# Simple question, but ....



## teamfat (Nov 5, 2007)

What aspects of cooking bring up more discussion, technical savvy, pig-headed opinions, cutting insight, blatant misinformation, personal anecdotes, fanaticism, blessed guidance than the simple

*I want a new knife, what should I get?
*

mjb the rabble rouser.


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## chefjohnpaul (Mar 9, 2000)

How much are you using it, how serious are you and what can you afford? Generally speaking if you want something for the long haul that is not going to get battered in a meat locker you have many options of forged high carbon steel and stainless steel to choose from. What is your $$$ range?


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## teamfat (Nov 5, 2007)

Didn't mean to be confusing, I myself am not in the market for a knife at the moment. I was just noticing that not only in ChefTalk, but some other food related forums I browse from time to time knives are an important issue that always generate a fair bit of discussion.

It has been decades since I've worked in any sort of restaurant. Back then my knife was in hand on a nearly constant basis. Well, maybe not my early years as a busboy/dishwasher. I will admit, however, during those years there might have been times I wanted to apply a sharp edge to the throats of certain cooks, wait staff and such, but that's different.

These days just fixing dinner for the two of us I might spend a whole 5, maybe 10 minutes a day working a blade. I still enjoy tools like a good, sharp knife, though. I do like my recently acquired New West 9, and appreciate my trusty old ( 30+ years ) Chicago Cutlery stuff.

Sure, there might be a bit of discussion about butter versus margarine, to reference another thread, or the difference between stock and broth, but it just seems that discussions about knives evoke the most passion. What other topics have such power?

mjb.


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## tessa (Sep 9, 2007)

chocolate does it for me


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## chrislehrer (Oct 9, 2008)

Just to translate, *teamfat*:

"Hey, have you noticed that however much people like to debate all kinds of food things, the thing that really generates endless yap is knives?"

Quite true. I like to yap about them myself. But then, I'll happily argue about a whole amazingly large range of things. That's why I became a professor! :crazy:


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## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

I tend to use my Santoku knife more than anything else.


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## jbd (Mar 17, 2008)

*What pot or pan should I get?, *IMO, gets the next highest amount of discussion.


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## vera bradley (Mar 21, 2004)

Mapiva, that is one that I never found very useful at all. It was a gift from my boss about 5 years ago, so it stays in the line-up. It's a great-looking knife, true, but I don't need it. I _wish_ I could love it. The thing is, I haven't found a task can't be performed faster or better with knives I've owned for years.

Often one or two of my employer's dinner guests with an interest in cooking (the reason they end up back in the kitchen) will see and admire the santoku and profess eternal love for their own or the intent to purchase one. I suppose it says a lot that it's the only knife I don't mind others handling.

Old dog, no new tricks, maybe. 

(So have I just proven Teamfat's point?) 

I don't know if it's true here, but the biggie used to be *apprenticeship vs. culinary school.*


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## chefhow (Oct 16, 2008)

The endless debate of OJT or Formal training. We all have our experiences and opinions on this one.


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## kuan (Jun 11, 2001)

There's always the is Espagnole a mother sauce or not debate.


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## deltadoc (Aug 15, 2004)

The one that causes me more angst than the one above is "Is demi-glace a mother sauce or not!"

doc


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## chefjohnpaul (Mar 9, 2000)

You have to start with Espagnole to get demi-glace!:chef:


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## kuan (Jun 11, 2001)

Are you trying to start a fight? :lol:


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## deltadoc (Aug 15, 2004)

ROTG!  Way to be Kuan dude! Your subtle humour is always dead on!

My 44 lbs of New Zealand Babba bones are coming tomorrow. I"d better refresh my memory of how to arrive at demi-glace!    

doc


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## chefjohnpaul (Mar 9, 2000)

I can't fight now- do you know how long it takes to clarify a demi made from Espagnol? See me in a week......:crazy:


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## chrislehrer (Oct 9, 2008)

Actually, I read somewhere that you can cheat on this one. You combine Sauce espagnole and brown stock in equal quantities, but then you boil hard rather than gently, until reduced by 50%. The hard boiling apparently screws up the brown roux and stuff in the espagnole and makes it tend to come out of emulsification, where it can be skimmed and/or strained. On the other hand, there are those who say that the delicacy of flavor is lost when you boil hard, and that therefore the resultant demi-glace is really only suitable for combining with equal parts brown bone stock and turning into glace de viande.

But I must say I am amazed and delighted to hear that _anyone_ still does Sauce espagnole at all: I thought this was completely dead and buried.


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## amazingrace (Jul 28, 2006)

I'm very glad politics are off limits here...that would surely bring up heated debates. I voted already, by the way, so please don't anyone break the rules and try to influence me.


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## chefhow (Oct 16, 2008)

When I make a glace it starts with roasted bones and mirepoix with a bruleed onion and goes into a pot with cold water. Boil, simmer overnight, strain, reduce and costantly skim until thick and black. It is very strong, and needs to be cut with buree blanc or something lighter. Its almost 100% protien and isnt a true demi glace but rather a full glace or natural. I havent made a classical demi glace in over 10 years.

Oh and the only knife I use on a regular basis is my 10" chefs knife, I was given a santuko and took it back after 1 day, I found it to be useless.


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## chefjohnpaul (Mar 9, 2000)

But I must say I am amazed and delighted to hear that _anyone_ still does Sauce espagnole at all: I thought this was completely dead and buried.[/QUOTE]

Well, not dead and buried but in ICU on life support with someone ready to pull the plug!

Actually, when I make a demi so to speak it is usually a reduction of very well made stock and then a mounting with a little butter. On occassion I will make a roux but really the long process of mixing and reducing and having the proteins of the roux breakdown and scummed I feel in the most part except for nostalgia or old school practice is no longer relevant. :chef:


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