# Kitchen Knife and sharpening help for a Noobie :)



## aaron mckeown (Feb 19, 2013)

Hi guys,

firstly i just want to say this forum is amazing, and i am reading constantly, all the members seem really friendly so i thought id post my first help question

i recently purchased a Zwilling Motion Chefs knife and matching paring knife, > http://www.zwilling.com/en/knife-series/items/zwilling-motion--4297.html < i also have a KAI branded santoku,

i have bought the Henckles Twin sharp duo, and thats done a good job on the knives at touching up ( just henckles )

but my problem is i plan on buying the wusthof classic ikon range in a few months along with a few japanese santoku's

which would be the best / most cost effective method for sharpening ??

as the sharpener i have cant do japanese knives should i buy a minosharp ??

also anyone know what angle the classic ikon range is set at ??

i am not against learning waterstones but im only interested if its really needed for avid home cook.

many thanks

Aaron


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## himself (Jan 7, 2013)

I too, am a noobie. You might contemplate the Edge Pro for sharpening if the idea of learning free hand sharpening is too frightening. I will probably order one fairly soon, I think.


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## aaron mckeown (Feb 19, 2013)

i have been looking at that system, i have been looking at the apex4 kit

i dont mind learning the waterstone, im just a little nervous, ive watched a lot of videos but i just wanted to ask on here to see what else is out there 

thanks for the recommendation though i appreciate it


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

_Factory_ Edge Bevel Angles:

Zwillings Motion -- Don't know for sure. Probably 20*ish. At any rate, Zwilling recommends steeling at a 20* angle;
Kai Santoku -- Nominally 16*, but 15* is fine;
Old Wusthof Ikon Classic -- Before PTec sharpening, nominally 19*; but
New Wusthof Ikon -- Wusthof's "new" PTec edge is nominally 14*, but 15* is fine.
Knife makers set their edge angles 1* off something standard in order to sell you the idea that their edges are better. However, it's just marketing BS. Don't be impressed.

In the case of these particular knives, I suggest sharpening everything to 15*.

If the edge on the Zwilling knife collapses too quickly at that angle, sharpen a 20* micro bevel over the 15* edge and that should solve the problem (at least) temporarily. Then you're going to have to decide if sharpening 20*/15* is worth the small amount of extra trouble compared to just letting the knife gradually return to 20*.

Just in terms of expense, an Apex 4 might be overkill for that particular knife collection. It's pointless taking the German knives to a high polish, because they won't hold it for long anyway. Kai's aren't worth the effort either. All things considered, a Chef's Choice electric, either a 1520 or one of the "Asian Angle" models might suit you best.

BDL


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## raibeaux (Dec 21, 2012)

I'm having the same questions about my knives.  Just getting into better knives, I have an Artifex 210, and a TKC 240.  Looking at a 240 deba and a 240 either suji or petty in the near future.  No point in getting them until I'm sure of myself on the sharpening.

I also just got three new 8" Victorinox that came today.

First, the Victorinox.  I want them at 20*.  With my Edge Pro (new at the EP, too) should I just set the machine at 20 and start sharpening?

The other two are horses of different colors.  Don't want to screw them up.  I got the finish sharpening on the Artifex which they said was "about" 15*.  Should I set the machine at 15* and just get after it when it needs it?

Don't have any idea what I'm gonna do when the TKC needs sharpening.  Whatever I do I'll be sweating.


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## aaron mckeown (Feb 19, 2013)

Hi guys just going to add to this post, im now just about to purchase a chefs choice sharpener, i was looking at the 1520 but i feel if i was going to spend that amount i would earn stone sharpening, so ive narrowed my choice down to 

A) Chef's Choice 316
B) Minosharp plus 3

i have a Henckles Twin Sharp Duo but i dont feel it is that good, and it seems to leave a wire edge along one side of my blade

anyway if anyone can help with my choice i would appreciate it.

many thanks


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Aaron,

The 1520 Adjustable Angle is really two, two-stage machines stuck together.  It's designed for people who want to sharpen some knives at 20* and others at 15*.  The 315S and 316 are CC's 15* only two-stage machines.  They both sharpen a flat bevel.  The 315S has a stropping stage, the 316 does not; in addition to a better polish, the stropping stage can be used to true the knife, working about as well as a honing rod.  On the other hand, the 316 has more sophisticated "sharpening stages" than the 315S. 

If you want to sharpen a sturdier "Trizor" bevel (aka "convex") at 15*, get CC's most sophisticated sharpening, AND a strop, get a better final polish, you need CC's ultimate, three-stage 15XV. 

No machine is equal to the other, they all do various things differently.  Within the CC universe, the best choice for you is contingent on what you want to do and on what you can afford.   

The Minosharp Plus3 is excellent as manual pull-throughs go, but it's still far from perfect.  

Both types of sharpeners are very easy to learn, very convenient to use and relatively inexpensive.  Even the 15XV doesn't cost more than a good quality tool and jig (like an Edge Pro Apex) or a good set of bench stones and the necessary "accessories."  Neither the CCs nor the Minosharp will give you the same longevity, or quality of results as the more inconvenient and ultimately more expensive methods.   If and when you move into knives with outstanding edge qualities, you'll want to investigate something which can get better results than a CC or a Minosharp.  

However, neither the knives you currently have and the knives you mentioned buying in the future will take a really sharp edge or hold it for very long.  A CC is probably the best choice -- the XV if you can afford it.  

BDL


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