# Some men, you just can't reach...



## prairiechef (May 22, 2010)

It's hard work, yes... but it's not brain surgery. Sometimes, it seems that there are those in this business that should be, I dunno, sorting coloured gravel for fish tanks or something.

I have one cook who is honestly retrogressing (is that a word? if not, it is for my purposes  ) in his abilities, and I am hampered by labour laws, and the "verbal, written, written, fired" rule that my company adheres to. Frustrating as hell. It would be nice to be able to say "get the hell out, and learn to mud drywall", but i simply can't. So I have to wait. "Coach him" (again) on how to make a friggin' Panini. Wait a while for him to "have a chance to improve". Then continue the process.

I wonder, often, why people who have no love for food get into this business. Is it a case of "I can't do anything else"? Or "I dropped out of high school and have no options"? But it seems to me that the business is lousy with clockpunchers.


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## chefross (May 5, 2010)

I feel your pain. Just reading your letter made my blood pressure go up a couple notches.


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## Guest (Jun 6, 2010)

there is a surprising amount of people who have no love for cooking in culinary school... what surprises me even more is the lack of love for food...


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## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

but panini's are so complicated,, they have , like, a top slice of bread and a bottom, not to mention all those ...things... that go inside./img/vbsmilies/smilies/rolleyes.gif

I'll never forget one time I was "prep" and lunch cook for a place. The hours were great, the pay ok and the work heavy enough to keep me busy without driving me crazy. Once I was so swamped (3 different groups of the Red Hat Society at once, some 120 people in 30 minutes and just me on the line) that I wasn't able to get quite all the prep done. So when the evening line cook came in I said "hey man, your gonna need to to trim up some chicken breasts for tonight." he sneers at me and says" I didn't leave my job at Arby's to become some b**ch of a prep cook. what happened? You get more then 5 people in for lunch today?."

luckily for him, the Chef heard him say it. She turned to me and said"go get a beer then clock off."

guess who was in working next to me the next day learning how to prep all that food. he literally started crying saying"he was a cook and didn't need to know how to make pesto or butcher a tenderloin for Filet Mignon, that was B**ch work. I think my eyes rolled so far back in my head I bruised my brain.


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## leeniek (Aug 21, 2009)

Gunnar.. that's a great story!   Too bad so sad for the guy huh?  I bet he never pulled that kind of attitude again. 

Sadly clockpunchers exist in every business and sometimes it seems we have more of them than dedicated workers and that totally stinks.

Prarie Chef, I feel your pain... I have had to (and still do ) have to deal with some clockpunchers and it is super frustrating.  These guys turn up on time (most of the time) and do the bare minimum amount of work and always seem to be doing something when you look at them but at the end of the day they have accomplished very little.  We've cut their shifts and with their menality they see it as more days off instead of a warning sign.  If this keeps up with them, even though one of them is a damn good closer they will be out the door permanently. 

Sorry to hijack your thread but I was super frustrated with clockpunchers today...

I was working crepe station and for the record I HATE everything about the station and while I can do it very well and run the crepe and lunch board at the same time.. I hate the station.. it is messy and goopy and honestly my apron was crusty after a day on crepes.  Not my idea of a good time but it is part of my job so I sucked it up and ran the station.   I ran out of sliced strawberries and no one had any on the line so I asked the clockpuncher to slice two flats of berries.  He proceeded to pull a couple of flats and wash one, then go and visit with the dishwashers.  In the meantime I got slammed with orders that needed sliced berries and I had no time to slice as I went so I called out rather loudly " hey Bob, were are my sliced strawberries.. I need 750ml of them for an order right now on the fly!" He ran back to the prep table and did them but as soon as they were done he was slacking again.  I don't get the mentality of people who feel they are entitled to a paycheck.. last time I checked wages were earned not a given right. 

Ok vent over...


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## joshua47 (Apr 24, 2010)

Haha, wow, Gunnar. That guy needed more of a reality check than that, but it's a good start! As a chef of mine has said, sometimes it's two hours past closing on the worst night ever and the dishes still need to be done. What're you going to do? Wash the damn dishes. Your title means nothing when things need to get done.

Actually, in a way, your title means everything when things need to get done. The way I see it, the higher you are in any job, the more responsibilities you have. Is dish washing cooking? No. Is it a part of the kitchen? You bet your ass. So if it needs to get done and you're the only one able to do it right then, shut your mouth and do your work.

Complaining about prep is even worse, though! That's directly part of the process of making a meal. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/crazy.gif


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## gypsy2727 (Mar 9, 2010)

A dishwasher is one of the most valuable assets to a kitchen.....and who is doing all the prep? hmmmmmmmmm

I have lent myself to the dish pit many a day and proud to do it ...actually relaxing in a way.( not that it is anything close to an easy job) I get paid the same no matter where I am in a day. Let's put our hands together for the people that make are kitchen run smoothly! /img/vbsmilies/smilies/peace.gif


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## joshua47 (Apr 24, 2010)

I wasn't speaking of the actual value of a dishwasher. I was simply commenting on some people's attitudes (like the person Gunnar worked with) when it comes to doing jobs that are dubbed beneath one's position. My point is that, in a kitchen, no job is beneath anyone. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/wink.gif


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## skatz85 (Mar 3, 2010)

to origanal poster, i hate those kind of people. they do it because its a hobby or they think its fun or most of the time its cause mommy and daddy paid for it(not all but most). no love for food, no work ethics or experience. i hate those people. especially when they try to tell you how to do something,and think they know it


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Ah.. "those" kind of people....

 Had a prep cook once, aced the interview, and then he'd always show up up , ummm.. "mind altered" .  My shifts for him were 8-3 m-f, but he'd show up at 8:30 complaining about the bus routes.  So I'd play along with him, "sure" I'd say, "if you can't make the 7:30 bus. why don't you come in at 9 ?" And, for the first day, he would, then he'd complain about the 9:00  bus, and I'd tell him to come in an hour later.  Mind you, I never let him stay past 3.  This went on untill he'd show up at 12:00, and I had to put my foot down, minimum working hours are 3 hrs per day.  End of the  pay period he darn near has a heart attack,  more than half of his paycheck is missing!  I couldn't keep a straight face when I told him that he requested the shorter working hours.  Left  pretty darn quick, but to this day, I never knew if he caught on to what I was doing.....


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## gypsy2727 (Mar 9, 2010)

foodpump said:


> Ah.. "those" kind of people....
> 
> Had a prep cook once, aced the interview, and then he'd always show up up , ummm.. "mind altered" . My shifts for him were 8-3 m-f, but he'd show up at 8:30 complaining about the bus routes. So I'd play along with him, "sure" I'd say, "if you can't make the 7:30 bus. why don't you come in at 9 ?" And, for the first day, he would, then he'd complain about the 9:00 bus, and I'd tell him to come in an hour later. Mind you, I never let him stay past 3. This went on untill he'd show up at 12:00, and I had to put my foot down, minimum working hours are 3 hrs per day. End of the pay period he darn near has a heart attack, more than half of his paycheck is missing! I couldn't keep a straight face when I told him that he requested the shorter working hours. Left pretty darn quick, but to this day, I never knew if he caught on to what I was doing.....


too bad for you


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## leeniek (Aug 21, 2009)

One of the guys I am having issues with is a great closer but does the mind altered thing too much and he has viewed his extra hours off as more time off rather than wtf is up why are they cutting my hours hmm.. I wonder when he is down to one three hours shift if he will finally clue in?


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Yup.

Those one-liners are gettig awful stale, doncha think?


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## gypsy2727 (Mar 9, 2010)

Some people can say it in one word ......and some can not


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Fair enough, you chose to do on the forums, instead of PMing me.

So lets get this out in the open:

What's your Beef with me?


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## just jim (Oct 18, 2007)

I think it's because you're Canadian.

Oh wait.....


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## gypsy2727 (Mar 9, 2010)

foodpump said:


> Fair enough, you chose to do on the forums, instead of PMing me.
> 
> So lets get this out in the open:
> 
> What's your Beef with me?


are you talkin to me?


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Yup.

Like I said, you can PM me, or if you want, you can tell me and everyone else on this forum what your beef is with me.

But lets get this thing settled.


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## gypsy2727 (Mar 9, 2010)

I do not have a beef with you , where did you get such a notion?


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

When I post, you usually copy and paste my post and then add simple one liner, as in the above post.

Many people have disagreed with what I write, and many will use facts, logic, or first hand experience to back up their disagreements with me.  This I can respect, and I value their effort, after all this is a forum.

But I do not respect copy and paste with the added one line of "too bad for you".......

Can you elaborate on this?


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## gypsy2727 (Mar 9, 2010)

Oh as a Pro I thought we were here to support each other not take offence .....apolagies if any of my comments were takin on the negative ...that would be from your side

Elaboration is not what I am here for but if you insist ...I feel bad for you having all thees problems with your staff. I promise not to do that again.

Peace

Gypsy


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## greg (Dec 8, 1999)

Oh fun.

Foodpump, it's just the internet, don't sweat it.

Gypsy, you say you're not here  to elaborate. When you do that, you leave what you say open to interpretation, so don't be so surprised when someone takes it the wrong way.

Now, if we can go back to on-topic griping, that'd be swell.


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## gypsy2727 (Mar 9, 2010)

Yes Greg let's get back to havin fun on this site!

Only good intentions

Gypsy


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## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

Awww Man..is that it?  I was hoping for frozen legs of ham at dawn on a 2x4 suspended over two double fryers.  When they abolished dueling and let the lawyers take over it became a slightly sadder world.


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## rat (Mar 2, 2006)

Look out people, on the internet everyone is 6 foot 5, black belt and ripped.


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## just jim (Oct 18, 2007)

rat said:


> Look out people, on the internet everyone is 6 foot 5, black belt and ripped.


Everyone?!

Man, I thought it was just me.


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## kuan (Jun 11, 2001)

Back on track.  This is the pro forum.


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## cstanford (Jul 3, 2008)

Gotta tell 'ya that at the end of the day, and over a drink, a guy that gets sick of making paninis and ends up just not giving a $hit is most likely my kind of guy.  I'd probably pull him aside and acknowledge that it sucks working in a place that has sandwiches on the menu - just commiserate and he'll probably pull it back together. 

I'm not sure if a "love of cooking" ever did apply to the preparation of over-wrought sandwiches.


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## rat (Mar 2, 2006)

There is a fine line between love of cooking and love of having a place to live and your bills paid.


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## Guest (Jun 11, 2010)

Don't be too hard on the seekers we were all there once. I started beck in the 80's as a grill cook and salad prep. Back then there were few chefs and lots of restaurant managers. The opportunity to learn to cook was the master chefs program and that was it. You have never been abused like they were there, so I have heard. Even as a line cooks we were targets for pan's, spatulas, and even hot food. I did experience that. That's why I became a butcher for 16 years and then came back. I said the heart attack shops of the line cook was not within my ability so I am now a Frat house chef. I did get an opportunity to go to a tech. school for cooking. That was the best decision of my life, (I am slow at catching on and figuring things out for my self). I have grate things to look forward to. I get to wake up everyday and say " I get to cook and get paid for it" what a wonderful world.


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## cstanford (Jul 3, 2008)

rat said:


> There is a fine line between love of cooking and love of having a place to live and your bills paid.


Maybe. Or a fine line between making sandwiches all day and sticking a gun in your mouth.


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## leeniek (Aug 21, 2009)

I think it all comes down to the fact that some people are just not cut out for this business. Some of them get into it thinking it's a piece of cake but it really is hard work.

We lost a newbie this week. It was her first kitchen job and I think it was more than what she expected. She told one of the cooks that it is "too much work for too little pay". Yes we pay based on experience and yes we do not pay as much as other places but... we are only open during the day (we close at 3pm), our owners are by far the best ones I have ever worked for, the KM is amazing (and I try to be too. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/peace.gif) and we have an awesome group of staff. Our turnover rate is incredibly low for the business and I love going in to work every day. I know I could make more money for my position somewhere else but I'd rather be happy and take a hit on the pay than be miserable with more. To tell you how much people like our place.. one of our cooks has taken a second job and he wants to stay with us so he talked to the KM and I and said that he doesn't want to quit because he really enjoys working with us, so if we could be flexible with him he really wants to stay. He's an amazing worker and one we don't want to lose so of course we said yes we can work it out. I don't mind switching a shift with him (even a 530am open) if it means keeping him and neither does the KM.. heck it means we get to go home early once in a while! /img/vbsmilies/smilies/bounce.gif


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## twoam (Jun 18, 2010)

O the horrors of trying to train a newb to the business on even how to make frozen chicken fingers in a fryer. (Thankfully I work somewhere else that doesn't hire people like that.)

Honestly I have found more people who go into the business for money while in college and find that they love it. They love the adrenaline rush that comes with a packed restaurant on an hour wait; where the Chef is screaming tickets and all your fellows are trying their best to successfully bury the front of house as fast as possible without damaging the quality of the food. (Yep that is the kitchen I work in... they try to bury us, we try to bury them and in the end entrees go out under 25min on a packed night) There are always going to be people who don't want to work for the money or think that working in a kitchen would be easier than stocking books in a store. (I actually worked with someone for three days who thought that) The only thing that can be done is suck it up and try to get them to leave fast...without them really knowing.


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## leeniek (Aug 21, 2009)

This person had owned her own place before and I guess had never set foot in the kitchen, although her resume claimed she had and she claimed she had as well.  Some people interview really well and suck in the kitchen.  I'm the opposite... I interview poorly but my resume, references and work speak for themselves.


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## prairiechef (May 22, 2010)

A lot of assumptions here... I never said that "all he does is make sandwiches", it is one item on a menu.

And yes... a love of food will lead to a better sandwich. Unless you're one of those who figures that your fancy title puts such things below your notice.


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## iplaywithfire (Jul 5, 2010)

Hooray for right-to-work state is the first thing that comes to mind.  We still get our fair share of cooks with bad attitudes and crumby work ethics, but they tend not to last too long in the industry around here.  Either that, or they make some positive adjustments, or they end up at a chain establishment.  Unfortunately there are some who manage to stick it out long enough or camoflauge themselves well enough to get into managerial positions.  I worked for a few, and that is even worse than having one "work" for you.


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