# Greeκ recipes for the most known dishes



## Guest (Sep 8, 2010)

Hello everyone.

The reason for this post are the incredibly wrong and inaccurate recipes I found in the internet, labeled as "traditional greek". You may think that it's silly to complain, but as a person who loves cooking and at the same time his culinary heritage is greek, I do feel offended. I believe that most of you are aware thet the greek food found outside greece is a bad imitation. How about seeing how the 'real thing" is made? 

Greek cuisine likes strong tastes. Usualy, sweet is not mixed with salty and garlic and onion are two favored ingredients.

There are tons of pies, which emerged as a way to use leftover food. Also, from the refugees coming back from asia minor come foods that love cymin, cinnamon and other strong spices, that balance on the edge with the salty tastes they accompany. There are many variations for almost every dish, but I'll try to give you the most basic, generaly accepted forms of these dishes, as I know them from my family.

Let's see some basic, world known dishes and how they are actually made in greece.

The "Greek" salad.

This is a salad that actually doesn't exist in our menus. The salad that people in the states try to copy is called "country salad"- χωριάτικη. It can have some variations, but a base is this:

Slice tomatoes, onion ,feta (or white cheese if you can't find feta) and a cucomber. Add sliced green pepper if you want, and some olives. Season with some salt and oregano, and a tiny bit of black pepper (this is not a spicy salad- do not overdo it). Add olive oil to taste (does not need to be to much).

Little tips: Break the cheese with your hands. After mixing all the ingredients in the bowl, let it sit for some time (half an hour or so) to let flavors mix. Serve along with fresh bread, which you may (and should) dip into the salad.

Usualy, we use our tomatoes cold, since they come out of the freezer. It is better however to let them get to room temperature.

Possible variations: Some people add "παξιμάδι"-paksimathi (th read like in "the"), what you would call crackers. BUT not the usual snack crackers. see a photo : http://www.nline.gr/i041/1209_01.jpg . If you can't find greek crackers omit them.. If you do find, break them with your hands (don't let them be crumps), mix with the rest of the salad.

dip sauces.

Tzatziki-" τζατζικι".

This is yogurt mixed with cucomber, garlic, dill and a little olive oil. The cucomber MUST NOT be mushed, but cut in short stripes, and the yogurt you will use should be fairly thick. It is not supposed to be watery, like a dressing, so try to strain as much water as possible from you ingredients. Suit the amount of garlic to your taste ( I consider the best tzatziki to be the one with the most garlic- in restaurats this is usually avoided for obvious reasons ), add black pepper and serve with an olive a a teaspoon of olive oil on the top. Dont overdo it with the oil, or your tzatziki will be runny and we don't want that.

Skordalia- "σκορδαλιά"

Traditionaly this is made on The Annunciation of the Blessed Virgin Mary.

Contains mushed potatoes, garlic (lots, lots of it) and oil (also lots of it). It will send you straight to bed 

Basic recipe:

1 kg of potatoes

5-6 cloves of garlic

1 cup of oil

the juice from 2 lemons

Boil the potatoes and mush them, do not add anything inside.

Crush the garlic and mix with the other ingredients.

Now, because this is 2010 you will propably put it in a mixer. Word has it that the best skordalia is made in Agion Oros, where the monks crush and mix everything by hand for hours untill it is all smooth.

It is used to accompany fried fish.

The Mousaka-"μουσακάς"

Mousaka is a dish consisting of eggplants, potatoes, minced meat and Bechamel. Take your oven pan cut the potatoes and eggplants and put them in the pan so that its bottom is covered. you want to have a floor of potatoes and a floor of eggplants, about half a cm fat each. Lightly fry the potatoes and eggplant you have, just to make them softer. Do not cook the potatoes completely, and let them sit on a paper to get the extra oil of. Take an onion, chop it in small pieces and get it in a pan with some olive oil (not too much-just cover the bottom). When it starts becoming transparent, and the meat, and toss around to avoid clumps. Add some diced tomatoes and garlic, some parsley and let it cook on high heat until there is very little water left. Season with pepper and salt and maybe a pinch of cinnamon (very very little). Get your potatoes and eggplants in the pan, create a floor and then another one with the meat.

For the Bechamel:

6 tablespoons of flour for every 2 cups of milk. Mix the flour and some milk in a blender, then add into a pan with the remaining milk and turn the heat on high.You want to stir it the whole time with a wooden spoon, because it burns very easily. Add 2-3 tablespoons of butter, salt, peper and a pinch of nutmeg (can be omited). It will thicken as you cook it. When it is thick enough, get it of the fire, wait for 1 minute then add one egg(adjust for larger quantities), while stirring vigorously. And some ground cheese and then add on top of your oven pan (over the meat). Top with cheese and then bake at 180 C until the top is golden brown. Let it cool before you try cutting it.

I'd love to hear your thoughts, and answer any questions you may have


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

I don't know where to begin.


----------



## Guest (Sep 8, 2010)

a good salad is the first thing to get on the table, so start from that


----------



## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Originally Posted by *Koukouvagia* 


> I don't know where to begin.


How about starting with the tomatoes?

BDL


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

boar_d_laze said:


> Originally Posted by *Koukouvagia*
> 
> How about starting with the tomatoes?
> 
> BDL


Yes that's the first thing that made me go WHAT?

Instead of nitpicking I will say Hello Spiro, welcome to the forum. If you take a look around the site you will see that it is full of truly experienced chefs and home cooks and most of the people here really know their way around a good greek dish among many other types of cuisine. So please stick around and get to know us a little better and you might find a proper recipe for bechamel along the way. Mas noiazei!


----------



## Guest (Sep 8, 2010)

This recipe for the bechamel is in our "Chelemente",which I can say has served both my mother and grandmother very well 

What your objection? The blender thing is an easy way to avoid clumps of flour in your cream. 

Please, don't take this the wrong way. I have no doubt that people here are skilled and know their craft ( or should I say art? ). I'd like to see what foreign chefs think (and know-please read further) of our cuisine, how they utilise the combinations and flavors and more than anything, to ask them to spread the "real thing". Not only about greek cuisine, but for every cuisine.

I say what people know of our cuisine, because have seen some incredible things named "greek", where in fact they relate to it as much as I relate to a martian.

For example, I remember watching iron chef america on tv, and on that battle there was a woman chef saying she has greek roots etc, and she utilizes flavors from many parts in world etc. So she says I'll make a mousaka. And guess what. She took boiled (or lightly fried, can't remember right now) potato, put it in a  ramekin and topped it with minced duck meat. Venturing a little too far, didn't she? 

Again, don't get me wrong. I'm here for conversation with people that seem (and I'm sure they are) serious about what they do.

@Koukouvagia:Variomoun na kanw kanoniko account kai xrisimopoihsa auto apo to facebook. Vazw "mi se noiazei" sto epwnimo giati profanws...de se noiazei 

oh, and what's going on with the tomatoes?


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

I don't have any objection to you, I just think authenticity is not that important. You don't have to be greek to cook good greek food and unless somebody asks me for an authentic recipe then who am I to correct someone else's interpretation of greek food?

Your post ignores the fact that greek food is regional and diverse. I don't use any of your recipes because I grew up cooking those foods in a different way. Not better, not more authentic, just different. Your version of tzatziki is different than mine but yours is not anymore authentic than mine. And why must it be served with an olive for garnish? Personally I've been tired of seeing it served this way since 1982 - there must be a way to be more creative. See you're upset that people don't know or understand authentic greek cooking, but I'm more upset that greeks try to hold greek cuise back and don't allow it to evolve. I don't care to read the Tselemente though my mom did. If I were to read an old book about cuisine it would be Escoffier, a book that most people know. If you want a better recipe and method for bechamel you will definitely find it here.

Something more important about greek food than "authentic recipies" is the concept of cooking seasonally. Freshness of ingredients is the most important element in our cuisine. So let's go back to your salad. As a greek I would never ever put a frozen tomato in a salad. A greek will put tomatoes in a salad as long tomatoes were growing and when they're out of season they put something else in their salad. Also you forgot the vinegar. Furthermore, paximadi is regional, it's not used in every part of greece. And you don't have to put it in the salad, you can wet it and keep it on the side.

So sharing recipes is great, we all share around here. But you can't post a recipe saying it's the real thing as if you're correcting all of us because that's silly. If you're open to it you can find an excellent recipe for bechamel... there's really only one acceptable recipe for it actually but we'll be happy to share. Which part of greece are you from? And if you're ever in NY you should check out Michael Psillakis' restaurant, he's doing some amazing things that ain't your grandma's greek food for sure.


----------



## siduri (Aug 13, 2006)

I was taken aback by the frozen tomato too, Koukouvagia, but then i saw there were other words in English that were close but not right and i thought, he must mean refrigerator.  I doubt anyone puts tomatoes in the freezer.  He said you can let them get to room temperature, but he uses them cold, which means cold, not frozen, I think.  I don;t know Greek, but maybe the word for refrigerator is something like ice box, which sounds like it means freezer? 

Anyway, I agree with you that cuisines are best when they develop and evolve, and that rigid traditionalism is counter-productive to good cooking.  I remember you saying your relatives refused to eat any more of the potatoes they were already enjoying when they found out they had butter. I could really identify with that!  Italian cooking is a lot like that too, no fish and cheese, no cappuccino after dinner, a "what are you crazy" attitude . 

But while i get really annoyed at the purists as we've seen in many threads like about fish and cheese, etc, I think maybe Spiros is not a snob so much as very passionate about his culture.  And he hasn't been here long, so let's not scare him away.  We're really harmless, Spiros. 

By the way, that way of making bechamel is one i found in the time-life series of cooking of the world - i don;t remember which volume.  I was surprised to see bechamel made that way and called bechamel.  The series seemed pretty well-researched, and maybe that's the way a lot of people make it, or how they make it in a particular area.  I wonder how it differs in taste. Certainly not all traditional methods have the best results - my mother in law's tomato sauce was not very good!  Her stuffed peppers were full of bread and oil - not much else.


----------



## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

my english is rusty, so please don't stay on that.

You must think by now that I am a cold blooded, snob bastard, who only eats the real, authentic greek food, and yells when it is served in another way. Let me tell you, it isn't true. I love a good dish, no matter what it is, and I am willing to try almost anything new.

Those recipes above are the way I know from my family, and the way I have seen other people do it, but I cannot predict every bit of variation every one uses- I want to hear what versions you make koukouvagia, and I'm not here to tell you "Hey, stop, that's wrong", because this is cooking and you cook however you like. But no matter how good soy sauce make taste on gyros (never tried it though ), you can't say that's the traditional way of making souvlaki. I get upset on people claiming to show traditional recipes, which cannot be found anywhere here.

You said:

"Your post ignores the fact that greek food is regional and diverse."

I said:

"There are many variations for almost every dish"

/img/vbsmilies/smilies/lookaround.gif

"to correct someone else's interpretation of greek food? "

Well, you see it is not a poem or the bible in order to have many interpretations. It is greek if there are greeks making it, it is not if there aren't. isn't that what greek means? Remeber that it can still taste great, I don't object to that

"Also you forgot the vinegar."

I never put vinegar in my salad and most people I know don't, but yes it is also done. I should have written, it you are right.

" But you can't post a recipe saying it's the real thing as if you're correcting all of us because that's silly."

It is just matter of words, but isn't greek food the food made in Greece? I live in athens and my mother is from Asia minor and this is the way we do things. Someone else may be doing it in another way for various reasons. Still, my version is more real than the "greek salad". I think however that the bases I gave are acceptable by most people...

Please do not confuse what can be called greek or traditional greek with what tastes good.

"very passionate about his culture"

My culinary culture, yes. You see, I believe every cuisine is very unique in it's own way, so it is important to know a cuisine, before you atempt to make your own version of it, or it might end up being a very bad joke (a good tasting bad joke).

The so called "greek salad" you make in the states does taste nice, in fact I sometimes make something like that at home (with less things incide), but you cannot call it traditional greek.

yes I mean the refrigerator, sorry /img/vbsmilies/smilies/biggrin.gif

(I couldn't tell you to use frozen tomatoes for a salad, it's insane)


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

siduri said:


> ...Anyway, I agree with you that cuisines are best when they develop and evolve, and that rigid traditionalism is counter-productive to good cooking. I remember you saying your relatives refused to eat any more of the potatoes they were already enjoying when they found out they had butter. I could really identify with that! Italian cooking is a lot like that too, no fish and cheese, no cappuccino after dinner, a "what are you crazy" attitude .
> 
> But while i get really annoyed at the purists as we've seen in many threads like about fish and cheese, etc, I think maybe Spiros is not a snob so much as very passionate about his culture. And he hasn't been here long, so let's not scare him away. We're really harmless, Spiros.
> 
> ...


Haha yes you remember correctly! I just spent the whole summer in greece and have learned by now that I simply won't cook for many people there because they have such traditionalist views on food. My family is very open though so we make great meals at home. Another similar story like the potato story is I was cooking dinner for my family and some friends happened to stop by unannounced (this is very typical behavior in villages) so we asked them to stay for dinner. Unfortunately I had already cooked and I knew it would seem strange to the visitors. Part of the meal was lamb chops and tzatziki except I hadn't made them in the traditional regional way. Of course I grilled them medium because no matter where I am I can't eat an overcooked piece of meat but these folks were horrified to find pink in the lamb. We had to put them back on the grill and destroy them before they would touch them. And of course I hadn't made the tzatziki in the traditional way with just cucumbers and yogurt, I decided to put some fresh mint in it to compliment the lamb. It was delicious but to them it tasted funny because "mint doesn't go in tzatziki." And the salad? Well I had put balsamico in it and that didn't go over very well either. It was difficult to enjoy our dinner since some people at the table thought it was weird.

Well I don't mean to come across as harsh, of course I am very nice in general and I enjoy discussing food on this forum. I welcome all people especially greeks! So don't take me the wrong way Spiro, I'm just making conversation. You should check out the Food and Cooking Discussion forum, there are lots of interesting discussions there about cooking. And nobody thinks you are cold blooded or any of those things you said, we're just as passionate about food as you are. I don't really like greek salad anyway so I was quite happy to discover that other salads existed once I moved away from home.

On a more philosophical note, is a salad a salad without acid? Personally I get quite offended about how much vinegar I see greeks putting in their salads (alot!) so clearly you can see that we have very different experiences in the same country. In my experience greek people from different regions are more foreign to each other than people from different countries. My inlaws are from a different island than I am and their versions of greek food are completely foreign to me. One part of greece uses dill another part of greece says no dill, it gets really confusing and we are quite at odds with eachother. Just like in Italy, the type of food you eat in Torrino is completely different from the food you eat in Sicily. It's the same with us greeks. And I don't like to get too sentimental about my mother's or grandmother's food. Just because my grandmother made it this way doesn't mean it's the best way. Everybody has a grandmother.


----------



## siduri (Aug 13, 2006)

Koukouvagia said:


> Well I don't mean to come across as harsh, of course I am very nice in general and I enjoy discussing food on this forum.


I can vouch for that! Just passionate, as so many of us are here and it can possibly appear to be a bit strong at times.


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

siduri said:


> I can vouch for that! Just passionate, as so many of us are here and it can possibly appear to be a bit strong at times.


A bit strong? You can say that again. I am a Kretan after all and we're nothing if not headstrong... like the minotaur.


----------



## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

_......like the minotaur._

Does that mean you're horny?

Sorry. But with an opening like that, how could I resist. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/crazy.gif


----------



## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

One thing we have to keep in mind, even before looking at family-to-family variations, is that countries like Greece and Italy are not uniform wholes. They are, in effect, confederations of culturally similar groups. This is especially apparent in their cuisines.

So, we could say about Greek (or Italian, or Mideastern) cuisine is that it's based on a commonality of ingredients. But how those ingredients are used varies within a common context. So how they handle an ingredient in, say, Macedonia might be radically different than how that same ingredient is used in Crete. Yet they are both authentically "Greek."


----------



## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

I'm over the idea "pink is raw", and I eat my calf and beef at least pink, if not red inside. My mother (and most of my friends) still can't stand it, and propably they never will.  However, I believe pork and lamp have to be white and it actually can be done without sacrificing the juices, if you know how to do it. Until now, my experience in europe is "well done= burn the meat", i hope the restaurants were just crappy. Oh well, once in France a cook asked me how I want my meat (asked in french and gave me two options- I don't speak french), so I answered "well done"(obviously non of the 2). He said "that's more than we cook here!"

Mint in tzatziki sounds like a nice and fresh addition, but yes tzatziki needs drill(and some incredible amounts of garlic). It is it's character, you can't just take it away! It must have been a hell of a sauce though.

"to them it tasted funny "

you where in a village, what did you expect? and seriously, doesn't things like that happen to all regions of the world where people are more traditional? even when they are not, they may be reluctant to try something new, or different. I've even heard that skewering meat like we do in easter is barbaric 

There is something else I wanted to ask, koukouvagia, how do you(or your family) make gemista (suffed tomatoes)?


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

KY I wish I could say that was the first time I heard that joke. 

Your story in france reminds me of steakhouses here in the states.  At very good steakhouses they will refuse to cook your steak past medium.  They simply won't do it.  Once I went to a very nice restaurant and I ordered a yellowtail tuna dish well done.  It was before I had gotten used to the idea of eating raw fish.  The waiter came back to the table and informed me that the chef would not cook the tuna, only sear it because it was sushi grade and if I would like to choose something else instead.  I was horrified at the time but I now realize my mistake and what I missed out on.

I make my gemista generally vegetarian.  Lots of grated onion, grated zucchini, grated tomatoes, parsley, lots of mint, olive oil, salt/pepper and that's it.  Dolmades same way.  If my husband whines I put minced pork or beef in there too but I don't prefer it with meat.  I do like to experiment though and I'm playing around with the idea of stuffing them with israeli couscous next time.

I've never liked dill in tzatziki.  Plain yes, parsley yes, mint yes, spring onion yes, but dill no.  It's strange because I like dill in general, but not in tzatziki.


----------



## Guest (Sep 9, 2010)

Koukouvagia said:


> KY I wish I could say that was the first time I heard that joke.
> 
> Your story in france reminds me of steakhouses here in the states. At very good steakhouses they will refuse to cook your steak past medium. They simply won't do it. Once I went to a very nice restaurant and I ordered a yellowtail tuna dish well done. It was before I had gotten used to the idea of eating raw fish. The waiter came back to the table and informed me that the chef would not cook the tuna, only sear it because it was sushi grade and if I would like to choose something else instead. I was horrified at the time but I now realize my mistake and what I missed out on.
> 
> ...


never heard of zucchini in gemista before, or mint. Mint sounts nice, but I must admit I almost hate zucchini, unless it's deep fried. I also don't like meat in them, have you tried putting raisins and pine nuts in? My mother always made it that way, its incredible! Although most people don't do it, or haven't even heard of it (I had some weird faces when I said how we make them lol).

It's funny because I generaly don't like neither parsley nor dill, but they must be in tzatziki.

May I ask, how does "greek style" ( we call it drained here) yogurt taste there? I see lots of people in the states (greeks living there as well) puting lots of lemon juice in it, isn't it too sour ? Because the first time you will yogurt here you might feel there is something wrong with it (yes it's that sour)


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

Grated zucchini adds a great flavor and goes very well with the mint.  I also like to stuff zucchini by cutting it in chunks and scooping out the middle and putting the rice in there.  Along with tomatoes and peppers I also stuff potatoes, eggplant, onions, and in between everything in the roasting pan I put dolmades and stuffed zucchini flowers.  My husband grew up eating gemista with raisins.  I've eaten them many times this way but I think the sweetness of the raisins interferes with the sweetness of the tomato.  I have eaten dolmades in turkish restaurants with raisins and pine nuts and they are incredible this way especially since they have lots of cumin in them.  The combination is super.

Have you been to the states?  I've never seen anyone putting lemon juice on their yogurt so I can't tell you why they do it.  Greek yogurt is a very popular yogurt here in the states.  It's very fashionable right now.  For a very long time americans liked soft yogurts with fruit on the bottom of the cups but nowadays I see lots of people eating greek yogurt with honey and nuts and real fruit.  They also cook with it a lot too.  I don't see much difference between the yogurt here and there, it's very similar although here I eat 2% which is sour and in greece I eat whole yogurt which is a little sweeter.


----------



## Guest (Sep 10, 2010)

I've never been there, but most recipes originating from residents of the states (greek or not) have lemon in it, which made me wonder...

Zucchini flowers are a great treat if you stuff them with feta and then fry them...Perfet for a cold beer in the summer or some ouzo! By the way, where do you get yours? They have to be very fresh in order to be used, so I can't find them very easily.

Cumin is incredible in soutzoukakia, along with a pinch of cinnamon in the sauce


----------



## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

You're certainly right about squash blossoms needing to be fresh. I'm lucky to get them from the garden to the kitchen without them wilting.

Most squash flowers used commercially in the U.S. come from Israel. They must do something to keep them fresh, though, because it's a long trip, even by air.


----------



## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

Spiros Mi Se Noiazei said:


> I've never been there, but most recipes originating from residents of the states (greek or not) have lemon in it, which made me wonder...


Somebody has given you incorrect information. It's unfair to generalize what american people do especially if you've never been here. Lemon is an amazing ingredient that can elevate a lot of dishes, but not all. And quite the opposite of what you say is true. Greeks put lemon on everything, not americans.

KY I've always gotten my blossoms from the farmer's market, next time I'll ask them if they're locally produced. I've never seen them in supermarkets though alas I don't cook with them often in the states. In greece my family has lots of courgettes in their garden and we eat them all summer long. I meant to experiment with this recipe I saw on Jamie at Home but never got around to it. Time to head to the farmer's market and see if they have some still available.


----------



## jomead (Sep 19, 2010)

Spiros Mi Se Noiazei said:


> dip sauces.
> Tzatziki-" τζατζικι".
> 
> This is yogurt mixed with cucomber, garlic, dill and a little olive oil. The cucomber MUST NOT be mushed, but cut in short stripes, and the yogurt you will use should be fairly thick. It is not supposed to be watery, like a dressing, so try to strain as much water as possible from you ingredients. Suit the amount of garlic to your taste ( I consider the best tzatziki to be the one with the most garlic- in restaurats this is usually avoided for obvious reasons /img/vbsmilies/smilies//biggrin.gif), add black pepper and serve with an olive a a teaspoon of olive oil on the top. Dont overdo it with the oil, or your tzatziki will be runny and we don't want that.


I have enjoyed the above conversation and look forward to using these recipes...particularly the Tzatziki as I love it!


----------

