# Duck Confit



## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

Yet to try it, but I love duck. But there's three factors wrong with it. 1. Just like chicken, duck is most economically purchased whole, 2. I'm a single man cooking for himself 99% of the time, and 3. Duck doesn't stay fresh very long. So preserving it seems necessary.  I've enough education under my belt to be very aware of the dangers of botulism, but confit and preserving is a subject yet to be covered in my culinary classes or my work experience. So question is, how is confit done safely?  Considering attempting a home made saurkraut for the occasion too.


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## thetincook (Jun 14, 2002)

1) Nitrates or nitrites in the cure (always forgetting which one)

2) Can the legs, or just the meat, with duck fat after cooking.

3) After the intial cooking, let it chill, and remove the duck gellee. Get every thing hot again, and chill properly. The free moisture is a breeding ground for bacteria. Save the gellee, it's a wonderfull ingredient.

4) As a single man, you should know that chicks dig confit. There shouldn't be enough left overs waiting to rot.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

thetincook said:


> 4) As a single man, you should know that chicks dig confit. There shouldn't be enough left overs waiting to rot.


Yeah but the trick is getting them to accept that invitation to dinner.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

pcieluck said:


> Yeah but the trick is getting them to accept that invitation to dinner.


"Say, wanna see my etchings confit?" /img/vbsmilies/smilies/lol.gif


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## thetincook (Jun 14, 2002)

Hey baby, wanna monte aux buerre?/img/vbsmilies/smilies/thumb.gif


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## french fries (Sep 5, 2008)

thetincook said:


> 1) Nitrates or nitrites in the cure (always forgetting which one)


FWIW I've never heard of nitrates or nitrites in duck confit. I've eaten duck confit all my life, mostly store bought, and I've never seen nitrates or nitrites listed in the ingredients. I have a can in front of me, ingredients are listed as:

Duck legs

Duck fat

Salt

I've never made my own though - but none of my books list nitrates or nitrites as an ingredient. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/confused.gif


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## thetincook (Jun 14, 2002)

Seemed like the natural addition if one was concerned about food borne illness. Confit is the perfect anaerobic environment.


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

If you make a confit properly there is VERY little danger of botulism. 

Best bet is to cure the duck legs overnight, rinse, and pat dry. Place snugly in a oven proof dish (dutch oven, casserole, whatever) and cover with clean, rendered duck fat. Place in an oven, set at about 300 (though lower is OK too, 250-300) and cook until the duck is very tender. Take out of oven, cool to room temp, then place in fridge to store. 

Easy. 

When needed, you can either gently warm the pan and take out the duck once the fat melts, or just reach in the cold fat and fish out the legs. 

Refrigeration will lessen the likelihood of botulism quite a bit (though the danger is small to begin with). If you notice any green mold or anything in the fat or on the pan after some time in the fridge, probably should throw it out, though this is unlikely to happen.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

I understand this is as safe as eating a can of green beans if done right, I'm just looking for all the tips to do this safely as possible. I don't think i'll can them though. I'll probably eatit within a few days, unless I make that sauerkraut.


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

I don't understand what you are concerned about....the way to prevent botulism is to cook it (which you will do for several hours above 250 degrees) and store it in the fridge. I don't think you need to "can" them at all...most people just store it covered in the fat it cooked in.

You could also, very simply, after the confit is out of the oven but before it cools completely, take duck legs out and place them in a fresh, sterilized container (another casserole or pot that you have boiled for several minutes) and strain the fat over them in the new dish. 

People have historically just stored this stuff in the cellar without refrigeration. 

There are like 20 cases of botulism a year...almost all of them from home canning. 

You'll be fine, don't be scared to make duck confit.


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## mezzaluna (Aug 29, 2000)

I've made rillettes du porc, which is somewhat similar in preparation. After simmering the meat, spices and aromatics, I fished out the meat, shredded it and chilled it. I strained the fat. Then I put the cooled, shredded pork in a small crock with a lid that had a rubber seal. Re-melted the fat (just warm enough to liquefy) and poured it into the crock until it was just below the lid. I sealed it and chilled it. It kept for about 10 days; none of the meat tasted "off" or bad.

Assuming you have a properly-functioning refrigerator, I'd give it at least 10 days so long as it's submerged in the fat and chilled.

Bonne chance! Good luck with your confit.

Mezzaluna


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

I'm having a very hard time finding any duck fat in the metro-detroit area.  Considering doing one of two things. Just roasting a batch really low and slow, accepting the fact that the first batch will not be completely submerged in the fat and not a true "confit" or augmenting with a different fat to get the reserve of fat going.  any suggestions? I understand a moulard duck has more than enough fat on it's own body but I know there's a snowball's chance in hell of finding that around here if I cant even find a tub of duck fat.


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## highlander01 (Apr 30, 2010)

About the only place that I have found duck fat is online I have checked about every specialty food store that I can find in my area and I have yet to find duck fat locally.

Am I wrong but for it to be confit, for it to have that tenderness doesn't the meat have to be fully immerged in the fat while being cooked?


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## chefross (May 5, 2010)

Up in these parts Sysco Grand Rapids carries duck fat in 5# tubs....


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## bazza (Apr 2, 2007)

I also have problems getting duck fat, I always use use goose fat it is just as good if you can get hold of it, and yes the meat should be fully immersed although I would not worry about a few bits poking out of the top, you can move them around after an hour or two.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

Yeah. Correct me if I'm wrong, but a confit is poaching technique. What I'm talking about would just be a braise but... at least it'd get me started. Or I might augment the ducks own fat with canola.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

So I've got a duck parted (yes i am finally weeks later getting around to trying this out).  I'm now in the curing stage. But I've got all this excess skin and fat that i've trimmed off off of the parts so they'd look nice, and from the back of the carcass.  So my question is: What is the best way to render the liquid fat out of these excess fat trimmings?  I couldn't find a tub of duck fat anywhere, so I will be using pure olive oil to augment the duck's fat.


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

put in a saucepan and add cold wayer bring up to a simmer and let it contiue to simmer a while on  low flame. water will evaporate away leaving fat only strain twice while hot thru cheesecloth.


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

I feel very ambivalent about being so blunt but don't know any other way to go about it. This is about as wrong as it could possibly be.


> 1) Nitrates or nitrites in the cure (always forgetting which one)
> 2) Can the legs, or just the meat, with duck fat after cooking.
> 
> 3) After the intial cooking, let it chill, and remove the duck gellee. Get every thing hot again, and chill properly. The free moisture is a breeding ground for bacteria. Save the gellee, it's a wonderfull ingredient.
> ...



No nitrate and/or nitrite cure;
No canning;
No gelee;
No chill / hot again / chill properly;
No free moisture; and
By definition, confit is "leftovers."
Making confit is a fairly straightforward process. There are recipes all over the net, mine is nothing special other than that I don't measure, and not worth repeating since you can find a great many just as good. It's the process more than the exact ingredients which makes confit so good.

The leg quarters are "marinated" for a day or two in a mix of a few dry spices -- which do not contain "curing salts;" they are brushed clean of the marinade.

Meanwhile the cook melts enough duck fat in a pot to fully submerge the quarters (the fat might be mildly seasoned with a bay leaf or two, and perhaps a few cloves or a trimmed head of garlic; the quarters are fully submerged in the just-melted fat; the heat is slowly raised to poaching temperature (190 - 205F); the temperature is held until the quarters are cooked to "very tender;' are first poached in mildly seasoned duck fat (about 2 hours).

When the legs are done, they are wiped clean; and the fat is carefully strained so that it's very clean. The quarters are placed in a clean bowl or pan, and completely submerged in the purified fat. The fat is allowed to cool to room temp, then placed -- uncovered -- in the refrigerator. When it is quite cold, it may be covered -- preferably with something close and reasonably air-tight. The confit (both fat and duck) will keep for about 3 months refrigerated.

Chilled, clarified fat doesn't breed bacteria easily; while the duck meat is held submerged and anaerobic. Properly speaking, one doesn't say a _confit _is preserved. Rather, it's a preservation method itself.

If you can't find enough duck or goose fat to submerge the duck, don't make confit. Substituting vegetable oil for fat is like deep frying in water. It is what it is. Sorry if I stepped on any toes.

Hope this clarifies,

BDL


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## thetincook (Jun 14, 2002)

Wrong? I think not so much. We can discuss the 'correct' way to make confit all day long, but the OP asked for technique to reduce the threat of botulism, and I obliged.

Botulinum thrives in a moist, non acidic, anaerobic environment. Which pretty much describes confit.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Just my $0.02, however, from the descriptions of confit that I'm familiar with, there is very little, if any, "moisture" (read water) in correctly prepared confit. The salt and duck fat serve as a preservative.

As BDL stated #5 No free moisture

Oh, and I've never heard of a "cure", i.e. involving any salt other than NaCl, being necessary or desired.

BTA, WTHDIK



thetincook said:


> Wrong? I think not so much. We can discuss the 'correct' way to make confit all day long, but the OP asked for technique to reduce the threat of botulism, and I obliged.
> 
> Botulinum thrives in a moist, non acidic, anaerobic environment. Which pretty much describes confit.


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

I don't think a cure is NECESSARY from a safety standpoint, but it would certainly help in the long term viability of confit as storage. It also goes a long way to seasoning the meat and making it even more delicious. And I'm talking a quick cure, like no more than 24 hours. But I think curing legs for confit is fairly standard practice.


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Originally Posted by *Someday* 


> I don't think a cure is NECESSARY from a safety standpoint, but it would certainly help in the long term viability of confit as storage. It also goes a long way to seasoning the meat and making it even more delicious. And I'm talking a quick cure, like no more than 24 hours. But I think curing legs for confit is fairly standard practice.


Oy.

Curing does not effect "long term viability of confit as storage." The nitrite and nitrite/nitrate cures help prevent botulinum growth in products which are cold smoked, air dried and so on; but not cooked. Why would you "cure" something which was not only cooked through, but cooked somewhat past well done to an internal in excess of 180F -- before being completely covered in solid, clarified fat and stored cold.

Cures like Prague #1 don't taste like much beyond salty. Cures like Morton Tender Quick don't taste like much beyond salty and sweet.

Usually the terms "quick cure" and "fast cure" are reserved for the product itself, not the curing time. Appropriate curing time in a nitrite and/or nitrate cure depends on several different things -- none of which you addressed.

"Curing legs for confit" in nitrites and/or nitrates is not "fairly standard." If it happens at all, it's done by cooks "weak on the principle." How often have you seen pink duck confit? Do you have many examples of duck confit with a nitrite or nitrite/nitrate cure? On the other hand, "curing" in salt as part of the prep is pretty much universal.

BDL


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

Well here's where I am:

I "cured" it with heavy salt, pepper, thyme, bay leaves, and smashed garlic for 24 hours. Reserved the thyme, garlic, and bay leaf and rinsed the parts of the salt and pepper (I am using the all four quarters, not just legs).  Put in the legs into an enamel dutch oven, skin side down, with the fat trimmings, back skin, garlic and herbs on top. Covered most of the way with olive oil, allowing the unrendered fat to cover it the rest of the way.  Been in the oven at 200 for 3 hours, intend on taking it out before bed.  Going to allow it to cool stove-top for an hour, then remove the legs, strain the fat and put it back into the pot and store for 3 days until I have guests Saturday night. Saturday I'll simply brown the skin and serve with pommes fondant.  Had a lentil salad in mind too, but my finances took a dive this week so I'll be skipping that part.  Potatoes cooked in duck fat and duck demi-glace sounds still amazing, anyways.  Any suggestions or concerns with my process thus far?


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

BDL

 From what I have seen only things that contain Nitrites and or nitrates and or saltpeter is corned beef, pickled tongue and frankfurters. To use them in other things could be real dangerous.  The salt process described above by priceluck  is more  like  a gravlox prep.


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## thetincook (Jun 14, 2002)

chefedb said:


> BDL
> 
> From what I have seen only things that contain Nitrites and or nitrates and or saltpeter is corned beef, pickled tongue and frankfurters. To use them in other things could be real dangerous.


Quite the opposite, actually. There is a reason why botulism is Latin for 'sausage disease'. The botulism bacteria was first isolated from a ham.


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

pcieluck --

Sounds alright, but it isn't -- properly speaking -- confit. It's duck poached in olive oil. Poaching it in (more or less pure) duck fat is part of the confit process, as is burying it in clarified duck fat. Why are you holding it three days? Why not cook the day before? The flavors will have more than adequate time to marry and settle down, and you won't have any preservation issues.

Make sure all of the fat is completely rendered from the breasts before storing.

Normally the breasts can be used more profitably. They don't need the sort of long, slow cooking they'll get in a confit. Quite the opposite, they're generally considered best sauteed rare with nice, crisp [yum] skin. If it were me, I'd buy two ducks and break them down; saute the breasts as part of dinner for four, using the liver for "dirty rice;' confit the leg quarters, reserving them for cassoulet, duck salad, etc.; reserve the rendered fat (after the leg quarters are used) for all sorts of good things; and use the wings and carcass for stock. But it's your duck and your nickel.

By the way, where are you located? Aren't you around Detroit? Or, do I have you confused with someone else? If you're in or near any large US population center you should be able to get duckfat -- if only by ordering it through a butcher.

ed --

I get your point, but know a lot of other uses for nitrite and/or nitrate cures. It's an integral part of all sorts of preservation -- which don't involve thorough cooking before storage.

thetincook --

I've tried a few times to address your issues in this post, but no matter how hard I try my efforts seem too personal. Although I know you're "information" is way off base, I don't want to attack you over it. If you want to talk, PM me.

I'm out of this thread.

BDL


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

are you saying it'll be bad on saturday? I did it today because i work the rest of the week, and it was going to be the only day i'd be around, pretty much all day, to take care of it.  even though i'm sure i could have left it at such a low temperature in the oven with no danger.  and yes i do live in the metro-detroit area


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

If I thought it would be bad on Saturday, I'd have said it.  You probably aren't surprised to learn I don't do subtle hints very well. It would have been better if you could have held off a little, but oh well.

You should be able to find duck fat in metro Detroit -- if you don't have a restaurant supply which does, than through a butcher.  That's why they invented next time.

I'm sure it will be great.

BDL


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

boar_d_laze said:


> Originally Posted by *Someday*
> 
> Oy.
> 
> ...


Where in my post did I mention the use of nitrates/nitrites? Oy yourself.

Listen, I was in no way shape or form condoning the usage of nitrates in a confit storage. You either misread my post, and didn't bother to read any of my other posts in this thread that address a lot of the other issues you raise in your response.

I would appreciate that in the future, if you intend to drop some sort of "knowledge bomb" you go ahead and comprehend my post before you do so. I'll repeat...in no way, shape of form did I mention nitrates.

And, as I stated, while a cure isn't a necessary step in the confit process, the salt will draw out some of the moisture present in the meat, and since bacteria need moisture, the curing process will have at best a positive effect on the preservation, and at worst, little to no effect. But the cure will DEFINITELY have a positive effect on the taste of the meat in terms of seasoning.

Thank you.


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

Many hams have nitrite you are right . And as far as sausage Frankfurters are classified sausage in Germany and Europe.


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Someday,

I guess I owe you an apology.  I had read the entire thread including your previous posts and was somewhat surprised by the one to which I gave the oy.  Although it didn't mention a nitrite and/or nitrate cure, neither did it exclude it -- and the post seemed to me to incorporate it by context.  Thanks for straightening me out.

BDL


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## jowocook (Sep 24, 2009)

boar_d_laze said:


> If I thought it would be bad on Saturday, I'd have said it. You probably aren't surprised to learn I don't do subtle hints very well. It would have been better if you could have held off a little, but oh well.
> 
> You should be able to find duck fat in metro Detroit -- if you don't have a restaurant supply which does, than through a butcher. That's why they invented next time.
> 
> ...


Is it okay to reuse duck fat for the next confit? I thought it's similar with frying oil, you don't use it once, thanks Chief.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

Thanks BDL. Just the phrase "preservation issues" made me nervous.  And I know the breast would be best cooked to mid-rare stove-top but I was just trying to make one dish for a small group of people on somewhat of a budget.  Duck already quartered, everywhere I know where to find it, is twice as expensive. So I would have had to pay twice as much for either that or another whole duck fi I wanted to do this properly with just legs.  I'll have to keep up my search for the fat though. Butchers that sell little more than the status quo have been difficult to find here (most well two cuts of beef, pork chops, and salmon and little more.)


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

boar_d_laze said:


> Someday,
> 
> I guess I owe you an apology. I had read the entire thread including your previous posts and was somewhat surprised by the one to which I gave the oy. Although it didn't mention a nitrite and/or nitrate cure, neither did it exclude it -- and the post seemed to me to incorporate it by context. Thanks for straightening me out.
> 
> BDL


I appreciate that. No harm done.

Jowocook,

As far as re-using the fat, it's absolutely OK to do it. You wouldn't want to use the same fat for years and years, for example, but getting 2-3-4 batches of confit out of the same fat is common. Duck fat is LESS prone to rancidity than some other types of fat, and as long as it is kept clean (strained carefully) and refrigerated or frozen it should last a while. Make sure that you check the fat for signs of mold (very unlikely) and rancidity. You should know its rancid by off odors and taste. If it smells and tastes bad, start fresh. And if there is any doubt as to the safeness of the fat, throw it out and start new.

At some point, as well, the fat it likely to become too salty to reuse. This may happen before the fat is technically "bad." There isn't really anything, AFAIK, that can be done about this.

Just FYI, I don't know if I would utilize a hybrid fat mix again--like if I used olive oil and duck fat combined for confit (like the OP). Those types of oils are much more prone to rancidity and I don't know if I could vouch for the safety of something like that. It's likely it would be OK, but like I said, I have no personal experience with it.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

any professionals that have been making duck confits for a while that can tell me the ball-park cost of duck fat for a batch of x amount of them?


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

It depends on the sizes and shapes of your poaching and storage pan(s), the volume of duck legs you're conserving; and perhaps a little on whether you're willing to chop of the ends of the legs to get them fully submerged.

It's easier to figure volume than weight.  Duckfat is only slightly less dense than water, so if your seller only supplies by weight you can roughly estimate that a pound's a pint, and so on.  You'll probably need something like 1-1/2 qts for four legs -- depending on your dish.  In SoCal, duck fat runs around $15 per 1/2 gallon and $25+ per gallon, and those weigh just under 4lbs and around 7-1/2lbs respectively.

BDL


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

I hear the Moulard has enough fat on the bird to do a confit with no supplement of fat required. But those are quite a bit of an expensive delicacy aren't they?

edit: this sight is selling them for 6 legs for $20. I assume a local restaurant supplier could match that...http://www.hudsonvalleyfoiegras.com/foiegrasmarket.html


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

So I'm hoping someone could give me a tip for next time. It actually came out really good. The tenderness of both legs and breasts were perfect; moist; the season from the cure was perfect. The one problem (a big one in my eyes), the darn skin all fell right off! Also, the meat kept wanting to stick to the pan.  I used the fat it was cooked in to sear it. Though I didn't use any oil. I assumed that the oil it was covered in was enough, and was a lot of grease when it heated up.


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

Did the skin fall off before you removed it from the fat? The only way to prevent that is to be really gentle. You could also try warming the fat up a bit first, so that its not so hard and you can see / get to the duck legs easier. 

As far as the sticking, there are possibly a couple of issues. You probably do want a little oil or duck fat in the pan before you set the duck in. Same as you would if you are sauteing any other protein. The duck legs will likely be coated in a film of fat when you remove them from storage, but it might not be enough. And you want to start with a hot pan, with hot fat. 

I would pre-heat your pan on the stove on like medium for a few minutes (You want a hot pan, not not a FLAMING hot pan, you don't want to burn the duck right away, or ever). Add the oil, wait another 30 seconds or so, then add the duck (carefully). Let cook for about a minute on the stove, then transfer to an oven...say about 350 degrees. Do not flip the duck at this point, you want to put it in the oven skin side down. Let cook in the oven until heated through...maybe, ten minutes. Maybe check on it once halfway through to make sure that the skin is getting crisp and you aren't burning the skin or anything. You may also want to pour off some of the fat in the pan if it is building up. 

Also, if the skin falls off, you can still use it. Crisp it up in a pan or in the oven, and serve over or on the side of the duck. Duck confit cracklins are delicious.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

Someday said:


> Did the skin fall off before you removed it from the fat? The only way to prevent that is to be really gentle. You could also try warming the fat up a bit first, so that its not so hard and you can see / get to the duck legs easier.
> 
> As far as the sticking, there are possibly a couple of issues. You probably do want a little oil or duck fat in the pan before you set the duck in. Same as you would if you are sauteing any other protein. The duck legs will likely be coated in a film of fat when you remove them from storage, but it might not be enough. And you want to start with a hot pan, with hot fat.
> 
> ...


hot pan hot oil... see i started with a hot pan, but just took the pieces from the fat pot, assuming they had enough fat on them. in other words, cold oil. i really aught to know better

I also cooked them in the fat with the skin down. as was advised to me in the recipe. I'm thinking this may be easier to remove from the pot with the skin intact if I was to do this flesh down. And yes, i did warm the fat just until it was uncoagulated, otherwhise would have been impossible.


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Seared? Seared?! What searing? What hot pan? 

350F oven?! Gevaldt! You're going to cook it in a medium oven, yet? What about the two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun? 

Oh. The humanity,
BDL


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

boar_d_laze said:


> Seared? Seared?! What searing? What hot pan?
> 
> 350F oven?! Gevaldt! You're going to cook it in a medium oven, yet? What about the two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun?
> 
> ...


You know, for someone who is seemingly very opinionated you don't seem to have a good grasp on what is going on.

We are talking about, after the confit is cooked, re-heating the duck legs (you know, for a salad, or whatever) in a hot pan to crisp up the skin and warm through. Very normal thing to do.

If you don't have anything to contribute, please don't post these useless things. All it is succeeding in doing is annoying me.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

I feel like i've really missed something....


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

pcieluck said:


> I feel like i've really missed something....


I'm not sure either. It seems that BDL has some sort of problem with the advice I gave you, which I can only chalk up to his/her seeming lack of comprehension. Ignore BDL on this one, he/she has given you some good advice previously in this thread, but rest assured, crisping up the skin in a pan and warming the confit through in the oven are very valid techniques, and quite common. I don't know what BDL was trying to get at.

I can only assume that he/she thinks that I am advising you to sear the duck and cook in a 350 degree oven to make confit. Which of course is absurd, as we are talking about how to treat the confit after it is cooked.

As far as the "BigMac" reference, it's lost on me too.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Someday said:


> ...It seems that BDL has some sort of problem with the advice I gave you...


Ya think?/img/vbsmilies/smilies/crazy.gif


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

There are right ways and wrong ways to do things. And in between, there are a variety of not very good ways.

Traditionally duck confit was reheated very gently as in a cassoulet; or picked off the bone and served at room temperature, as in a salad.

Duck skin which has undergone the confit process is flabby. There's very little you can do to crisp it up. Shallow frying -- the technical term for what Someday described -- is marginally useful. Flash, deep frying is somewhat better, and so is a torch. But, because it was already cooked there's only so far you can take it.

Searing... From a purely technical standpoint I'm not sure you can sear something which is already cooked through. In any case, you cannot get a meaningful Maillard reaction going -- which is, after all, the point of searing.

Heating in a 350F oven... Sorry. No. You just went through two and a half hours to poach the duck low and slow so it will be tender. What do you think will happen if you heat it through at high heat? Tough and dry. Tough and dry will be the result if the duck is heated through by any too-hot method. The different sorts of frying and the torch -- won't do nearly as much harm as long as you're only heating the surface. But as I said above, there are limits to how far you can go to give the skin from a confit much texture.


Because smoking is also low and slow, the skin from smoked poultry is similar to that which was confited. The skin of this chicken, which was smoked at around 250F, was light brown and too pliable when the chicken came out. I used a torch to give it some color and bring it back. You can see how the skin tightened so much it ripped in several places, but -- while the skin was palatable -- it still wasn't what you'd call crisp.

The skin on that particular chicken was highly seasoned, and the seasoning was intended as an integral part of the dish. But the ducks one confits are not seasoned in the same way as traditional confit is intended to take on the flavors of the dish to which it contributes. From a flavor and seasoning standpoint, the skin is "nothing special." And -- not to belabor the point -- it's very difficult to make it so.

Although I don't have any duck pictures handy, I don't know how many confit of ducks I've done over the years, certainly more than a hundred; and I've presented them in dozens of ways. Take it for what it's worth.

BDL


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

Wow. Just wow. So you're of the opinion that duck confit can only be served in one of two ways: Either picked and served at room temp or stewed in a cassoulet. There couldn't possibly be another way that would fall between a traditional cassoulet or salad, and a big mac. Got it...sorry to go against the years of cassoulet and duck picking experience you have. 

For the record, I didn't recommend shallow frying. Shallow frying is a method that employs both a lot of oil or fat (halfway up the sides of the items being cooked) and high heat. Neither of which I recommended. I recommended a small film of oil and fat, moderate heat, and warming through in the oven. Which, if you are trying to serve a whole leg of duck confit, is a PERFECTLY valid method for doing so. One I've employed myself, actually, both at home and professionally. Of course it will be dry and stringy, but only if you overcook it. Just because the duck is in the oven for a few minutes doesn't automatically mean it will be overcooked...care must be taken to prevent it. If you get it warm but don't overcook it, it will be great. 

And hey, the skin will get crisp. It's not as crisp as say, peking duck or a perfectly roasted chicken, (it's not a cracklin) but it definitely has a positive effect on both the texture and taste. Feel free to google search "crisp duck confit" if you don't believe me. 

The OP used the phrase "sear" as a way to describe the method he/she was trying to employ...I'm assuming that Pcieluck is not a professional chef, and shouldn't be held to some imaginary higher standard of kitchen parlance that you seem to be focused on. Using the word "sear" to describe the method Pcieluck was employing, while probably not technically correct in a dictionary definition sort of way, is common enough lingo to describe the method that I was able to ascertain what he was saying. 

It's probably more productive to actually try and help the OP than to take issue with the diction...especially if the post was clear enough originally to garner the intention. The question wasn't "Now what do I do with my confit" or "How to make a great cassoulet," he was asking advice on a specific recipe and how to improve the results. Aside from the fact that you've only seemingly ever used duck confit at room temp in salads or in cassoulet, I'd love to see what your solution would be to heating up a whole leg. 

You're obviously very knowledgeable and have made great contributions in many threads, but I'm a little bummed out by this. If snark and a picture of a smoked chicken (looks delicious by the way) is all you are going to bring to the table, you obviously have nothing else to contribute to this thread. Now I'm off to go eat a BigMac.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

Someday said:


> Wow. Just wow. So you're of the opinion that duck confit can only be served in one of two ways: Either picked and served at room temp or stewed in a cassoulet. There couldn't possibly be another way that would fall between a traditional cassoulet or salad, and a big mac. Got it...sorry to go against the years of cassoulet and duck picking experience you have.
> 
> For the record, I didn't recommend shallow frying. Shallow frying is a method that employs both a lot of oil or fat (halfway up the sides of the items being cooked) and high heat. Neither of which I recommended. I recommended a small film of oil and fat, moderate heat, and warming through in the oven. Which, if you are trying to serve a whole leg of duck confit, is a PERFECTLY valid method for doing so. One I've employed myself, actually, both at home and professionally. Of course it will be dry and stringy, but only if you overcook it. Just because the duck is in the oven for a few minutes doesn't automatically mean it will be overcooked...care must be taken to prevent it. If you get it warm but don't overcook it, it will be great.
> 
> ...


I am a professional but I've only been i the kitchen for 4 years, to clear that up.

Because light heat was required just to get the pieces out of the coagulated fat, I found after "searing," (there's that word again. if there's another word for "quickly adding color to the outside of the meat while heating the middle as little as possible" please tell me what that is) that additional heat from the oven wasn't necessary.

BTw I think BigMacs are gross. I'll take a BK Whopper any day.


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## thetincook (Jun 14, 2002)

> Originally Posted by *pcieluck*
> BTw I think BigMacs are gross. I'll take a BK Whopper any day.


Poser. The real chefs eat at Carl's Jr. I'm gonna get the Six Dollar TM Duck Confit Burger.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

Yeah, none of those anywhere in the eastern side of the country. I get my burgs from dank-hole bars.


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## thetincook (Jun 14, 2002)

pcieluck said:


> Yeah, none of those anywhere in the eastern side of the country. I get my burgs from dank-hole bars.


We also have brightly lit and clean In-n-Outs and Tommies were we can get decent burgers without getting mugged for our kidneys.


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

seriously what the hell? Did I do something to get my thread so far off topic and so full of rude sarcasm?


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## durangojo (Jul 30, 2007)

someday,

just curious chef, just why are you so angry?...it's just a duck..

joey


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## thetincook (Jun 14, 2002)

pcieluck said:


> seriously what the hell? Did I do something to get my thread so far off topic and so full of rude sarcasm?


Sorry, I was just trying to lighten the mood. I took it for granted that my tone came across as joking.


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

My last post was a direct response to BDL's post #42. I also wouldn't say I'm angry, I got a little worked up by the notion that, apparently, it's completely useless to try and use duck confit for anything other than traditional cassoulet or serving picked over a salad. It seems doing so results in something that should be compared to a BigMac. 

I have the opinion that there are many, many valid methods for just about any style and type of cooking one wants to do. Certainly there are some guidelines that are best followed for many things, but there are also many different ways to achieve goals. If I ask my grandmother and your grandmother, for example, to make a tomato sauce, they both might go about it in very different ways, for a number of reasons (how they learned, local ingredients, familial food traditions, etc etc). Is one method more "correct" than the other? Most likely, no. And both may be equally delicious, if different. 

I just think the attitude of "the one correct way" to do things just stinks. I, as a chef, love to learn new things and new methods for cooking. It's how we grow and learn and evolve on a consistent basis. It's why we visit sites like this...to give each other new ideas, inspiration, and insights. 

And I like good debate and hearing other chef's ideas. It's up to me whether I want to take advice or leave it. I just don't like being, even in a roundabout way, told that valid methods are wrong because there is a "right way to do things." 

And I especially don't appreciate being told that I recommended shallow frying for reheating the confit, as that is blatantly wrong and speaks to BDL's seeming inability to actually read what I wrote, as happened earlier in this thread as well.

Pcieluck, none of my post was directed at you. I'm sorry if you thought otherwise--like I said earlier, the "rant" I posted was meant as a direct response to BDL. Apologies again.


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## durangojo (Jul 30, 2007)

pcieluck said:


> seriously what the hell? Did I do something to get my thread so far off topic and so full of rude sarcasm?


don't take it to heart when your thread meanders off topic..it tends to happen a lot around here when more than 2 people are engaged in a dialogue. i find it rather interesting myself to see where some threads end up...just not in this case....my thinking about posting is that once a question is out there, then the thread is not really yours anymore....it's everyone's to share in... in the end did you get what you wanted? your questions answered? ...good

joey


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

I had the wing pieces leftover, saving for a rainy day. I know it wasn't a true confit but one of my room mates threw it into the sink as "garbage" while cleaning the fridge.  Said it had mold growing on top, but of coarse the contents were still in the sink the next morning and there was no evidence of mold for what I could see.  I got kind of mad, do I have the right to have been?


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Too bad about the wings. Your roomie's a jerk.

A lot of what I was saying throughout this thread went to the proposition that a confit of duck is a relatively specific thing and if you get far enough away from the ingredients and methods you no longer have confit of duck. The envelope should be stretched, and I applaud your adventurous spirit.

For the very little it's worth, I never said cassoulet and salad were the only proper uses for confit. I said either gentle re-heating (_*as in*_ cassoulet (but not only in cassoulet) and allowing to come to room temp *as in* salad (but not only in salad) were the best ways to avoid toughening the meat. My use of the terms "as in" should have been sufficient to indicate that the methods were not exclusive to any particular dish.

I forgot to mention another "traditional" confit presentation, which involves heating freshly confited duck in a relatively dry, relatively hot skillet in order to crisp the skin. Note that the duck is already hot and the protein strands relaxed, before it hits the pan. Michael Symon does this, and so do a lot of other people.

Deep-frying is always attractive -- as long as you start with a room temp or already warm duck. But you do want to be very careful to not wind those protein strands too tight. Ditto, "shallow-frying" but it wouldn't be as good as the deep version.

The meat in a confit is cooked extremely slowly in a very, very rich poaching fat. It allows the protein strands to relax, makes what would otherwise be very chewy meat very tender, and infuses an incredible richness into what would otherwise be somewhat dry and uninteresting. When reheating, most good strategies revolve around not making those protein strands to contract and re-toughen the meat. It's worth repeating, that when you work far enough away from definitional elements and methods, you're not talking about the same dish.

BDL


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## pcieluck (Dec 9, 2010)

Oh I have no hard feelings on all that.  I'm just wondering if maybe some condensation built up on top, and it the surface got moldy, and the evidence disappeared after sitting in the sink all night and the fat had softened at room temperature.  Even if so, if it was then trash or could have been salvaged (before it was left out all night).  I had it kept in a heavy cassarole dish, not air-tight.

and for what it's worth, the best confit i've ever had was, in fact, a cassoulet. It had some beans, bacon, and some kind of bread crumb all over the top for crispy texture.  Having tried it I found the extremely tender (maybe even brittle) duck legs to be kind of a pain in the ass to try and crisp the skin in a skillet.  If i was writing a menu that had duck legs on it, i'd probably stick to a cassoulet.


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