# Best way to sharpen Shun Classics?



## sbena

My Shun Classics are in need of a sharpening and I dont want to send them out to be sharpened. I want to learn how to sharpen them with whetstones, however I dont know where to start. If anyone has any experience sharpening Shuns I would love to get your opinions. Also, I was given a Shun electric sharpener when I purchased my knives from WS, I have never used it, mostly because I was worried that it would damage my knives. Does any one have any experience with this sharpener, good or bad? One more question, I was given a minosharpener, I have done some research and found that this is a product for Global knives. To my knowledge, Globals and Shuns have the same blade angle, so is the minosharp a good option for a quick sharpening for my Shuns, or should I stay away from it?

Thanks for your help.


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## phaedrus

I often sharpen Shuns on a belt grinder.  I don't know anything about the Minosharp; hopefully someone here can chime in with an answer.

The short answer is that there's nothing different about sharpening a Shun than any other knife.  If you're used to German knives then the Shun will be harder steel and ground at a more acute angle than you're used to.  Shun bevels are around 16 degrees per side vs. the 22-25 degrees per side more common with Wusthofs.  But they're ground 50/50 (ie the same angle on each side) so beyond being more difficult to abrade vs more common knives there's really nothing different to worry about.

Globals are actually convexed, aren't they?  I haven't run across many Globals, and the one I've sharpened I also did on my belt grinder.

Generally though I do Japanese knives on water stones.


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## boar_d_laze

The three stage Minosharp is pretty good.  If you don't want to learn how to sharpen, and you can't afford an EP, it's as good as an "Asian" Chef's Choice electric -- maybe slightly better in that it doesn't seem to load up quite as fast.  The biggest drawbacks are that (a) you're stuck with a 15* flat bevel no matter what you'd choose; and (b) although they do load up with swarf, neither cleans up up very well.

Just as an aside, never sharpen a dirty knife; rinse and wipe the knife dry frequently during the sharpening process. 

I don't remember offhand whether Globals ship convex or not.  When I get a knife to sharpen, no matter how it shipped, it gets what I give it.  With Globals that's a 15* flat bevel with a 20* "micro bevel" on top.  Globals go out of true very easily and can use the extra durability they get from multi-beveling.  

Shuns seem to do best with a flat 15*. 

BDL


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## sbena

Thanks for the replies,

I do want to learn how to sharpen my Shuns, but I'm not too sure on what I need to start with.  I have a budget of $100-$150, but again I don't know what whetstones to get. 

The minosharp I have, has 2 slots.  Can the minosharp be used for Shuns, if I need to use it in a pinch?


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## braising cows

I use a shun classic as my main workhorse at work and I recently purchased a 1000k shapton whetstone and plan on getting the 5000k shortly. I had one of those chefs choice asian machines and while it did a decent job it wasn't even close to what I was able to accomplish for an edge using stones. Just practice on cheaper knives and you'll figure out the technique and follow the direction BDL gives you because he has some very good advice. You could get a decent stone setup for short money (Compared to the machines) if you shop around.


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## crext

New to the forum and own Shun Classics.  I see that I lot of people sharpen their own knives, but KAI is offering free sharpening service with customer paid shipping.  Would the professional chefs not this service? If no, why not?

Newbie here with a slightly dull Nakiri here.  Obviously, the honing steel wont work on this

Side note - Why would KAI include a right handed handle honing steel in a right handed knife set, I have no clue!)


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## boar_d_laze

The best reasons to do your own sharpening are quality, control, and time. If you're happy with the factory edge quality and can deal with the turn-around time, you might as well use Kai's free service.

You can effectively steel Shun VG-10 knives -- even nakiris. However, there are limitations:

Steeling is primarily a way of truing an impact burr (aka an edge which is bent out of shape). It's not actual sharpening, or at least it shouldn't be; and
Because the knives are so chippy you have to be darn careful and use very few and very light strokes.
Since the Shun steel is bilaterally symmetric, the D handle is neither right nor left handed.

BDL


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## crext

Thanks for your input!  The last item I've sharpened by hand (which I do pretty well) were family hand-me-down shears for suit tailoring many years ago.  I might give it a shot when I invest in a kit in the near future.  Time to spend a little bit more money on a sharpening kit!  I do like the factory edge it had, possibly since I've haven't experienced any better, so I will probably use their service for now.

I have been very careful with these thanks to hanging out with my mother when I was growing up using her knives, (I'm Korean so all we had growing up were Asian knives) but I'm hesitant to steel more than I have on my nakiri.

About the steel handle though, I have no complaints about the comfort or it's effectiveness of it.  It's just that KAI says that they offer "left handed" profiles as special order but in their standard set includes the "right handed" profile for the handle of the steel (which most would grip with the left if you are a right hander)  At least my steel handle is actually profiled for a right hander (same as knives) and not bilaterally symmetrical. Perhaps, they have changed the design?


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## boar_d_laze

Most Shun steels have four sided handles, and those are ambidextrous.  However, Shun uses a "D" handle for its "Classic" series knife steel.

The proper handle/hand position for a D handle is with the round part of the D against the palm.  If a knife is D handled, the D will either be right or left handed, but not ambidextrous; because holding a right-handed D with the round part against the palm of the left hand would result with the knife edge pointing up towards the user and the spine down towards the board -- not a great way to cut onions. 

Fortunately for us southpaws, Shun not only makes left-handed handles for their knives, the right-handed handles aren't particularly insecure or uncomfortable used in the left hand.

However, a honing steel is not a knife blade.  Steels must be bilaterally symmetric because their tops and bottoms are used as part of the same function.  Shun Classic steels are round, which means that they don't really have a left, right, top or bottom.  No matter whether the steel's D handle is held with the right hand or the left, the steel will still present an appropriate surface to the knife. 

But, ambidextrous or not, fitting a D handle on a steel was a dumb idea.  Because the steel will always held with the same hand position, it will functionally have a top and bottom which get used, and left and right sides which don't.  Thus the steel will wear unevenly. 

BDL


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## crext

Thanks for the response!

Can you or anyone that knows explain another thing about the steel for me?

The ring/Hand guard above the handle has a bevel to it.  I've heard that it's a 16 degree bevel (Haven't measured but I'll believe that) to provide a relatively easy angle reference for honing.  Now with that said, the ring/hand guard is not round but has a flat portion to it.  seems to be beveled at a different angle as well.  Is this for another type of blade that Shun makes?

Thanks again,

Rob


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## boar_d_laze

The "flat portion" prevents the steel from rolling off the counter and hitting your wife's foot. 

BDL


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## Iceman

_Classic_. TY.


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## harlock0083

boar_d_laze said:


> The "flat portion" prevents the steel from rolling off the counter and hitting your wife's foot.
> 
> BDL


That's silly, my wife never enters the kitchen.


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## crext

boar_d_laze said:


> The "flat portion" prevents the steel from rolling off the counter and hitting your wife's foot.
> 
> BDL


Haha! makes sense. Thanks again!

Rob


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## foodlover42

BDL I was under the impression the angled section on the shun steel was to aid users to hold their knife at a proper angle for steeling.  I feel like I read it somewhere in some piece of Shun literature, but I cant seem to find where it was.  Any thoughts on this?


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## boar_d_laze

> I was under the impression the angled section on the shun steel was to aid users to hold their knife at a proper angle for steeling. I feel like I read it somewhere in some piece of Shun literature, but I cant seem to find where it was. Any thoughts on this?


This is from the Shun Classic Steel page at WS:


> To guarantee top performance from your cutlery, use this steel to hone knife blades. The forged-steel rod helps restore a knife's sharp edge by trueing it - that is, smoothing and realigning the blade's cutting edge.
> _*Built-in 16-degree guide helps you hone at the correct angle.*_
> Rod is forged from high-carbon steel.
> Durable PakkaWood handle resists moisture and has a D shape, to sit comfortably in the hand.
> This NSF-certified steel meets the high-level safety standards for professional kitchens.
> Designed by Shun, a Japanese company that has produced fine cutlery for more than 90 years.


[Emphasis added]

The idea of including an example of the appropriate angle -- the same at which the knife was sharpened -- is a nice touch. Too bad whoever edited the copy couldn't spell _truing_ correctly.

BDL


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## foodlover42

Awesome, I wasnt sure if I had simply made that up or it was in fact useful information. Thanks for your help!


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## samk

I sent in several of our Shun knives for sharpening by KAI.  We have duplicates of several of the knives.  The ones sent for sharpening came back with an extensive portion of the blade ground down and they weren't really sharp.  Obviously having so much of the blade ground away will significantly shorten the life of the knife.  I was VERY disappointed in this lifetime service and would not recommend it.  Buy a whetstone and sharpen them yourself!


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## millionsknives

Are you sure it's your knife or did they just send another one they already sharpened?


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## loomchick

One of the best things I did to better understand knife sharpening and improve my honing and sharpening skills was to get in-person instruction. See if there's anyone or any place your area that provides instruction. Short of that, Craftsy has a free on-line class, *Complete Knife Skills*, that may help you out. There's a section on knife sharpening. the price is right. I don't necessarily agree 100% with everything, but I enjoy seeing how others handle and care for their knives.

Complete Knife Skills - http://www.craftsy.com/lecture/s/70...eySymbol=$&NAVIGATION_PAGE_CONTEXT_ATTR=CLASS


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## lawngnome

I had the exact same experience when I sent my Shun Classic chef knife in to KAI for sharpening -- it came back missing more than 1/4" of its original blade height, with a wierd new taper toward the heel.  I was appalled at the amount of steel they removed. When I complained, they said the new shape gave it personality and that I should appreciate it.

It looks like they (at least sometimes) have new or inexperienced workers doing their warranty sharpening service, and that they were really enjoying running a belt grinder.

Anyone else run into this?


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## ssh1512

I am so happy I ran into this thread!  I was just boxing up my Shuns to have them sharpened.  I have worked fine dining in years past (but only front of the house), and sent some of my knives (although not the Shuns) out for sharpening with the service that sharpens the restaurant knives.  I was shocked at the loss of blade, when they returned!  I was in the habit of using a steel, so they were not criminally dull, but I thought it would be nice to have a sharper edge.  

I (wrongly) assumed this would not happen, being I was sending the knives back to the "manufacturer", but I suppose that is an assumption I should have not made... 

I do have a stone set (a Christmas gift), but I have been chicken to use it on my knives.  I know enough to practice on cheaper knives (but not too cheap), but I haven't yet started.  I will continue to do research to gather more knowledge before I attempt the practical experience.  Perhaps I will also purchase the Shun hone to assist with the proper angle for these knives.

God, I love the Internet!  Thank you for potentially saving me (and my Shuns) from disappointment!


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## foody518

Go carefully, use the Sharpie/magic marker trick, and check your progress frequently vs absently grinding away on the edge for dozens of strokes.

Shun hone?? The rod? There's no need. And it's not good anyways.


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## rick alan

ssh1512 said:


> I am so happy I ran into this thread! I was just boxing up my Shuns to have them sharpened. I have worked fine dining in years past (but only front of the house), and sent some of my knives (although not the Shuns) out for sharpening with the service that sharpens the restaurant knives. I was shocked at the loss of blade, when they returned! I was in the habit of using a steel, so they were not criminally dull, but I thought it would be nice to have a sharper edge.
> 
> I (wrongly) assumed this would not happen, being I was sending the knives back to the "manufacturer", but I suppose that is an assumption I should have not made...
> 
> I do have a stone set (a Christmas gift), but I have been chicken to use it on my knives. I know enough to practice on cheaper knives (but not too cheap), but I haven't yet started. I will continue to do research to gather more knowledge before I attempt the practical experience. Perhaps I will also purchase the Shun hone to assist with the proper angle for these knives.
> 
> God, I love the Internet! Thank you for potentially saving me (and my Shuns) from disappointment!


Shun does that to everyone it seems, their sharpening service is a gaff. I sent a defective knife to them and they refuse to replace it. And even though I didn't ask they removed 3mm from the edge and left a 50deg inclusive angle. They are really scum.


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## martin gonzalez

I use the Shun 1000/6000 stone and it gives me a razors edge every time.


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## rick alan

I have a Shun 1/6K, they work but are arguably the lowest on the Totem Pole.  Firstly, it dishes very quickly, its just a mud-binder, the cheapest to manufacture.  Secondly the 6K side acts more like it is less than 4K by other standards.  Mine was also full of hard black impurities the size of large sand grains, which I would have to dig out frequently.  And they are not even full size.  Not at all worth the $50 they usually go for

For the money you can always do better than Shun, and that really goes for all the big knife companies.


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## Iceman

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Iceman


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Jun 22, 2016


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## rick alan

Well that is likely how most Shuns get sharpened.


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## brianshaw

That is likely how many working knives get sharpened... and there is nothing wrong with that if it meets the needs of the user.


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## Iceman

The _"Home Cook"_ type person could use a _"Chef's Choice"_ every Saturday for 10-years and never have any problems in the kitchen. It makes very simple sense. 


> "... and there is nothing wrong with that if it meets the needs of the user."


That is the direction I'm going.


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## Iceman

Since the audience of the original topic is just ordinary regular people cutting up ordinary regular food products for ordinary regular meals ... your point is moot. I can't see any knife-worshipping guy like you even having any experience with ordinary regular pedestrian home cooking tools such as those that I'm talking about. I'm not sure that guys like you who probably spend more time maintaining your holy-grail knives ever actually use them for their given purpose creating edible meals. 

I don't care what knife you bring to the kitchen ... It not going to work any better than my $15, machine sharpened, home cook's knife.


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## rick alan

Benuser said:


> ...and find out after a few weeks that even easy tasks become more and more difficult since the blade has thickened behind the edge.





IceMan said:


> Since the audience of the original topic is just ordinary regular people cutting up ordinary regular food products for ordinary regular meals ... your point is moot. I can't see any knife-worshipping guy like you even having any experience with ordinary regular pedestrian home cooking tools such as those that I'm talking about. I'm not sure that guys like you who probably spend more time maintaining your holy-grail knives ever actually use them for their given purpose creating edible meals.
> 
> I don't care what knife you bring to the kitchen ... It not going to work any better than my $15, machine sharpened, home cook's knife.


And so in the long run you'd do better for less trading the shuns and CC for a half dozen or so NSF bread knives.

There! The perfect solution for the average home cook! You have to admit it Iceman.


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## Iceman

Rick ... What I'll admit is that the ordinary home person doesn't give a rat's tail bit of difference to all the technical knife facts as long as whatever they grab is sharp and does the job. The average person doesn't care about bevels, angles, stone grits, blade metallurgy et al the stuff you knife geeks just love to discuss ad infinitum. The time they spend in a week using a main knife is probably less time then you guys spend sharpening just 1 knife. Now I'll admit that it's real easy to get sick and tired of ME real fast. Along with that I tell you that many people, not just me, are sick of the same techno-jargon about knives over and over in every thread a knife question comes up. Regular ordinary people just want simple easy get the job done answers that they can live with. Many many times a simple $50 knife and a $35 Chef's choice is all they need and are looking for. If someone asks what time it is ... TELL THEM ... you don't need to build them a watch.


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## rick alan

$35 for a 3-stage CC, do they have to give those things away now? Used to be anyway that you couldn't get a Minosharp for that money.


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## Iceman

Actually YES. I got mine at Target ... on sale. It's got 2 grinding wheels and a twin-bar to deburr. For ordinary regular home use it works just fine. That is it works just fine on my $49 3-knife V-F set ... that I also got on sale.


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## foody518

I've been doing something similar since the close to the start of this year whenever I can get over to my community kitchen to sharpen their NSF knives (Winco, Sysco SaniSafe, etc.).

My soaking tub and progression - 220 (there are always chips) -> 500 (solid bevel setting) -> 1200 (even burr generation and then begin removal) (-> 3k only sometimes if I feel the burr needs to be abraded more. Feeling like the 3k is helping is probably just my technique needing work). 

Still kind of slow at sharpening, so about 20 min per knife from crazy worn out and chipped, to gliding through tomatoes, sharpening at once a month or so frequency with close to daily hard usage by the staff and volunteers (probably a lot of home cooks or otherwise less experienced folks) alike on hard poly boards.

I know in the past I'd seen a small tabletop belt grinder there as well as a multistage CC, not sure if electric or not. Maybe it was a function of lack of a finer belt or user error on those equipment or not attended to frequently enough, but the knives were not in good shape and had some crazy profile deformations, lots of reverse bellies on the knives.

They're getting sharper and holding up for longer now, though ideally it would be nice to go there every week or two for maintenance vs monthly. The head chef can take a crazy dull knife that doesn't even touch the board at 1/3 of the back of the knife and bang out prep 2-3x faster than I will ever manage to, but for a lot of the others, particularly the volunteers, I think the better sharpened knives are helping.

The couple of times I've talked knives or stones from inquisitive people there I haven't mentioned anything fancier than like a Tojiro DP or sub $50 stones, and I'll throw out Dexter and VF and the like as recommendations for someone who is starting from scratch on learning what's out there.


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## drew4392

Wow, really glad I stumbled upon this thread before shipping off my Classics to KAI for sharpening.  Damn.  One of the big selling points was free, "professional", whetstone sharpening for life.  

Numerous reports of how the edges come back after their sharpening service has me worried.  I mean, I guess it makes sense that is would be very challenging to have a master bladesmith sitting at a ultra premium whetstone all day cranking out tons of knifes being sent it... for free.  

At least that's what I was told :-/

I guess this is an opportunity to learn how to do it myself.  

Thanks, all.


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## millionsknives

The way I see it, a really good synthetic stone costs the same as shipping your knife to them a couple times. And if you do it yourself, no waiting!


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## foody518

And unless you have some means of conveying how you want the knife sharpened, you have zero input in the result you get back. Do you need it to be more abuse friendly? Are you more careful and can afford to be performance oriented? No versatility there.


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## rick alan

drew4392 said:


> Wow, really glad I stumbled upon this thread before shipping off my Classics to KAI for sharpening. Damn. One of the big selling points was free, "professional", whetstone sharpening for life.
> 
> Numerous reports of how the edges come back after their sharpening service has me worried. I mean, I guess it makes sense that is would be very challenging to have a master bladesmith sitting at a ultra premium whetstone all day cranking out tons of knifes being sent it... for free.
> 
> At least that's what I was told :-/
> 
> I guess this is an opportunity to learn how to do it myself.
> 
> Thanks, all.


Actually the salesman didn't lie, he simply omitted the dictionary meaning of "whetstone" which amounts to just about any abrasive surface that can be used for sharpening, like a big, coarse and fast spinning grinding wheel, which I am very certain is part of their free sharpening.


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