# need a smack around or abuse knife.



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

i have a tojiro shirogami gyuto that im very happy with use it a lot for fine cuts and slicing meats and such.

but am afraid of just chopping lots of vegetables how to put it afraid of smacking it hard against the chopping board i got and hurting the knife.

looking for a knife that i just can hack vegetables and such with wit out being afraid of it.   

looking at this tojiro shirogami nakiri 165mm is that good looks flat and good for chopping lots of mushroms etc?


----------



## ordo (Mar 19, 2009)

Get a chinese cleaver, better than a nakiri.


----------



## brianshaw (Dec 18, 2010)

ordo said:


> Get a chinese cleaver, better than a nakiri.


Get two... makes "march chopping" much easier.

I agree with the cleaver vs nakiri comment also. Maybe it's just me, but nikiri gives me blisters for some reason. Cleaver doesn't.

But a traditional 10-inch chef knife and a big board also make vegetable chopping quite easy.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Any recomendetiaons?


----------



## grande (May 14, 2014)

I've had a wusthof for years and it seems pretty indistructable. Whenever i haven't wanted to use a >$100 knife i've used mercers and victorinox and found both functional, durable, and sharpenable.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Ok anyone got a special knife or to on ebay to reccomend? Or other place that is cheap on delivering


----------



## ordo (Mar 19, 2009)

mrbushido said:


> Any recomendetiaons?


Budget?


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

50-60 buck topps delivered to norway. I love the shirogami gyuto i got the sharpness and quality thats why i thought og the tojiro shirogami nakiri.
Any recomendtiaons?


----------



## ordo (Mar 19, 2009)

Do you have some Chinese markets over there? They usually carry a variety of cleavers, cheap and of reasonable quality. I got this one for about U$15.





  








nwepa1.jpg




__
ordo


__
Jun 25, 2014








If not check CCK cleavers.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

I havent ok they are good quality?


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Cant find them on ebay.


----------



## meezenplaz (Jan 31, 2012)

Agreed on cleavers, any Asian market will have decent (even if not so pretty) one piece shank cleavers for 8 to 15 us $.

And they hold up better than you might think.

As to kick-around knives, as a caterer  I'm coming from different perspective....where knives I take to events are subject

to abuse, being "borrowed" and never returned, or just plain disappearing. In such case Id carry ultra cheap chef knives

for general chopping, slicing etc, and keep my decent knives (fine dicing, meat trimming etc) in a wrap in my bag or under

the car seat  until called upon for service.

And BTW I rarely take cleavers to catered events--just too many people around, unless I have a kitchen available,

or at least a secluded cook-tent.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Its just for home use. Will i get a chinese cleaver sharp enough? Thin slicing for eks squash amd aubergine


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

http://m.ebay.com/itm/141320673853?nav=SEARCH. This? I really want something shirogami because of the sharpness so i am leaning towards nakiri will it withstand it?


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

@bdl you are the guru what do you mean?


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

I got cheap cleavers and chefs knives but want a nakiri/cleaver of good quality steel and sharpness 

Bdl or othdr guys any tips?


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Bdl wanna help?  can raise my budget to 120 bucks delivered to norway.

Then i question myself should i use the tojiro shirogami gyuto to chop and abuse and get a new higher quality better steel thinner more laser gyuto?


----------



## ordo (Mar 19, 2009)

bdl dissapeared from the forum months ago. Why don't you buy a generic chinese cleaver like this?:





  








$_57.JPG




__
ordo


__
Jun 26, 2014








Its just $15.99 on eBay HERE. Use it for a while and eventually, if it fits your needs, get a fancier one. Personally, i would never spend a lot of money on a cleaver.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

But can it do thin slicing of hard vegetables to?


----------



## ordo (Mar 19, 2009)

Sure.


----------



## brianshaw (Dec 18, 2010)

Since when did chopping veg become "abuse" for a knife?  If hard veg cannot be cut with a Japanese knife and your skeptical of a Chinese cleaver, then the best solution is probably a big German knife.  This isn't exactly rocket science!


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Im just afraid of hitting my gyuto to hard against the board


----------



## kokopuffs (Aug 4, 2000)

ordo said:


> bdl dissapeared from the forum months ago. Why don't you buy a generic chinese cleaver like this?:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Aren't some asian cleavers for meat; they're thicker. And the other, thinner cleavers for veggies?? There is a difference in thickness between the two types of cleavers I always thought. I have an asian vegetable cleaver purchased at WokShop.com and it feels very light and is very thin, too.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

What about the idea of using my tojiro gyuto for abuse and buying a new thinner gyuto for fine work?


----------



## grande (May 14, 2014)

Why use a knife you're worried about damaging for your rough and tough knife? Then you'll damage it and be right back where you started.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

True but want quality good steel in the cleaver baaah haha maybe im just to scared


----------



## ordo (Mar 19, 2009)

mrbushido said:


> What about the idea of using my tojiro gyuto for abuse and buying a new thinner gyuto for fine work?


A great idea. Do it. Do it now.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Sarcastic?


----------



## ordo (Mar 19, 2009)

No. Pragmatic.


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

And that is?


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

http://m.ebay.com/itm/230891629147?nav=SEARCH

What do you guys think?


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

http://m.ebay.com/itm/260949256698?nav=SEARCH

Or this?


----------



## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

"Guillotine 'n Glide" is your solution. BDL repeated it over and over. The tip of the knife rests on the board, then you _guillotine_ down while at the same time slicing forward. That way you slice thru clean without exerting so much pressure that the knife breaks thru suddenly and slams to the board.

Some onions are harder than others, but if you give a barely perceptible push or pull on the knife as you bear down it will glide thru rather than break thru.

Cheap blade or not, you really don't want to be breaking thru your hard vegetables and slamming down, ruining your board.

Rick


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Okey thnx @rick but then im wondering about buying a laser thinner gyuto prefferably in carbon. 

Limit is 160 bucks any ideas?


----------



## chris bruce (Jul 5, 2014)

A great knife I love is a Maestro Wu D9 It's a Tank. It is made from bomb shell


----------



## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

An affordable laser in a prestige alloy:

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kohetsu.html

Rick


----------



## mrbushido (Apr 24, 2014)

Ok thnx mate.


----------



## jonnyboy369 (Jun 27, 2014)

I recommend the winco all stainless cleaver I think its model kc-401. It is a $9 piece of solid steel. I use it to open boxes, cut through metal pie tins, hammer on the frie press, and just basically have fun abusing. It holds a great edge too ive had it a few months and totally got my $ worth. It is great to mince stuff too with the heavy curved blade. If you keep it sharp its pretty nimble too and can do delicate tasks. I plan to use it till the blade is worn down to nothing which will be years from now. Only problem is the big wide blade cuts through my knife roll.


----------



## dave kinogie (Feb 16, 2013)

This is actually really solid bang for the buck. It's rustic and rough though, with a crappy handle, but sharpens up really nice on the stones and has good edge retention. Never had any problem with it stinking like some other cheap carbons and I've seen it left wet or with juices on it forever and never rusted, even the patina build up is slow.

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/yawh1na16.html


----------



## harrisonh (Jan 20, 2013)

MANY chefs I know use a Nakiri or a CCK for vertical chopping or from drawing the blade in motions (not locomotive style cutting).
One of the most venerable is the Dexter 5198. Of course it isn't made by Dexter, it's made in china, but marketed by dexter. You'll see some variants of model number, most have to do with the wood in the handle, and some might be the Chinese subcontractor that makes it. There's also the 5197 which is shorter, like a nakiri and there's a connoisseur model which has cullens. They re both incredibly cheap,  both have pretty unremarkable steel, but they are well respected in my town, and this is amongst mostly Anglo chefs.

I've got both a 5197 and a 5198 and think either would be a great addition to an arsenal. They're incredibly sturdy and can take a beating. They are not like a German butchers cleaver. They are realy meant for veggies. But I've spit chicken breasts thousands of times with them. And at only a few dollars, who cares what happens to it versus a 200 dollar gyuto or chefs knife.


----------



## kbarberlv (Sep 12, 2014)

One of my favorite "beater" knives, is stamped, cheap, and honestly sometimes holds an edge better than some of my higher end full tang riveted knives. forschner victoronix stamped 10" chefs knife. You can get them for about 40-50 bucks on eBay or most any other site, and they WILL last. If they get dull, a few swipes on a steel and it's back to life.


----------



## jonnyboy369 (Jun 27, 2014)

Lol your beater is my main use knife the 10" Vic. I may upgrade someday but I like it. Mine I treat like it cost $500.


----------



## kbarberlv (Sep 12, 2014)

jonnyboy369 said:


> Lol your beater is my main use knife the 10" Vic. I may upgrade someday but I like it. Mine I treat like it cost $500.


I guess I shouldn't say Beater. They are really really well made. I was referring to the fibrox handled knives. Actually one of my knives I used everyday for butchering is a 12" scimitar by forschner with the Rosewood handle and rivets. Only cost me about 60 bucks.


----------



## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

I recently did a review of the 10" Vic.  Like any wood handle you can modify it easily to suite, and the finish of the blade itself is in fact better than many $100+ knives, pretty thin behind the edge, and nice polish thrown in.  Same stainless you find on Wusties and Henckles, maybe even better HT but I haven't put it thru any such test yet.  It steel doesn't compare to any Japanese stainless blades I'm familiar with, but you're talking a bit more money there.  Someone brought up the Wusthof Pro series as competition here.

Rick


----------

