all..

.:smoking::smoking::smoking::smoking::smoking::smok ing::smoking::smoking::smoking::smoking::smoking:: smoking::smoking::smoking::smoking::smoking::smoki ng::smoking::smoking::smoking::smoking::smoking::s moking:+

If you gottm smokem!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## shipscook (Jan 14, 2007)

First you guys rock, love your posts, but have to say, when I have been running for 10 hours with 4+ to go and almost haven't had time to pee, ate a snack on the fly, when a co worker is going for their another,"must effing have" smoke break, I get a bit testy!!!!
I was on one ship with a Captain who siad, if he was in charge of hiring, would not hire smokers, takes too much time!

But more than that, being one of the seniors here, have lost and am losing friends at an amazing rate from tobacco related cancers. That con wipes out any pros. Please don't do this to your friends and family.
(((((((hugs))))))
Nan


----------



## headless chicken (Apr 28, 2003)

I have enough bad habits as it is, don't need to add smoking to it all. Lost my grandfather to lung cancer and he was a heavy smoker from his early teens till early 60s. I've never, though tempted being in this industry, stuck anything of as such in my mouth. Figuring there are better ways of screwing up my body... 

But I do have to say, I hate when people who do smoke get 2x the break time I do and its usually left up to me to cover for the smokers. It the worse when 3 of them would want to go at the same time but only 1 of me to cover 3 stations/jobs.


----------



## oldschool1982 (Jun 27, 2006)

Smoke? Personally I do my best not to since that usually means that I've been on fire and that can't be a good thing.

Heck you don't even need to be a smoker to get lung issues. Not on pins and needles but I do worry some in the back of my mind from those many years my Mother smoked like a chimney and then I waited tables and bartended. Non-smoking policies came a bit late in for me in my opinion. I remember Buca had a employee non-smoking policy while I was there. I thought it was a great idea. Too bad it didn't work very well. Hard to enforce a policy when the FOH Mgrs smoked and always brought company with them. Most of my current indoor environment allergy issues could probably be attributed to second hand smoke.

Hey do what ya like makes no never mind to me. But when it affects me directly is when it becomes a nuisance. It's my non-smokers rights.

Now that leads me to "Smokers rights" I guess it's mostly the "militant ones" but one thing that gets my goat is the proclamation of them so very loud, clear and relentless. Funny how they are the only ones with rights. 

All I ask is a little respect. 98of the time it's not a problem but every now and then.


----------



## yorvo (Jun 11, 2008)

Smokers are like women going to the bathroom. They can't go by themselves. One goes they all go. And it's not just the smoke break that takes time out of the day it's the twenty minutes before that they are only half focused on their job because all they can think about is getting out for that smoke. 

I had a guy working for me a few years back, great line cook. His first night was a Friday night and he had no idea what his chances for a smoke break would be. So he chewed. I'm surprised in all my years that's the first time I saw this. He knew how bad his habit was and knew better than to expect to get a break when he wanted.

chef.ESG.73-That wacky tabacky is no danger to you, unless we are talking about use at work. Then I'd agree. You burn me coz you're stoned and I'm taking out of your a.s.s.


----------



## chef.esg.73 (Dec 10, 2007)

First let me say sorry about any loses of life do to smoking..

I hear a ton of people complaining about other people and their smoke breaks.. Who's running the kitchens. It is the chefs job to control all aspects of the kitchen, period. Don't get mad at those who you feel smoke to often, get mad at those who allow it. 

Not to start a argument but im going to with those who use drugs. I feel my kitchen is in complete danger whether they use them in or off the job, *FACT.* Drug use is a danger to our profesion and life in general, it cause bad attitudes, lack of rest, bad accidents, and complete lazyness. Ive been in a kitchen for 23 years out of my 35 and have witnessed some G-d awfull burns, cuts, and falls because of drugs whether they used them before work or could not consintrate because they used them after work and was up all night.
DANGER WARNING:

*Our kitchens are a reflection of ourselves.*

Listen to Old Nancy Ragean, *just say no...*


----------



## deltadoc (Aug 15, 2004)

Personally, I don't care what other people do to their own bodies, as long as I don't get involved (i.e. having to smell smokers).

Cons: There's one BIG reason why cigarettes cause cancer that no one ever brings up. Ever wonder why the cigarette, once lit, continues to burn unaided? Ever wonder why they used cigarettes as fuses (combined with a book of matches) during WWII?

Its because they're loaded with Potassium Nitrate. It provides oxygen to keep the tobacco burning. Nitrates turn into very carcinogenous nitrous amines, et al, during the burning process, and smokers are inhaling these carcinogens.

If the government would force BIG TOBACCO to remove the KNO3 from the cigarettes, how many smokers would continue if they had to re-light their cigarette every time they took a puff? That's one reason that pipe smokers have to re-light so many times. I believe that the KNO3 is in the cigarette paper. Processing wise, it would be easy to soak the raw paper in KNO3 and then let it dry.

doc


----------



## yorvo (Jun 11, 2008)

chef.esg.73 I can totally agree with your stance and I don't want to turn this into a drug topic. But I want to make sure you include alcohol with those drugs. :crazy:


----------



## chef.esg.73 (Dec 10, 2007)

*Alcohol:* Lenny M. so drunk one shift he was making beer battered shrimp in fryolater as he was taking them out with a sloted spoon, he dropped the spoon in the grease. he was so out of his mind he put his hand in the fryolater to retreave spoon, burns so bad, we never seen him again.

*Pot:* Jenny L. so stoned and unaware while using plasticwrap sliced her wrist on the cutter hit artery blood squirted through out the kitchen, had to shut down kitchen completely at 730pm on Friday night. Never seen her again

*Alcohol/Pot:* Ron S. was lifting stock pot off stove filled with turkey stock. Was so lazy and figured instead of picking up sheet pan on the flood that was in his way, he would step over it. he ended up slipping on sheet pan spilled stock down the whole side of his body, we had to strip him of his cloths and lift him into ice machine. His left side of his body looked like pastrami. Never seen him again.


----------



## chef.esg.73 (Dec 10, 2007)

ooops didn't mean to go an a rant, please continue to bash us cigerette smokers.. I love it.:roll:


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

I didnt mean to start this topic up just to bash smokers. My mom has always smoked. I would love to see her quit but they say its harded to quit cigerets over any other drug. I beleive that, I mean its not an easy thing to do to quit anything that your truly addicted to. 

I feel that it does ruin your palate and sence of taste and even smell but its a choice, if thats what you want to do thats what you want to do. 

Just a quick story, I was in class one day at school and I was making something, maybe mashed potatoes which Ive made 207575983 times and a kid came over that I didnt already get along with, cocky jerk, but anyway he came over tasted my mashed and said dude did you put any salt in this........I looked at him and simply said, you smoke, shut your mouth. I had another kid that I KNEW DID NOT SMOKE come over and taste it and said they were fine, chef came over and said they were fine. 

If you smoke its your choice just dont come to me and tell me I didnt seasnon something enough let alone at all..........

I really didnt mean to start a fight between anyone so please everyone stay calm. 

Let me ask you smokers this tho, if it wasnt so hard to quit, and you had the chance, would you?


----------



## chef.esg.73 (Dec 10, 2007)

I can say I don't know if my palate has a different taste than those who dont smoke, because I have always smoked. I feel I taste food just like everyone, but now *you have me thinking, maybe not?*

I have been smoking for 25 years since I was 10, I actualy tried this 4th of July on a whim to quit, not that smart my body flipped out, I realy enjoy smoking, but I can now feel it in my breathing, since I started to go to the gym?? So to answer your question, yes I would quit..But nobody quits anything until they have suffered enough, unfortanetly! :smoking:

*good topic, kid*


----------



## bundens (Jul 5, 2008)

i'm a smoker unfortunately. I quit off and on...months or years at a time..why i dont completely stop is beyond me but i don't. The big con i see is cancer..but then again we're all gonna die someday. My grandma, who used to smoke and was in fact an alcoholic up until she needed to go through chemo for breast cancer...used to say
if you enjoy it, do it.
She has this attitude whereas you only live once and so why deprive yourself of things you enjoy. For some reason I actually really enjoy the taste of a camel or a good rolled cigarette. I like the taste of tobacco. I like the ability to get a 15 min break (otherwise you won't in this industry) and it's very comforting being able to have a cigarette when you're stressed or want to feel comforted. 
Sadly I think a lot of smokers see their cigarettes the way I do...camel is a good friend.


----------



## mezzaluna (Aug 29, 2000)

I smoked for 15 pack-years (average of 1 pack a day for 15 years), starting in college (age 18). I quit in 1983, 25 years ago. I was delighted to regain my senses of taste and smell- it made a huge difference to me.

I heard from a a few weeks ago friend that her husband was recently diagnosed with stage 4 lung cancer. He had quit smoking 35 years ago. 

Best for me to see my doctor regularly and have any long term bouts of coughing followed up on. Even though my oncologist-brother tells me I'm probably safe, I'll never lose my fear of getting lung cancer.


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

I would say that the biggest difference, and I beleive there is, is salt. Its like washing out your mouth with olive oil and than going to taste something. 

Your mouth has a slick texture all around where the seasonings and taste itself cant penetrate. 

My mom smokes like a chimney and has a cough just about every day, I hear her in the middle of the night hacking her lungs out downstairs. 

Someone should test this out......haha


----------



## allie (Jul 21, 2006)

I've been smoking for about 12 years now. I enjoy it and the only reason I really think about quitting is the cost. I don't see where it's destroyed my taste buds. I season food to where it's good for me and everyone else has to add more salt, pepper, etc. to it. As for smell, if it's damaged that, then I have to say I'm glad. Otherwise, smelling perfumes, certain flowers, soaps, detergents, etc would probably kill me instead of just giving me a debilitating migraine.

I started smoking when I had bronchitis and a respiratory therapist gave me a menthol cigarette and told me to try it and see if I could breathe better. Contrary to popular belief, it did help. I'd always had problems breathing, especially when my allergies/sinuses acted up in different seasons. The menthol cigarettes do open me up more and allow me to breathe more easily. I actually have less problems now than I did before smoking. I went without cigs for a while and started having those breathing issues again so I ended up going back to smoking so I could enjoy life again. I've had inhalers, steroid inhalers, pills, etc. and none helped that much.

I don't blow smoke on people and don't want to be enclosed with cigarette smoke. While smoking my own cigarette doesn't cause me to have breathing problems, going into a bar or somewhere and inhaling a lot of smoke does. Perfumey odors do bother me a lot more than the smoke so going out in public is a risk I take. Like the lady a few weeks ago who had on so much perfume, I could smell it from two aisles away in the grocery store.

I've seen people die from lung cancer who never smoked a day in their lives. I truly believe that there are so many polllutants in our world that you can't blame just one. If you pay attention to the news reports, almost everything we eat, breathe, touch, etc. can cause cancer so it's no surprise that so many people die from some form each year. Seeing my father's battle with colon cancer for the past 6 years, I'd rather live life to the fullest and enjoy my time than do without everything that could possibly cause an early death. He feels the same way which is why he's opted out of chemo twice. He's testing cancer free once again after having a lobe in his lung removed last fall where the colon cancer had metastisized. He's been a smoker for most of his life but the doctors all say his lungs look great, except where the colon cancer spread to the one.


----------



## chrose (Nov 20, 2000)

The rationalization that goes on when defending smoking is amazing. I submit to you that a smoker will only understand this after they have quit. I started smoking when I was 12 and quit when I was 36 or so. I smoked anything and everything under the sun. When I quit it was somewhat easy (I say somewhat) A) because I wanted to and B) because I figured out a way to avoid the habits that I formed. If nothing else would you go to a campfire every half hour and stand over it and breathe in the smoke for 5 minutes? Not much different. Smoke is smoke. I also hated to be a slave to the craving. First thing when you get up, having to step away from whatever you're doing to go stand outside by yourself or huddled up with the other cravers, etc. Dennis Leary once said when he was in Alaska he got a kick watching the smokers outside passing out because they didn't know if they were done exhaling.
My sons best friends parents smoke and whenever he goes over there he and his clothes stink, he also comes back stuffed up. Their kids go everywhere smelling like a dirty ashtray which really sucks for them, but what can they do, their parents won't quit or take it outside.
We were all born without a cigarette in our mouth, cigarettes are human made. I figured I didn't need them to kill time when I was young, I don't need them now. Make all the excuses you like, I did when I smoked. You just don't remember what it was like before you smoked. Inhaling smoke into your lungs plain and simple, just ain't good for you or those around you.


----------



## deltadoc (Aug 15, 2004)

Bet you'd walk a mile for a camel!....

doc


----------



## deltadoc (Aug 15, 2004)

chrose;229184 said:


> Dennis Leary once said when he was in Alaska he got a kick watching the smokers outside passing out because they didn't know if they were done exhaling.[/QUOTE
> 
> Don't know who used the joke first, but Bill Hicks used that line (except it was when he landed in Chicago) on his HBO Comedy "UFO Tour".
> 
> doc


----------



## blueicus (Mar 16, 2005)

Although I'm a non-smoker I've never bothered trying to convince people not to smoke or whatnot (partially because I don't really care), as long as there isn't smoke wafting in my nose while I'm eating or drinking I'm fine. I've also noticed that at my new work place has a huge contingent of smokers, from all the sous chefs and below. I've never really had a problem joining people on breaks without smoking so I've never really considered starting.


----------



## yorvo (Jun 11, 2008)

Bill Hicks.


----------



## dc sunshine (Feb 26, 2007)

yorvo;228943 said:


> chef.ESG.73-That wacky tabacky is no danger to you, unless we are talking about use at work.quote]
> 
> Yorvo - wacky tabacky ruined my brother's life. He's become a paranoid schizophrenic due to long usage, who can now only do gardening as a job, or deliver junk mail. It ruined his marriage, sent him to psychiatric hospital several times, impacted badly on his 3 sons, whereas he was an extremely intelligent person with a great career prior to overindulging in it. I don't want to lecture, just to share what I know can happen.
> 
> ...


----------



## chrose (Nov 20, 2000)

I could have sworn it was Dennis Leary, if it was in fact though Bill Hicks I will apologize in memory of Bill. Bill Hicks was GREAT! So my apologies Bill. RIP.


----------



## 24-7cook (Oct 29, 2007)

I smoked for 12 years near the end I smoked 2 packs a day. 
My palate changed completely after I quit. I have one smoker out of 12 in my Kitchen. He is allowed 2 smoke breaks in an 8 hour shift. I also ask that he cleanse his mouth afterward so as not to interfere with the tasting of menu items (my cooks have to taste every item before it goes out). He has only been with us for 3 weeks but we constantly have to correct his seasoning. 
When he is done smoking the smell will over power you if you are next to him.


----------



## yorvo (Jun 11, 2008)

Not sure who did it first. They're both great. I found this today. I love his take on smoking.

YouTube - Bill Hicks on The David Letterman Show 1989


----------



## jbd (Mar 17, 2008)

Just an antecdotal reply as I have no direct experience. When my father was diagnosed with cancer(oddly enough not tobacco related apparently) he was advised by his oncologist to quit smoking, which he did. Not long after that he commented at dinner one day, "I never knew how good food could taste". He went on to describe the flavors he could detect. He was a chemist and mathemetician by training and he attributed the difference to the quitting smoking as he had not yet started on chemotherapy etc. I have heard similar comments from people I know who have quit smoking over the years. Others have made no comment one way or the other.

Possible test for you. Eat a meal you like while smoking as normal. Then, if you can(I hear it is really difficult), quit smoking for 10 to 14 days and then have the same meal and see if you notice a difference.


----------



## chef.esg.73 (Dec 10, 2007)

Sounds good, if I can actually quit for 10-14 days ? 
:smoking:WILL LOOK INTO IT


----------



## beetrootbrain (Jun 4, 2008)

I am fascinated by the obsession that non-smokers have over smokers. Is it because they are repulsed when they have to sit in the same room as everyone!? I smoke (when i´m drinking) and for me smoke and booze is a bit like lamb and mint sauce. But i would never go up to a slightly over weight person eating cookies and say "hey fatty - stop eating those cookies if you want to live until your 60", so why the obsession with smoking. The media also always tries to find other reasons for people to stop - like "Stop Smoking - Stay Slim", "Stop smoking save money", "Stop smoking look better". People smoke becasue the LIKE it - like cookies or wine or any other substance that in large doses is bad for you - but why is smoking so much worse??


----------



## jbd (Mar 17, 2008)

Not a completely true statement. I have had many people tell me they wish they had not started smoking. Some were for the reasons you mentioned i.e. cost or health concerns but many commented that they didn't like the taste or the smokers breath they had afterwards. Some disliked the smoke being in their clothes. Even with apparent regrets and dislikes for whatever reasons they all pretty much felt powerless to quit.

I have heard a few people mention the same kind of taste connection that you have made. Usually it is with a drink although not always an alcoholic drink.

The issue with non smokers is second hand smoke. A non cookie eater isn't going to have to be concerned with second hand cookie crumbs.


----------



## free rider (May 23, 2006)

Hmm... not entirely true. An economist would cite negative externalities. A negative externality is something that is a product of a transaction that was not accounted for or paid for in that transaction and ends up affecting people outside the transaction.

Negative externalities related to smoking:

1. Air pollution
2. Litter (butts everywhere)
3. Reduced productivity at the workplace (from ill health, spoiled palates, smoke breaks, etc.)
4. Odors that other people have to smell on the smoker long after the smoking is over.

I could go on...


----------



## dannyt223 (Oct 7, 2008)

I love smoking. Minus the health factor. In some cases, to me, it makes some foods taste better. For example I love smoking after eating anything with potatoes in it. Whether it's french fries, mashed potatoes, baked potatoes or even potato chips. There is just something about it that just taste great. It might be an acquired taste, but either way I love it. I quit smoking for a couple months too, a few years back and I never noticed a difference in the way it made my food taste. But I'm expecting a baby boy soon so I'm going to quit for my pregnant wife and him. It's the least I can do for her.:smoking:


----------



## vera bradley (Mar 21, 2004)

Bravo! :bounce:

To all who DO want to become ex-smokers, I've heard that it takes most people about eleven tries before they finally do quit - most, but not all! So if you have tried before and think you just can't do it, remember that _with each try_ _you are that much closer to the time when you will succeed. _


----------



## oregonyeti (Jun 16, 2007)

I smoke. I started at age 14. I quit for 6 years, in my 20's and then thought I could have an occasional one. No go.

I like smoking, though I know it's not healthy (and people remind me of that all the time, as if I never knew it). I don't smoke indoors and I hate being in a smoky room.

There's a friend I used to visit on weekends who smoked in his house, so I did too, in his house. I got headachy and couldn't taste food very well. Even if I smoked outside, inside was still smoky. There is a big difference to me when people smoke indoors, as far as how I feel and how food tastes.

I'm not saying that I think smoking done outdoors only, is less unhealthy, although logic tells me it probably is--but it does make a big difference to me in other ways. Sometimes I smoke when I'm driving a car, but there has to be a window at least part way open, even in freezing temps.

Another thing about smoking indoors--my work is in HVAC and the air filters from places where people smoke inside are downright nasty and scary. I don't think smoking should be allowed inside any public buildings _unless _there is a very good ventilation system, and only in those areas well ventilated.


----------



## docsmith (Aug 4, 2008)

The problem with smoking is that it not only affects you, but the smell and the crap in the air gets to others too.

If you want to kill yourselves on an expensive habit, be my guest, but I don't want to have to smell you doing it down wind.

I make my staff change shirts if they are going to smoke, and even then they stink.


----------



## tessa (Sep 9, 2007)

i am a non smoker and all my family smoke, , bruce smokes, so im very used to the smell, sometimes i kinda like the smell after hes had one and other times its a bit horrid.
we have very strict smoking rules over here so its really nice to be in cafes/restaurants which are totally smoke free as you dont get that stale smell in the mornings , I have been quite lucky in the places i have worked in that often there are not a lot of chefs that smoke


----------



## oregonyeti (Jun 16, 2007)

When I smoke, I usually go outside. And if anybody asks, I say I'm going out back to smoke a salmon and well if they don't know me, they are thinking "wow nice".

But whose business is it if I'm smoking a salmon or a cigarette outside? If it's outside?

Salmon are a lot harder to light. But they last a lot longer.


----------



## tessa (Sep 9, 2007)

:lol::lol::lol::lol: but im sure they are easier to smoke than a camel or a marlboro man :lol::lol::lol:


----------



## oregonyeti (Jun 16, 2007)

HAH Tessa, glad someone caught the joke :crazy: And you one-upped me lol :bounce:


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

I've been a smoker since I was 19, I'm now 32. I've been a heavy smoker in the past, especially when I smoked camels. I'm now at a point where I've limited myself to a couple of cigs a day, anywhere fom 1 to 5 depending on the circumstances. I consider myself a "nice smoker" meaning I go outside, I have breathmints on hand, I stand away from non smokers, and I won't smoke around anyone that is pregnant, too young, too old, too ill, or anyone that really hates it.

What bothers me to no end is how smokers are treated. Yes I realize we smokers might be stinky people with a few too many wrinkles that get crabby if we haven't had our nicotine hit, but that doesn't mean that non smokers are pleasant beautiful creatures that smell like lillies of the valley. I can't count the times I have been harrassed on the street that think it's ok to walk up to me and lecture me by saying things like "that stuff will kill you" or "this is MY AIR TOO!" or "could you stand a little further away please?" or refer to my cigarettes as cancer sticks. 

It seems that the anti-smoking laws have empowered people to take on a better than thou attitude over smokers. Furthermore some non smokers now feel that they have a right to make all sorts of rude comments to us. I'm mostly angry that I take so much care not to be intrusive with my smoking but I am attacked anyway.


----------



## vera bradley (Mar 21, 2004)

That is _fantastic_, Mapiva! I've known people who wished they could at least cut back, but never managed to do it. You should be quite proud of yourself for that (and also for being a considerate smoker).


----------

