# Stump BDL



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

Just so everybody knows, this is all to be in good fun. As a newbie to this forum, one person IMHO has stood out from the crowd as the most helpful and most knowledgeable person here, Boar_D_Laze. I know i am not the only person appreciative of his responses and expertise.

BUT NOW I LAY DOWN A CHALLENGE!!!

The whole Forums VS BDL in a Q&A* type manner cooking challenge



I shall start the challenge with my question


What....is.....a..China Cap used for?











*Q&A refers to questions and answers. Questions are required to be cooking related, if BDL decides to play along he has 7 days (unless on vacation) to answer questions with his OWN knowledge. No Googling, asking Mrs. BDL, or his buddy Skippy. He may refer to his research materials i.e. his cook books and notes..as no cook is an ultimate island onto hisself. We shall trust the almighty HONOR SYSTEM on this ruling. Feel free to post questions now to form a gauntlet, as I know mine is a simple one. This is all in fun and no harm was done to me during this post.


----------



## yorvo (Jun 11, 2008)

Sounds fun. I'll play. Here's another simple one.

What is a Buffalo Chopper?


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Not so sure about my position as know it all. But great big ham, yes. I'll play but will get my behind handed to me. No fair gloating.

China cap is aka _cap chinoise_ in French. It's a conical strainer/sieve. They're a Xitch to store, but they're dynamite for forcing mirepoix through to give a _jus lie_ substance. PITA for riced potatoes, but the best texture. Better than a ricer and not as overworked as a _tamis. They're pretty much always a pain. Hard to hold, and their little stands are always too big or too small for working over a pot. But they work soooooo well. Before I get all thrilled, I should add that just like sieves they come in a bunch of sizes and hole sizes. When you buy one, it should come with a special pusher/pestle thing for pushing stuff through, but the restaurant supply companies always forget. The pestle doubles as a great muddler for making cocktails. If your pusher disappears check FOH, the bartender stole it.

_Buffalo Chopper is a sort of processor/meat grinder. Very adaptable in terms of textures. Much better than a robot coupe for meat if over handling and bringing out fat is a worry. The blade spins in place while the bowl moves around it. I'm not sure how it got its name, but heard a bunch of stories none of which were very convincing. "Looks like a buffalo with the lid on;" "invented in Buffalo NY;" "made by the Buffalo Tool Co.," etc.

BDL


----------



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

:smoking: BDL 2 Forums 0 


Course it'll only take one to stump ya, but someone is gonna keep count anyways. Good job, Thanks for playing. I'm sure other questions will be forthcoming


----------



## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Actually, the true test would be to assemble a Power-Dicer attachment on the Hobart--1/2" grid--within 3 minutes


----------



## dc sunshine (Feb 26, 2007)

Gunnar (hey that's my brother's middle name)....you're gonna have to do a heck of a lot better than that query to stump BDL


----------



## lollarossa (Feb 22, 2006)

Ok BDL........try this one.


Main flavoring ingredient in sauce maltese.


----------



## ed buchanan (May 29, 2006)

Did a little research on Buffalo Chopper I graduated cooking school in the late 50s, and we had one. It was grey baked enamel with galvanized aluminum bowl. Who cared about sanitation in those days?.It was a Hobart made in Troy Ohio 1 horsepower 11 amps. They also made a 5 amp. 1/3 horsepower. Another manufacturer was Lan Electric, Mill Street, Slough Berks, England, some of these reached U.S. market, as did Toastmaster 1/3 horse. Compared to the Hobart workhorses the others were junk. Now I understand Electrlux is making one for the cruise ships, as they are almost exclusivly Electrlux equipped. Hope this answers some bacground questions.


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

_Sauce maltese_ aka "brunch _hollandaise_." Easy. Orange juice and micro-planed orange zest in what would otherwise be _hollandaise_, usually used for vegetables and spuds and of course _madame's oeufs_, during brunch service. God knows why, but _maltese_ underwent a blood-orange renaissance and not only tasted weirdly sweet but looked terrible. The grapefruit juice variation isn't as bad.

The background on buffalo grinders was very interesting. Thanks for it. I only worked with one in one kitchen that had one, a Hobart. It worked with so much less heat than a robot coupe, without the "meat everywhere" problem of an ordinary grinder.

foodpump - You devil you.

BDL


----------



## yorvo (Jun 11, 2008)

I haven't worked with a Buffalo Chopper since the early nineties. I grew up cooking in Las Vegas and every place I worked had one. I miss them. Great tools. But at just over four grand apiece I see why places don't buy them anymore.


----------



## lollarossa (Feb 22, 2006)

Good catch BDL. Guess I will have to come up with something more obscure to trip you up on.


Easy one.

Two meats in a Royal Sub.


----------



## gummy-bear (Oct 27, 2007)

what is the Chinese dish "blood tofu". This is from a waiter at my restaurant.


----------



## oregonyeti (Jun 16, 2007)

Here's my question:

什么是中国盘" 血液 豆腐"。 这是从侍者在我的餐馆


----------



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

:smoking: Huzzah for BDL, 3-0 and more questions pending. Thanks for joining in all.


Great information on both the Buffalo Chopper and the Sauce Maltese. I have seen a Chopper at work on meat, but didn't even know it's name. Those things look really effective and dangerous as **** to boot. And the Sauce Maltese? Never heard of it, sounds old school and brilliant. 

Oregon Yeti: I wouldn't be surprised if BDL could answer it, but I will have to insist that questions be asked in English. 

good try though :lol:


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Stumped! I'm hoping it's very regional. I've never heard of a "Royal Sub." If I had to guess, it would be prime rib and prosciutto.

It's steamed, coagulated pork blood cut into squares aka "xue tofu." I like it with a lot of different things, but especially in "trolley noodles." That's an Aberdeen/HK thing, ask your waiter friend. Another place it shines is in the Thai seafood and noodle soup called yentafo. 

Gevaldt!

BDL


----------



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

So soon? already? Well, folks lets hope that BDL's guess is correct. I have heard of a Royal Sub, but don't remember what was on it either. well, we shall wait for a response from LollaRossa to confirm BDL's stumpedness. In the meantime, great answer on the blood tofu. Assuming it's correct, sounds gnarly. I would try it, maybe like it and never make it. (course I might order it every chance i got).

So here's the question shall we call BDL stumped and kill the thread OR do we let BDL present a challenge of his own to his stumper? Let these two go head to head in a who knows what who when where kinda thing? or call it dead and done?

I personally vote Head to Head, ( a q&a showdown, Lolla gets 5 questions, BDL gets 5 questions and the one with the most correct answers win (in the case of a tie, OahuAmatuerChef will eat a cockroach instead of Tilapia )) and if BDL wins let the stumping continue. If he loses well...Let the thread die and just let BDL respond to what interests him as before.


Remember, it's all n fun and I don't want any hard feelings over a friendly challenge.

So who votes what? AND TO ALL YOU LURKERS OUT THERE, MAN UP OR WOMEN UP OR WHATEVER, GET INVOLVED PEOPLE


----------



## eloki (Apr 3, 2006)

I have one.

What is nato?


----------



## lollarossa (Feb 22, 2006)

fermented soybean




Royal Sub. Meats are Italian Sausage and Cappicola. Could be regional...not quite sure. It's what I grew up with.

BDL will probably pwn me in this lil contest......but if he is up for a head to head, best out of five, I am game......and I have been in this biz for tooooooooo long to take things personal.


----------



## oregonyeti (Jun 16, 2007)

North African Tatoo Organization. Lots of members have tatoos of couscous and mint leaves, and sardines.


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

natto. Yes, fermented soy bean paste. Natto smells like essence of old socks and wet forest, tastes like mushrooms once it gets past your nose. More than anything else it's an old peoples' health food breakfast, but surprisingly good with chopped _ika_ or _maguro_ in a _temaki. _FWIW, the traditional accompaniment is Japanese hot mustard (not wasabi).

Me likee.

BDL


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

Here ya go BDL::::


What is loomi?


----------



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

yeah, great sandwich :lips:, had a chef that did a variation with salami, cappicola ham and I forget, cause i didn't write it down like a moron.


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Here are a dozen. Nothing too hard, but a wide range of cuisines.

1. What is (Japanese) _negi toro_?

2. What are the four KCBS meats? (Not open to MaryB)

3. What is the appropriate garnish for a Hendricks Gin and Tonic

4. How many planes to a _tourne_?

5. What's do you call the knife cut for a piece of garniture cut 2" x 1/4" x 1/4".

6. What do you call egg whites beat with hot syrup to medium peaks?

7. What is (Chinese) _xiao loon bao_? What are the appropriate utensils for eating one? What are the principal ingredients in the accompanying sauce?

8. What is the Creole trinity?

9. What dry ingredient is a constant in every (Spanish) _gazpacho_?

10. How do you eat (Vietnamese) cha giao?

11. What's (Korean) _banchan_?

12. How high should the oven be preheated to _Romertopf_ a roast chicken?

Good luck,
BDL


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Persian rice spice. Good stuff.

BDL


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

Poo. You are good. I was sure you would miss on that. haha



How about:

What is "Sucre De Palmier"?


----------



## phatch (Mar 29, 2002)

boar_d_laze;227887 said:


> 2. What are the four KCBS meats? (Not open to MaryB) Pork Ribs, Pork Shoulder, Brisket and chicken
> 
> 4. How many planes to a _tourne_? Seven
> 
> ...


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

Eh? Not sure if any of those are right.


----------



## lollarossa (Feb 22, 2006)

This just shows me I need to brush up on my international cuisine.

1) Fatty tuna and onion mixture?

2) Not sure

3) I don't drink/am not a bartender

4) 7

5) Batonnet

6) Italian merangue

7) ??

8) Celery, onion, bell pepper. Aka creole mirepoix.

9) Paprika?

10) With my mouth.

11) ??

12) 400F....yes, I googled it.


----------



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

number ten is my favorite answer Lolla and I am gonna let it count in my official ruling :lol:.

I knew nothing for sure. I know Toro is Tuna, specifically Tuna Belly I beleive.
Heh, everything but the squeal is what they cook in KC
have no idear
never heard of it
never heard of it
ditto
same
man i suck
yep
uh huh
someone shoot me

I gots lots of googling to do. Hope other people are enjoying this as much as I am.


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

I'll wait a little longer before giving the answers and enough background to make them interesting. Almost all of the answers given have either been right as far as they went, or better than right. "With my mouth," indeed.

BDL


----------



## maryb (Mar 21, 2008)

Sure, don't let me answer the one I know  well I knew the cajun one too but thats common with a lot of BBQers. Pulled pork jambalaya is good stuff.


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

'q is a harsh mistress,
BDL


----------



## maryb (Mar 21, 2008)

Don't remind me, today is recovery day :lol: I am getting to old to get up with the sun and cook for 12 hours!


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Most have already been answered correctly. But just as fill in...

1. What is (Japanese) _negi toro_? Toro is the rich belly meat from a fish. With blue fin tuna there are two kinds, chu-toro and o-toro. O-toro is the richest, most expensive. Negi toro is tuna o-toro minced (like tartare), usually served with chopped scallions and sesame oil, sometimes dressed with a raw with quail egg. A special aspect of properly prepared negi-toro is that the knife doing the mincing must be sharp enough to cut the tuna fibers without crushing them. And that's sharp.

2. What are the four KCBS meats? (Not open to MaryB) Chicken, pork ribs, pork shoulder, and beef brisket. Brisket is considered the holy grail of KCBS competition.

3. What is the appropriate garnish for a Hendricks Gin and Tonic? Cucumber slice was a great call. Cucumber spear would have been better. The varietals in Hendrick's include roses and cucumber, it's an odd but delicious gin.

4. How many planes to a _tourne_? 7 is right on the money.

5. What's do you call the knife cut for a piece of garniture cut 2" x 1/4" x 1/4". Batonet is right. Not "batonette." It's not a piece of bell pepper, not a smaller, female baton.

6. What do you call egg whites beat with hot syrup to medium peaks? Yes to Italian meringue. Why didn't anyone say Swiss and get it wrong? I'm always getting mixed up. Not fair.

7. What is (Chinese) _xiao loon bao_? What are the appropriate utensils for eating one? What are the principal ingredients in the accompanying sauce? It's a "soup dumpling." A seamed bun filled with meat and liquid. You make sauce by mixing pepper flakes in oil with a little soy and a lot of special, aged black vinegar. Put a little sauce in a Chinese soup spoon, and use your chop-sticks to get the dumpling into the spoon. Then you nibble the top off the dumpling and find some way to get as much sauce into the dumpling and as little soup into the sauce as possible. Not easy, let me tell you. Then you spoil all of the effort by eating the dumpling out of the spoon.

8. What is the Creole trinity? 2 parts onion, 1 part bell pepper, 1 part celery; all evenly diced.

9. What dry ingredient is a constant in every (Spanish) _gazpacho_? Bread. Good catch!

10. How do you eat (Vietnamese) cha giao? You put a piece of lettuce in your hand, the cha gio (which is a sort of "egg roll") in the lettuc, some cilantro, thai-basil and sawgrass on top, some julienne of carrot and radish on top of that, and spoon some fish sauce in. Then fold the lettuce into a taco or roll it into a burrito. Then and only then, "with my mouth."

11. What's (Korean) _banchan_? An assortment of appetizers, salads, sides, garniture, served in small dishes alongside whatever else. Wrap your minhd around this: Banchan is (a) free, (b) sometimes includes some of the spiciest stuff you will ever eat and smoked fish too, and (c) free.

12. How high should the oven be preheated to _Romertopf_ a roast chicken? Trick question. The oven should not be preheated or the _Romertopf _will crack. The oven should be turned on only after the _Romertopf _goes in. I know the last sentence reads like a smutty _double entendre_, but I would never.

Well hardly never, 
BDL


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

Good stuff BDL.

I knew my fair share of those. haha

:::

What is Sucre De Palmier?


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Palm sugar sometimes known as coconut palm sugar and sometimes date palm sugar, and sometimes just palm sugar. We used to live near a Thai dessert/bakery place that used a lot of it. I forget what it's called in Thai, I think I remember two or three names. It's used in India/Bangladeh as _jaggery _or _gur_, but it's from date palms and not from coconut palms like the Thai stuff. They use it for a variety of things. We sometimes buy jaggery from the Indian grocery -- it comes in little blocks you have to break up to use. I know it's used in Vietnamese cuisine as well.

If it's in Southeast Asia and the South Asian peninsual, it's probably all around South Asia, so I'd guess Indonesia, and the rest of the region too.

The closes substitute is the Mexican sugar called _piloncillo_. I use _piloncillo_ all the time. If it's available to you at reasonable prices, you should at least try it. It beats "sugar in the raw" all hollow; and unlike turbinado which is extensively factory-processed, it is actually just reduced crushed cane juice poured into a mold and left to harden.

BDL


----------



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

K, well I lost score. I just hope people keep asking BDL the strange and obscure. Love knowing what I don't know.


----------



## chefelle (Feb 17, 2007)

I have to say, BDL--I am VERY impressed! I'd be digging in Larousse for alot of those answers!!!

Okay--I'll throw my hat in the ring---
In what cuisine would you find the use of salep and mastic? What are these items and what are they typically used for?


----------



## lollarossa (Feb 22, 2006)

Turkish, mainly in use for their ice creams as thickening agents. IIRC it is these that give the ice cream the ghooeyness that Turkish ice cream is known for. It's been a long time but I read it in an issue of Savior.


----------



## durangojo (Jul 30, 2007)

okay bdl, give this one a try...what is shichimi togarashi? zampone? what is the special diet that kobe cattle enjoy? and get massages with what?
joey


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

I know these.

_Shichimi togarishi_ is Japanese chili pepper table spice stuff that you get on the table in ramen-ya. The Japanese claim it's spicy, but they lie. In the greater scheme of what is and what is not spicy, _shichimi togarishi _is very tame. I've got a bottle each of two different types (red and green), bought at Mitsuwa, in one of our spice cabinets. The labels are in Japanese and I can't read the _kanji_ script, but I think they're the same brand -- just not sure. I'm a bit fan of any noodle soup, a lot of ramen under the bridge.

Kobe beef is really "Japanese beef from Tagajima Prefecture," in Japanese, _wa-gyu Tagajima_; Kobe is the capital of Tagajima and the shipping point of the beef. It's a sort of _appellation controlee_ thing, with the Japanese government working hand in hand with the producers to keep the name restricted. It's supposed to be about quality, but I suspect it's more about money. At any rate, I think only something like five hundred farms are licensed to produce the beef. I first read about it in a James Bond novel -- _You Only Live Twice_ in the 60s.

The steers are fed on beer, and have sake massaged into their coats. Which, frankly, sounds good to me. I had the chance to try the real thing in Japan at two meals when I was there on business in the nineties -- the trip paid for by someone who wanted something from me very badly. I found the ultra-desirable cuts a bit greasy grilled and an incredible waste of money in _shabu shabu_, which no matter how you look at it is boiled meat. You can get beef from American raised black faced cattle, called wa-gyu beef without the beer/sake rigamarole. It's very well-marbled, more so than prime and more palatable to my tastes than the Japanese meat. Frankly, I prefer specialty Angus to wa-gyu. By the way, in Japanese, "wa" means "Eastern" or "Asian" depending on context; and "gyu" means "beef" or, more properly "beeve" if you want to get all technical.

_Zampone_ is just Italian for trotters. In French, _pied de couchon_. In Spanish, either _patitas de puerco_ or _manitas de cerdo_. We report, you decide. Got recipes?

BDL


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

Whats the difference between Nutty Sweet Red Rice, Basmati Rice, Medium Grain Brown Rice, and Risotto?:smiles:


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Risotto is a rice dish, made by sauteing an appropriate type of rice, in just enough stock (don't forget a little wine) of some sort to cover, adding more liquid as necessary, and stirring it frequently (always in one direction). At the appropriate moment the cook stops adding liquid so that when the rice is perfectly done it will be be neither soupy nor sticky -- but creamy. The big tricks are not to overstir which crushes the grains; and predict the finish so the rice coasts into perfect doneness in the bowl. Otherwise it will overcook, split and glom up into a hunk of goo. Restaurant risotto used to be predictably overcooked, now they've gone the other way and usually serve it soupy and al dente. Some people like a cream finish, and some people don't. You usually use a medium grain white rice to make risotto. But there's no law or anything. The traditional Italian choice of rice is _arborio_. I prefer to use Cal-Rose. It's creamier and a little more forgiving of timing glitches.

Basmati rice is a type of long grain, originally from India. It's the best rice if you want loose as opposed to sticky rice. Great for pilafs, arrozes, etc. You can get it milled (white) or raw (brown). My favorite kinds are from the Kashmir and Thailand -- very hard to get right now. Some excellent basmatis are grown in the US and Mexico too, but they aren't as aromatic.

Medium grain brown rice is just that. Any medium grain rice with the hull on. Medium rices tend to be starchy but hull on rice keeps its integrity.

Sweet red rice is a short grain, glutinous rice from somewhere on the Asian peninsula. Somewhere around there. Anytime a rice is called "sweet," you know it's short grained and glutinous -- so that's a way of keeping them organized in your head. Glutinous rices are sticky, and very good for puddings. What else? Sweet red rice has a pretty distinctive smell. Kind of like hazelnuts. IIRC it's usually not for desserts but served with strong flavored mains. For some reason I associate it with momo. Is it Himilayan? Nepal?

There's another kind of sweet red rice thing called ang-chow. It's the lees from making rice wine, and very stinky. If that's what you meant that's really stretching it. It's a Hakka/Foo-chow Chinese thing which I know about because there's a Hakka restaurant next to ... The heck with it. To make long a long story short: Once tried, never forgotten.

BDL


----------



## maryb (Mar 21, 2008)

Whats an ABT?


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Atomic buffalo turd. Jalapeno, cored and stuffed with cheese, wrapped with bacon; can be laid on the grate, but ideally held vertically in a special ABT rack, and cooked in a pit -- ideally a Klose.

BDL


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

I figured that was so easy it was a hard question for you. haha You are good. 

A. What are the functions of each of the four parts of a canape?

B. What is the basic composition of meat? (as in %'s)

C. What percent of a whole lamb is the hind saddle cut?

D. List the 5 dominant seasonings in Korean cooking and how they are used.

E. What are the 7 members of the cod family?

F. Of the HRI cuts; what is cut # 193?


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

A. What are the functions of each of the four parts of a canape? Stumped. But, I'm not sure I accept the premise that a canape has four parts. I only recognize two essential parts: Bread, in one of many forms -- usually crustless; and a topping or filling if the canape are formed as a roulade.

B. What is the basic composition of meat? (as in %'s) Varies with animal, cut, type, season, etc. Very roughly, 75% water, 20% protein, 5% fat, carbs, and this and that.

C. What percent of a whole lamb is the hind saddle cut? Hind saddle is a little ambiguous -- I'd guess the long hind of legs, rack, loin, at less than 40 pounds in a dressed-out American yearling lamb, so just under 40%. But, guessing. I can handle being wrong.

D. List the 5 dominant seasonings in Korean cooking and how they are used. I can only think of three, offhand. Soy sauce, gochujang and doenjang. After that I'm guessing salt and garlic. Don't have the time or inclination to go into uses. Gochujang is red pepper paste used to make all sorts of things including soon tofu and kimchi. Doenjang is soy bean paste -- sort of like natto without the funkitude. I use it as a condiment especially for anything I'd lettuce wrap. Don't know what else to say. On Edit: There's also this nuclear red chili powder I use to make soon tofu, don't know the Korean name. Is that one of the big five? 

E. What are the 7 members of the cod family? Hmmm. Trick question I think there are only three true cod. Atlantic, Pacific and Green (aka Greenland). I can think of a few other non-cod cods; some more cod than others. . Sable, polar, antarctic, lingcod, haddock, rockcod, blue cod, arctic, poor cod... that's all I can think of off hand. I know there are a ton more. 

F. Of the HRI cuts; what is cut # 193? You're kidding right? I never ordered the meat for a big outfit. Stumped!


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

Anwsers:

A. the base (bread), the spread (lubracant), filling, and a garnish
B. 72% water, 20% protein, 7% fat, 1% minerals
C. 49%
D. Close enough, I kind of worded it wrong so it made it more confusing. So lets just say I never asked this question. haha
E. Atlantic Pollock, Cusk, Haddock, Hake, Pacific Pollock, Pollock, Whiting
F. Beef Flank, Flank Steak (IM)


Note: Korean Chili Powder is that really hot chili powder your thinking of. 

Ill throw you F but I still stumped you on a few others! :lol: :smiles:


Heres one more from me for today:

****What are the grades for foie gras?****


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

I'm not sure I buy "A" as a meaningful answer. I mean is "four aspects of canape" a classic technique that's widly taught?

"B" I'll quibble. There's so much variation, I think my answers were close enough.

"C" So, over 40%? Every time? I thought the long front was at least 60%

"D" I'm interested in knowing what you meant, please expand.

"E" Most of those aren't even true cod. bzzzzzzzzzzzt.  You have to give me a pass on everything. :lol:

"F" Dude!
That's as easy as A, B C. Speaking of which, you know the difference between B and A is usually just size. That makes B a much better deal if you've got a good provider who'll give you B that's smaller or has a blem you can hide.

BDL


----------



## rpmcmurphy (Jan 8, 2008)

name for the apple pear syrup/sauce normally only found in Belgium....(and be honest, it's an easy google...)

actually, just googled around and most of the things that come up are ME asking on other forums for the recipe!


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Hey Bro! How's it going?

Poiret, le sirop de Liege. A lot like Poirot, zee Belzhun detecteef of Madame Christie. You read 'er bookz when you travel. Non mon ami? I use mon 'ow you say? Mon little gray cells to remembair. Zank you Captain 'astings.

BDL


----------



## rpmcmurphy (Jan 8, 2008)

yep. You know how hard I looked around for that after a most amazing meal at the Belga Queen in Brussels? 

if you google sirop de liege most of the hits that come up are me asking about it haha. 

ended up having to have someone translate a recipe for me and it took me all day to make......

even the 4 european provisions stores in my town didn't know what I was talking about.


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

That's because you asked for the company -- Sirop de Lieges. The syrup/jam/WTF is Poiret. You should be able to remember because you searched so hard, just like Poirot. BTW, I'm pretty sure that's where Christie cribbed the name, playing Poiret - Poirot like Pierrette - Pierrot the French, excuse me, Belgian puppets. On the other hand, maybe I just pulled that out of my butt. 

How's engaged life?

BDL


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

I took those streight out of my notes from school. haha 

A. The functions of a canape (base to hold the rest of the parts, the spread is to add moisture, the filling or main, and the garnish. 
B. and C you were both close enough so Ill give you those. 
D. What I ment to ask was what are the 5 types of taste (I must have been thinking of 2 questions in 1, sorry)
E. that is what we were taught in school in seafood class which I took from my notes. 
F. Was a hard one and Ill give you that as well.

When curing meats, What is TCM and what is it used for?


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Tastes I know. Bitter, sour, salty sweet, hot; those five are true of almost all Asian food "theory."

The cods -- I'm pretty sure your teacher was wrong and I''m right that there are only three true cod: Atlantic, Pacific and Greenland. One of us will have to visit teh google.

The canape -- I think that was your teacher; although I'm more than happy to be wrong. There's nothing like that in the Guide or Modern French Culinary Art. I'm pretty sure it isn't in LaRousse either -- so it's not "classic." Forget the score. I don't mean to give you a hard time over this, at least not in terms of the game. It's pretty obvious I don't know everything, or even as much as I think I know. But also that I retain more trivia than normal, healthy people and get my rocks off showing off. With that out of the way, there's a larger point which has to do with reaching beyond the limits of our respective educations for the larger themes in the craft.

BDL


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

Ok BDL Lets agree to disagree. haha 

Its all in fun, which if we are discussing this, Ill say that im most likely wrong out of the 2 of us. :lol:

anyway anwser my last question. haha


----------



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

BDL, for us mechanics in the trade (ok, me) , what is this LaRousse you and another Chef mention? Also, did you mean Guide OF Modern French Culinary Art or is there a book referred to as "the Guide" and then there is MFCA?

Oh yeah, from Wikipedia:Species in genus Gadus

At various times in the past, a very considerable number of species have been classified in this genus. However the great majority of them are now either classified in other genera, or have been recognized as simply forms of one of three species. Modern taxonomy, therefore, recognizes only three species in this genus:

* Atlantic cod, Gadus morhua
* Pacific cod, Gadus macrocephalus
* Greenland cod, Gadus ogac

All these species have a profusion of common names, most of them including the word "cod". Many common names have been used of more than one species, in different places or at different times.

[edit] Related species called cod

Cod forms part of the common name of many other fish no longer classified in the genus Gadus. Many of these are members of the family Gadidae, and several were formerly classified in genus Gadus; others are members of three related families within the order Gadiformes whose names include the word "cod": the morid cods, Moridae (100 or so species); the eel cods, Muraenolepididae (4 species); and the Eucla cod, Euclichthyidae (1 species). The tadpole cod family (Ranicipitidae) has now been absorbed within Gadidae.
Cod postage stamp, Newfoundland
Cod postage stamp, Newfoundland

Species within the order Gadiformes that are commonly called cod include:

* Arctic cod Arctogadus glacialis
* East Siberian cod Arctogadus borisovi
* Eucla cod Euclichthys polynemus
* Pelagic cod Melanonus gracilis
* Polar cod Boreogadus saida
* Poor cod Trisopterus minutus
* Rock cod Lotella rhacina
* Saffron cod Eleginus gracilis
* Small-headed cod Lepidion microcephalus
* Tadpole cod Guttigadus globosus

Some other related fish have common names derived from "cod", such as codling, codlet or tomcod. ("Codling" is also used as a name for a young cod.)

the internet is teh coolest


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

"The Guide" is pretentious cookeese for Escoffier's great book, Guide Culinaire. MFCA is a different book, even more wonderful, written by Pellaprat. 

BDL


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Quinn,

I missed your last question. TCM is "pink salt" aka "Prague powder." I don't usually use cure for sausage, but sometimes ... Y'know, sausage making is a lot more fun if someone else cleans up. 

I call it, "meat everywhere,"
BDL


----------



## maryb (Mar 21, 2008)

I used to make sausage with a friend. He would put plastic on every wall of his garage (we did this mid november when it was cold) and the floor. Tape all the seams. At the end hose everything out the door, tear down the plastic and toss the whole mess :lol: that was the same weekend we would butcher 3-5 cows also. Had group of 20 or so that cut, trimmed, ground, stuffed, etc.


----------



## tessa (Sep 9, 2007)

wow what cool questions 
ok heres a couple and no googling
what is the link between kiwi fruit and latex?
whats the difference between a pavlova and a meringue?
whats another name for a feijoa?


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

anaphylaxis aka "allergic reaction" Apparently whatever molecule causes allergic reaction to one is so much like the molecule that causes allergic reaction to the other that... [cough, cough, swell]. Avocado, bananas, melons, tomatoes (I think), too. Allergic to gloves, allergic to guacamole. Sucks.

Stumped. Thought they were the same. When you tell me the difference, can you tell me something about the history of Pavlovas? I like them quite a bit. They originated in the antipodes, didn't they?

Pineapple guava. My mother-in-law grew them in Whittier.

kiwi, feijoa, Pavlova... are you from NZ? ON EDIT: Duh. Just noticed the legend on your post. Uhmmm. Are you Xena?

BDL


----------



## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

Awesome, putting them on my wish list. I got "present credit" cause no one knows what to get me, even me. So LaRousse (sp) is another book then? making for a total of three?



wouldn't want to watch, but wouldn't be bothered doing it. Used to help grind meat for the local butcher as a kid (friend of the family and my Grandma ran an antique store in the same building). Still remember the queasy sensation the first time i saw a fresh side of beef twitch after hooking and helping lift it to the over rail. Had no problem moving and cutting it, just didn't like to watch it twitch on a hook. otherwise, labor intensive but very cool. Bravo


----------



## tessa (Sep 9, 2007)

the link between kiwi fruit and latex is they both have the same enzymes in them, kiwifruit have 144 enzymes and latex have some of those, so if your allergic to one your allergic to the other , same with the aniphilatic thingy
meringue are crunchy all the way through, pavlova is crunchy on the outside and soft and marshmellowy in the middle, pavlova has vinegar and cornstarch in it where as meringue doesnt hence the texture difference
if you listen to us kiwis then we invented the pavlova in the 1930s for the ballerina anna pavlova , cant remember who the chef was, if you listen to them australians :smoking: their the ones that invented it for the same pperson , but dont you listen to them australians :roll::roll::roll::lol::lol:

feijoas are just the most delicious fruit ever, i hope you got to try them. and yes im from New Zealand , in Auckland

and no im not xena , im too short to be a warrior princess:lol::lol:


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Yes, _LaRousse_ is the author's name and shorthand for the book which is _The LaRousse Gastronomique._ It's a sort of encyclopedia of cooking -- filled with all sorts of wonderful information and recipes. Not all the information is right and not all the recipes are good which is part of the fun.

Escoffier's_ Guide Culinaire_ seems very removed from today's cooking. Pellaprat's _Mastering the Art of French Cooking_ aka _The Great Book of French Cooking_ less so. If you go for MAFC, I recommend trying to find one of the older 1970s or '80s editions. More recipes, incredible color illustrations with fussy, fifties presentations. The most recent edition has an introduction and some editing by Jeremiah Tower, but even so, it's not as good.

I learned most of what I know about "classic French cooking" and cooking in general from the 60s editition. Given that you already know how to cook, I think you'll really love it. It's not the ideal book to learn to cook from.

Aha!

Gabrielle then.

I'm giving myself full marks for the allergy association, and you for the Pavlova stump. Yes, I've had feijoa and really like it. Have you had durian? It is the ripe brie of south-east asian fruits. Or maybe the Nijinsky.

BDL


----------



## tessa (Sep 9, 2007)

i smelt durian when i was in singapore, would just love to try it, i had a little bit in a chocolate but i really dont think i could be a good judge of its taste with such a small amount


----------



## miraz (Jun 15, 2008)

I'll try a couple for you...

1. How would you select and prepare a starfish? 

2. How would you traditionally make rennet?

3. How would you store fresh eggs without refridgeration in a tropical climate, how long would you expect them to last?

4. And finally one that I got hit with a couple of years ago....you are to provide the catering for a traditional banquet celebrating the feast of Beltane...what would you serve and why?


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

BDL -

Tinted Curing Mix. Basicly its just to help hold it on the shelf for a longer period of time and is also used to well tint the meat pink. 

So you were spot on. :smoking:

Whos keeping track of right and wrong anwsers?


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

I'm going to quit while I'm ahead. I'm all in favor of keeping a running quiz going but I'm going to reserve the right to not feel obligated to answer anymore. I hope other people keep asking and answering. I promise to come up with some more questions later. 

That said, I don't want to duck out without admitting that the starfish stumped me.

The Beltane question was a good one. I especially liked that it came out of a real experience. The first thing I'd do if asked to cater a feast was ask the clients to identify their particular religious orientation. That is, were they Wiccan and did they want a Faerie Feast with marigold custard and all the trimmings, were they more interested in cooking beef over an open fire, were they followers of Pan and want food with reputations as aphrodisiacs, or .... 

The egg and rennet questions are merely technical. Rennet -- scrape a cow's stomach. Eggs -- much more interesting question. There are a lot of ways to hold eggs outside of a refrigerator; and surprisingly most of them are almost as good. Burying in shaded dry sand, burying in shaded wet sand, coating in lard, submerged in acidulated water, submerged in lime water, holding in an open basket, to name a few. My understanding is that all of these methods are roughly equal. However, you may be thinking of some special way . Under tropical conditions, I'd guess that nearly all the eggs would survive at least a month for most of the storage methods; but that it would be highly problematic after two. Just guessing.

Anyway, the spotlight was fun for awhile but now it's giving me sunburn. Let's just throw the questions up to anyone and everyone. 

BDL


----------



## izbnso (May 12, 2007)

"Stumped. Thought they were the same. When you tell me the difference, can you tell me something about the history of Pavlovas? I like them quite a bit. They originated in the antipodes, didn't they?"

There is a "controversy" over the country of origin, but they are named after the Russian ballerina Anna Pavlova. I did have to go back to the "book" to make sure that I got my reference right. 

Bo Friberg says that the "Pavlova Cakes" was published in New Zealand in 1929 during the year of Pavlova's Australian tour. These Pavlova cakes were individual desserts.

In 1934 the owner of a hotel where Pavlova stayed during the 1929 tour had her chef create a new dessert and he came up with a dessert that served several people. Legend has it that someone declared that it was "as light as Pavlova." 

So in Friberg's book, New Zealand gets credit for the original individual Pavlovas and Australia for the larger one.


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

iz,

Very cool. 

Thanks,
BDL


----------



## miraz (Jun 15, 2008)

Having spent a little time reading round a few other threads, I can now see why this thread was put together...looking forward to seeing you announce a book, I think there is a market for a good technique orientated book.

I will leave the starfish question out there to see if someone else has a go at it.

Rennet - needs to be made from the 4th stomach of a milk-fed calf, once the animal has started eating significant amounts of solids the lining contains much less chymosin and high levels of pepsin and can only be used for a few types of cheese. The chopped stomach is placed in saltwater or whey, acidulated with wine or vinegar and left for 24 hours - the rennet is then filtered out of the solution.

Eggs - I spent a fair bit of time working on large sail powered yachts were refridgeration was minimal or non-existant, this forces you to get fairly creative about food storage, and I'm not going to mention having the kitchen tilted over at 30 degrees whilst it slams into oncoming waves!
The key thing is to prevent them dehydrating, so anything that helps seal the egg will preserve them - we used to coat them with vaseline as lard melted and made an awful mess. We found that the shells started to break down after around three weeks in acidulated water, and lasted only around ten days if stored in the open air. If the eggs are well sealed then they will last 3-4 months.

Beltane - I'd hoped you might get a chuckle out of that one, it's the sort of thing that could come through the door of many a kitchen without prior warning. In my case they were Wiccan, but they did regard it as being somewhere between a celebration of spring produce and a celebration of fertility, the colour red was significant. We produced a spread of rustic lamb and poultry dishes that used lilac, rose petals and lavendar along with a selection of wild herbs and flowers that was well received.


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Miraz,

Great new information. Thanks for it. 

Rennet: Interesting details, it's nice to start filling in some gaps. 

Eggs: I read a study on folkway methods of egg preservation 5 or 10 years ago, and vaseline didn't score well in comparison to some of the other methods. The study was conducted either by or for some sort of Eco-hippy magazine and wasn't large enough to be more than statistically suggestive -- so take it FWIW. My impression was the authors' methodology was careful and appropriate. But, IIRC, there was no analysis -- which presents a false impression in a way because lay people tend to over value the predictive power of small samples. I loved the whole "Shipwrecked" theme. 

Star fish: I don't get stumped much on fish, and am really looking forward to the answer. Rattling around somewhere in the great void inside my skull, was the impression that somewhere somehow people ate some sort of star fish. 

Beltane: People are endlessly fascinating. Amazing the things they get up to, isn't it?

Thanks again,
BDL


----------



## miraz (Jun 15, 2008)

I've come across Starfish recipes in Japan, Greece and the Pacific Islands - there are few different cultures out there that do eat them - but it is an acquired taste! So far I've resisted the temptation to hand one to an interviewee just to see what they would do with it...

I have a feeling that I might have read the same article - we tried a number of things but the vaseline worked best on a boat, on some of the longer passages we were at sea for 10-12 weeks (NZ->Med via the southern ocean) and carried enough to feed 25 people for that time with minimal spoilage.

The Beltane thing was an interesting project, I always enjoy exploring new areas of cuisine and there is a certain resonance between our profession and pagan religions that celebrate nature.


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

*Chum, sockeyes, and chinook are all species of what very common and well-loved food fish?*

 Salmon
 Kate
 Carp
 Escolar

This is an easy one:::

*What is the most common name for Dolphinfish?*


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Dolphinfish is probably best known as _mahi mahi_ among most west coast English speakers. But _dorado_ is another common name around here among Hispanics, sport fishers and everyone who goes down the coast to Baja, PV, Acapulco, etc.

The other widdle fishies are salmon. You're going to be eating a lot more of those species because this years' King salmon run is lousy, Bad King runs expected for the next few years, too. 

BDL


----------



## shipscook (Jan 14, 2007)

salmon, you forgot pink, a.k.a. humpy and coho a.k.a. silver.
chinooks, are king there are red and white, which are marketed as ivory or glacier salmon. Chum also called dog salmon are marketed as Keta. and of course sockeye are the famous reds.

mahi mahi


----------



## kuan (Jun 11, 2001)

Hey BDL, you know what? It just dawned on me, lawyers are wrong half the time!


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

At best!:roll::beer::crazy::smoking:


----------



## oldschool1982 (Jun 27, 2006)

What is the airspeed velocity of an unladen Sparrow?

How many licks does it take to get to the tootsie roll center of a tootsie pop?

Where's the Beef?

Why does the silly rabbit never get the Trix?

Name four things Bullwinkle pulls out of the hat.

What was Sherman to Mr. Peabody.

How exactly does Cheez-it get all that flavor into that little cracker?

What were the full character names of the Castaways?


----------



## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Is that the common grey sparrow, or the red breasted sparrow?....


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

I was a grip on _Rescue From Gilligan's Island_ In fact, if you want to know what I look like, look at the cover of TV Guide. That's me holding the shiny board, swimming along with the raft, as it floated in the ocean. IIRC _Rescued_ was the first time all of the characters' names were given.

On a personal note, although there's a "thou shall not cross" caste barrier between cast and crew, Bob Denver and I became buddies during the shoot, and remained friends afterwards. It's difficult to see him as anything other than silly because he wore the clown mask so well. He was a very decent man, who worked much harder at his comedy than anyone knew. He approached physical slapstick with the attitude of a dancer/athlete -- constantly practicing not only the routine but "the basics." He died way too young.

FWIW, Alan Hale Jr., and Jim Backus were very accessible as well. Hale was a very lonely guy who loved to talk. He spent no time at all in his or anyone's trailer -- if he wasn't working, he was on the set watching and talking. At the time, I was too young to appreciate the person behind the need. But if I wasn't working, I listened when he talked and occasionally asked questions which made me better than most in his eyes. Probably for that reason, Hale remembered me and looked me up through Bob, a couple of years after _Rescue_, to cater a party for him. It was one of the last parties I ever did.

Backus, by the time of _Rescue_, was already very old and not particularly well. He was the King of the Cast and enjoyed holding court. They liked sitting around and hearing how it used to be from him too. They were professional actors -- not a professional audience so that ought to give you an idea of how well he could tell a story. Very funny guy, lots of great stories, and of course the voices. A pleasure to be around.

The Ginger I worked with was Judi Baldwin. Tina Louise had the reputation of a world-class be-yotch. Bob and the rest of the cast were outspokenly grateful that she wasn't on _Rescue_. Never met her myself, just sayin' is all. Baldwin did the sequel MOW, _Castaways;_ but not the third MOW, _Globetrotters_. Backus was so ill by the time they shot _Globetrotters_ they wrote him out. He insisted on working, so Sherwood made a few changes and wrote a little scene for him. Bob told me

Anyway, Gilligan (they ducked giving the "full name" in_ Rescue_, but I've googled it since and found it may have been Willie Gilligan), Jonas Grumby (Skipper), Thurston Howell III, Eunice Wentworth Howell (Lovey), Marianne Summers, Ginger Grant, and Roy Hinkley.

BDL


----------



## quinn01 (Apr 22, 2006)

What the balls BDL, haha, I thought you were done anwsering. If I knew you were going to anwser them, I would have made them harder. 

Here, Ill go start a new topic where we can just post questions for anyone to anwser. :chef:


----------



## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

I'm not doing this to stump BDL, rather, it's something I really want to know and which has been bothering me for quite a while.

My recollection is that there are four basic cuts to a chuck roast - one is the neck, another may be the center cut. Are these correct, and what are the other cuts? For extra points, what is the difference in muscle structure and fat between these four cuts?

Signed,

Puzzled in Pacoima


----------



## ghettoracingkid (Feb 19, 2007)

Its more like this. There are supposed to be 4 parts

Base/Vehicle: Can be edible or not. Just something to carry the product for easily handlin and eating.

Spread/Dressing: What ever you want to call it but it is optional and is if the item needs it.

Filling: main compenint

Garnish: IMO optional but hey its classical.

BTW. Ive enjoyed this thread so far


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

In Pacoima, Ese?

I'm a little puzzled by the term "chuck roast." There are several chuck roasts in the chuck primal. The primal itself is divided into the following sup-primals and cuts: Blade roast, blade steak, cross-rib, arm roast, 7 bone roast, top blade steak, shoulder pot roast, mock tender, under blade, short ribs, and flanken ribs.

You should bookmark the "ask the meatman" site; and if you're anatomically hip, there's a site called "bovine myology." Both very good, complete sites. 

Puzzled in Monrovia,
BDL


----------



## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

Yes, the primal. Ever since Merle Ellis went off the air and stopped writing his column, and Lenny's on Shattuck closed, I've had no sources for meat references. Thanks for the pointers. In any case, I thought the neck was part of that big primal. My mom used to buy neck meat and tenderloin to grind into hamburger.

The difference in cuts from the primal may be a result of the history and origin of meat cutting on the different coasts. 

shel


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Shel,

Well, at least the neck is from the same end of the beef as the chuck. The tenderloin, not so much. When your mom said "neck," the butcher knew what part of the chuck she and the other NJMs meant. It might be the same place "stew meat" comes from, I just don't know enough to guess.

There are lots of regional differences in meat cut names -- which I mostly learned about barbecuing and in barbecue forums (or fora if you insist). However, I believe the list of Chuck subprimals and cuts I listed are standard names used throughout the country. I skipped over some of the really small cuts, like the "flat iron steak," which is taken by cutting across the top-blade, but I don't think that's what you're getting at.

BDL


----------



## shel (Dec 20, 2006)

When mom said tenderloin, she meant the real tenderloin. Neck is part of the chuck primal - checked it out at the bovine myology site just to be sure. http://bovine.unl.edu/bovine3D/eng/S..._id=1056388973 That was the hamburger I ate growing up. I honestly don't know how good that combination was. Mom was an awful cook, however, the meat burnt well. She could reallyget a char on it :smoking:

Some day I'll tell you about her "smoke alarm" beef patties <LOL>

scb


----------

