# How to serve pasta through out the day?



## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

I'm helping out at an event with an Italian theme. The event is running though out the day and I am running a pasta stall. (It's a walk up stall so there is no set opening and closing time)

I will have a bain marie, fridge and a pasta cooker (A tub of hot water with little baskets you put the pasta in to cook it).

I will be serving in three portion sizes.

What I plan to do is make the pasta sauce (three different types) in the morning and put it in the fridge. When it gets close to lunch time I shall turn on the bain marie and heat the pasta sauce in it (I presume this is OK), and I'll stir it occasionally.

What I'm stuck with is doing the pasta. I may have lots of customers so I need to serve quick. Can pasta be kept in a bain marie?

Ideally I would like to fill the cup with pasta (Depending on which size they have) and pour some sauce over it and give it to them, nice and quick.

I'm not sure how to do that with the pasta- I'll be using Penne pasta- should I cook the pasta in the pasta cooker and put it in a bain marie on it's own, or should I put it in a bain marie mixed with sauce?

One very last question- If I have some sauce left in the bain marie after the lunch period, can I stick it back in the fridge and reheat it or do I need to throw it and make another lot for the dinner period?

I'm not an expert on this, I've just been drafted in to give a helping hand so your advice is much appreciated!

(I've not got a lot of space either, but If there is any other equipment I should need I think I could get it.)

Thanks!!!


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

IMO, a bain marie cannot be used to HEAT something, only to HOLD, you will need to HEAT your sauces in some other manner.

Reheating previously cooked sauces must attain a temperature of 165°F for 15 seconds, then they can be held at, depending on local regulations, 135°-140°, which is the temperature of most bain maries.


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

PeteMcCracken said:


> IMO, a bain marie cannot be used to HEAT something, only to HOLD, you will need to HEAT your sauces in some other manner.
> 
> Reheating previously cooked sauces must attain a temperature of 165°F for 15 seconds, then they can be held at, depending on local regulations, 135°-140°, which is the temperature of most bain maries.


Thanks. What would you recommend to use to heat it to 165 degrees?


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Roooob said:


> Thanks. What would you recommend to use to heat it to 165 degrees?


A hotplate, butane burner or something similar.


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

PeteMcCracken said:


> A hotplate, butane burner or something similar.


So if I had one of these there too, I can just cook the sauce in a saucepan on the hot plate, then stick it in the bain marie. Do you know how long a bain marie would keep it hot for?


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

Pete has guided you the right way . How long will it keep hot assuming it is boiling wate r(that's 212) Temp) if you constantly stir  as the bain marie empties, add more hot water dipped  pasta and hot sauce it should stay hot all night.  If you refrig a sauce, bring it to a boil if possible before re use. . (On this type of gig  gig stay away from any cream sauces if you can)  Use sterno under bain marie or chaffers .


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## meezenplaz (Jan 31, 2012)

2 sternos under a hotel pan will actually heat stuffs to simmering temperatures, just dont

try to do that beneath a chaffer *waterpan, *it'll warp to high heaven. Then once you see the

simmer, you can dump the lot into the holding pot.

With the amount of time you're considering holding for, I would keep the pasta and sauce

separate and, as you mentioned....pasta in cup, then sauce on top. But you CAN'T let the

pasta dry out, (and it will even in a bain marie or similar) you have to keep some water

in there on the bottom, keep it covered, and stir now and then.

You'll be at holding temps, 135 to 165 say, so it wont continue cooking.

I've had no prob using this method over a hundred times in Maries and chaffer ssetups.

The link you posted is an electric plate, I prefer a butane burner, theyre cheap,

10 to $20.00 US, and totally self contained. I use them in catering extensively.





  








PortableButaneBurner.jpg




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meezenplaz


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Nov 24, 2012


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Meezenplaz said:


> 2 sternos under a hotel pan will actually heat stuffs to simmering temperatures, just dont
> 
> try to do that beneath a chaffer *waterpan, *it'll warp to high heaven. Then once you see the
> 
> ...


Thanks, that's very helpful.

I'd just like to run through what i'll do it check I understand.

Prepare the sauce in the morning just before opening (follow the recipe and cook the sauce using a butane burner)

Put it in the bain marie to keep warm (should I leave it open or put a lid on it?)

Cook a few portions of pasta and once cooked put it in a bain marie with a little bit of water (Just enough to cover the bottom or enough to cover the pasta?) and keep the lid on it.

Stir the sauce and pasta regularly.

During the quiet periods I can then prepare more sauce and allow it to cool in the fridge, then heat it up when I run low so I don't have to spend time preparing more from scratch.

Then when I serve, I just spoon some pasta in the cup and pour over some sauce and that's that!

Chef Edb- you said I should stay away from cream sauces. I was hoping to serve three different sauces - A simple tomato one, a macaroni cheese one and possibly a carbonara sauce- does this mean I should only do the tomato one (maybe three different variations?)


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

Why don't you prepare the pasta the way Italian chefs do it: cook until nearly al dente, drain and chuck in cold water to stop them cooking, then coat in a little olive oil so that they don't stick. When serving, just dip them in boiling well-salted water for a minute.


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Recky said:


> Why don't you prepare the pasta the way Italian chefs do it: cook until nearly al dente, drain and chuck in cold water to stop them cooking, then coat in a little olive oil so that they don't stick. When serving, just dip them in boiling well-salted water for a minute.


I need a quick turn around for the pasta as it's not a restaurant or cafe- more of a take away food. One minute might be too long to wait for the pasta if I have a customer in front of me waiting for it, I could end up with a long queue?


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

Roooob said:


> I need a quick turn around for the pasta as it's not a restaurant or cafe- more of a take away food. One minute might be too long to wait for the pasta if I have a customer in front of me waiting for it, I could end up with a long queue?


I have sold spaghetti and "hedgerow" pesto from a stall before, and that's exactly what I did. You're basically only heating the pasta up in the boiling water. Holding cooked pasta in a bain-marie will render it overcooked and soggy.


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Recky said:


> I have sold spaghetti and "hedgerow" pesto from a stall before, and that's exactly what I did. You're basically only heating the pasta up in the boiling water. Holding cooked pasta in a bain-marie will render it overcooked and soggy.


Ok, so if the water is already boiling would it take less time or would it still be a minute?


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

Roooob said:


> Ok, so if the water is already boiling would it take less time or would it still be a minute?


Depends on how far you take the pasta during the first blanching. The bare minimum, I guess, would be around 30 seconds to heat them through in boiling water. But if you have several baskets in which to cook your pasta, only the first in the queue will have to wait a minute or so.

The benefit of blanching pasta until nearly al dente and finishing them off in one or two minutes is that you get a little more tolerance while being busy looking for your parmesan grater or chatting with your customers


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Recky said:


> Depends on how far you take the pasta during the first blanching. The bare minimum, I guess, would be around 30 seconds to heat them through in boiling water. But if you have several baskets in which to cook your pasta, only the first in the queue will have to wait a minute or so.
> 
> The benefit of blanching pasta until nearly al dente and finishing them off in one or two minutes is that you get a little more tolerance while being busy looking for your parmesan grater or chatting with your customers


Fair enough, I guess I'll just have to try it with a small portion of pasta to see which method works best.

How do you know when it's cooked to nearly al dente?


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

Roooob said:


> Fair enough, I guess I'll just have to try it with a small portion of pasta to see which method works best.
> 
> How do you know when it's cooked to nearly al dente?


Using tongs, remove one pasta item from pan, place in your mouth, chew... ;-)


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Recky said:


> Using tongs, remove one pasta item from pan, place in your mouth, chew... ;-)


/img/vbsmilies/smilies/lol.gif Does it vary each time or is it roughly after, say 10 minutes?

I'm still edging towards the 'stick it in a bain marie with a bit of water' because it means I can immediately serve it. I guess I should just do some trial and error to see which is best for my situation.


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

Roooob said:


> /img/vbsmilies/smilies/lol.gif Does it vary each time or is it roughly after, say 10 minutes?
> 
> I'm still edging towards the 'stick it in a bain marie with a bit of water' because it means I can immediately serve it. I guess I should just do some trial and error to see which is best for my situation.


You'll find that you will achieve what I call "canteen quality" - pasta does not take well to being kept in water, because it will absorb it and go soggy.

It's important to time the blanching, so that each batch has the same degree of al-dente-ness.


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

I'm sure customers won't actually mind watching "their" pasta cooked while they wait. At least that's what I found when I did my pasta stall.


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Recky said:


> I'm sure customers won't actually mind watching "their" pasta cooked while they wait. At least that's what I found when I did my pasta stall.


I suppose if they are watching it being cooked they know that it's being cooked properly, not simply being heated in a microwave or something 

So i'll do a test run near the time and see how long it takes to cook until almost ready. I'll note that time down. Then when it's cooked I put it straight in cold water (kept in a fridge?) and will it be okay to leave it in that for a good few hours?

Then after a while i'll take it out and plunge it into well salted (How much it that? /img/vbsmilies/smilies/blushing.gif) water for about 30 seconds and see if it's ready. Then when it comes to the day I should have some pretty accurate timings to use


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## thatchairlady (Feb 15, 2012)

Slightly OT, but on reheating al dente pasta.  I'm notorious for cooking too much... always feel a need to toss in a little more, no matter what. When I do end up with too much, will put in zip bag or container and into fridge if gonna use it the next day or so.  For longer storage, into freezer... vac sealing is ideal for me.  Even from frozen, only needs to go into salted/simmering water until it separates... no significant addition cooking time... MAYBE a minute!?!


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## meezenplaz (Jan 31, 2012)

I take it from what youve said, it's a one-at-a time serve, each smiling hungry guest waiting for their pasta, while a que

spreads out behind them? How much counter length do you have? Can you fit 2 or 3 guests ALONG the counter, like a very

short buffet line, with the que angled off the rearmost one? Cuz that would move it much faster....plate one, grab the next,

plate, pop in some more pasta, plate the next and so on, on a rotation, once you get the rhythm down...

But even if single file, the "rotation" method is important, and if properly done, will absorb that minute of cooking just fine.

As you said you're going to have to experiment a little.

As to the pasta getting soggy in water....first, Chef Recky while you sound pretty knowledgable, *tips Chef hat* all I can say

is I've done this a lot, with just enough water and just hot enough, and have never had a problem with soggy pasta.

However, I've rarely held it that way more than 2 to 3 hours, so past that, I make no claims, and like you mentioned,

I initially cooked my pasta to barely al dente. But that was often spaghetti or fettuccini; penne I've found holds up a little

better.

Secondly this type of service, like buffet service, isnt high end dining, so those eating are likely to be....less discerning

about pasta doneness. Its the sauce that tends to get the most criticism.

One more thing....I've served my EZee-creme-alfredo sauce this way quite often and it always held just fine with the above

mentioned methods--I typically offered marinara, meat sauce and alfredo sauce with 2 or 3 types of pasta.


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Meezenplaz said:


> I take it from what youve said, it's a one-at-a time serve, each smiling hungry guest waiting for their pasta, while a que
> 
> spreads out behind them? How much counter length do you have? Can you fit 2 or 3 guests ALONG the counter, like a very
> 
> ...


Good post thanks.

I could probably fit two people next to each other at a push, but there will only be me running the stall so I wouldn't be able to do at lot of stuff!

What I could do is whilst it's not busy, I could use the 'dip in hot water' method, then as it gets busy I could put some water in a bain marie and cook a few batches of pasta at the same time and tip them in the bain marie, so i'm cooking the pasta and putting it in the bain marie, then serving from the bain marie (This way customers don't have to wait too long and i'll be able to serve quicker as a queue builds up)

And as you said, it's not high end dining- it's a £1.50 /£2 snack to fill some tummies!

I was thinking about the sauces, I could do a macaroni sauce and a tomato sauce, then the third one I could just take some of the tomato sauce and throw in a few slices of chilli- it's more exciting than plain pasta so it's more appealing to those who think pasta is a bit basic.


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

Meez, you're right actually. Penne is a lot more forgiving than spaghetti. When I was running my street fest pasta stall I was only doing spaghetti, and these I felt had to hold cold, only coated with a little olive oil.

I also find that the cheaper the dried pasta, the less forgiving it is. With quality pasta, the "al dente window" seems a lot greater; the cheap stuff cooks from nearly al dente to past al dente within seconds...

Roob: Why don't you add some veg (e.g. bell peppers) to the chili tomato sugo, i.e. a little more interest and difference?


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

This is what I am telling you to do only put in bain marie as it empties down.(dip pasta in water first) Cream sauces will tend to get gummy. Try a pesto , Marinara, Tomato or tomato vodka, boulanaisse.


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Does the pasta being dry or fresh make a difference?


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

I prefer dry and then precooked. Don't use oil in water as it does nothing except it stops foaming. With the pasta coated with oil it will tend to repel the sauce. It does NOT stop it from sticking together while cooking, stirring  does , that an old wives tail.. Since oil floats to top of water, how does it stop sticking together???  Same thing with salt. People say putting salt in makes water hotter therefore better to cook pasta . Salt will raise water temp about  1 to 2 degrees and that does nothing .


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## meezenplaz (Jan 31, 2012)

boulanaisse? /img/vbsmilies/smilies/confused.gif

Just be sure your guy provides you a LOT of pasta on hand to allow for any

unanticipated waste, especially since you have to learn as you go along.

But I have a feeling you'll get the hang of it quickly, master your booth and do fine. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/chef.gif


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

chefedb said:


> I prefer dry and then precooked. Don't use oil in water as it does nothing except it stops foaming. With the pasta coated with oil it will tend to repel the sauce. It does NOT stop it from sticking together while cooking, stirring does , that an old wives tail.. Since oil floats to top of water, how does it stop sticking together??? Same thing with salt. People say putting salt in makes water hotter therefore better to cook pasta . Salt will raise water temp about 1 to 2 degrees and that does nothing .


While I completely agree with the comment on oil, I would NEVER EVER cook pasta without salt, quite a lot actually - the water has to taste like the sea. Pasta cooked without (or with too little salt) tastes insipid to the point of being almost inedible.


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## meezenplaz (Jan 31, 2012)

Well sure, salting the pasta water has nothing to do with raising the temperature,

eg to cook it faster, that IS a myth. Even if it does, its negligible.

When you salt the water youre basically _brining _the pasta just as you would poultry.

The pasta absorbs salt, adding needed _flavour _to a typically bland product. I say typically,

because there ARE flavored pastas, which may or may not need the help.

Adding the salt to the cooked pasta isnt the same thing at all.

As to the oil, I add a bit of olive or butter (depending on dish) to the cooked pasta,

adds some flavor and does cut down on stickiness, especially if the pasta happened

to miss that "al dente window" you spoke of, ending a bit over cooked.


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## roooob (Nov 23, 2012)

Thanks for the info everyone.

So the equipment I need is a bain marie, the pasta boiler, a butane burner, a small fridge, hot and cold water with sink.

Obviously stuff like knives, chopping boards, etc too /img/vbsmilies/smilies/biggrin.gif

Is that all for the main equipment?


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

Roooob said:


> Thanks for the info everyone.
> 
> So the equipment I need is a bain marie, the pasta boiler, a butane burner, a small fridge, hot and cold water with sink.
> 
> ...


As many bowls as there are sauces to toss with the pasta, cheese grater and lots of parmesan. Serving spoons.


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## sparkie (Feb 12, 2011)

Recky has loads of good tips for you, I would follow all his suggestions, it's sound advice. Just want to make sure you're not confused by Chef Ed's post. Although what he said is correct, salt in the water is vital(that's been covered and it does need to taste like sea water) oil IS necessary to prevent the pasta from sticking AFTER it has been blanched, shocked, and drained. When I pre-cook tube shaped pastas, I will generally cut the recommend al dente time (found on the package) in half. If it's a high quality pasta, I will add1-2 minutes. Do this one day in advance. They will be very crunchy after cooking, but don't worry, overnight the moisture will move from the outer part of the pasta to the inside. The next day, when you reheat the pasta, it'll take up to one minute depending on how fast the water can rebound to boiling. If you can't blanch the pasta a day ahead, then I would cook them 2-3 minutes less than the recommended al dente time.

Now let's hear about your pasta cooker. Is this similar looking to a deep fryer with an over flow drain that you can constantly run a stream of water into? Or is it just a large pot that you put over a burner? Without the over flow drain and running water you are going to have a problem with foaming and will need to change the water frequently. You may need to plan on a couple of hours worth of waiting for a pot to boil( collectively).

One thing I have done, is use multiple tomato sauces. A plain(simplice) to "color" the pasta. This is


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## sparkie (Feb 12, 2011)

M(Oops wrong button)

You can toss the pasta in a plain tomato sauce, then top it with marinara, Bolognese, arrabiata(spicy), mushrooms and vegetables, whatever. This way you can reheat the pasta in batches, 10, 20, 30 orders depending on the length of your line and toss with the simple sauce. Put whatever amount of pasta in the cup and then top with the desired sauce. This is the most efficient way to serve multiple choices to lots of people. If you want to do a cheese or cream sauce as well, it can be done. They don't hold well, so when you are reheating the pasta, toss most of it with the simple tomato and hold in the bain. Then the rest with the cream sauce and then top with more on the pick up. For this type of service I try to steer clear of cream/ cheese sauces, but sometimes you just have to do it, and it can be done, but it is a pain in the arse to do right.


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## recky (Oct 15, 2012)

Apart from the foaming problem Sparkie mentions you will find that the water boils away more quickly than you can say "sauce", so a constant supply of hot water (e.g. a large electric kettle) might be a good idea...


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