# stainless steel or aluminum



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

Hi,

I have been trying to find mini smooth tart shells, not the fluted/ wavy on the side type of shells that are pretty much common in any restaurant/baking stores.

I have been to many places and all have the fluted types

So I thought of this clever idea of getting a stainless steel or aluminum pipe from a metal store/shop and get them to cut 3/4" thick to match up the usual tart rings height like 3" 5" 9" 10" diameter and other tart sizes

I'm not sure which type of metal I should use for mini tarts... so what do you guys think is best? stainless steel or aluminum?

Thanks


----------



## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

It will be very hard to find S/s pipe in the dimensions you listed, and even so, (deleted) expensive.  O.t.o.h. the metal shop can weld a sheet of metal into a cylinder, and take slices off of that.

The only real negative with aluminum is that it oxidizes, but other than that will be finetd


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

i'm not looking 3/4", 3" 5" 9" or 10" diameter if that what you are thinking of

I'm looking for 1.5" diameter pipe and then cut 3/4" thick


----------



## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Check with your local muffler shop.


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

I have a place near where I live called metal superstores

http://www.metalsupermarkets.com/

what is the best metal to get? PeteMcCraken


----------



## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

I prefer stainless.


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

alright cool...

Do you guys think 1.5" diameter with 3/4" in height is a good size for a mini tart shell?


----------



## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Yeah, but it all depends on what price the tart is selling for.

For metal tart shells.I bite the bullet and get the fancy French "Matfer" ones--BUT NOT the black non-stick coating.  Then I bite another bullet and for 50 cents a piece, get them glazed at a place that specializes in glazing baker's bread pans with a food-safe non-stick glaze.

Why?  Do you ask, do I go through all that bother?

It's a real (deleted) to line out a tart shell  with perfectly plumb walls, and even more of a (deleted) to bake the suckers blind. 

When the form has semi-sloping walls, It's a no-brainer to stamp out dough rounds and fit them in, using my thumb to "cut off" any overhanging dough and to tamp in the dough tightly between the walls and the bottom of the form.

If the form is unfluted and has serious sloping walls, it gets even easier to line the suckers out:  Roll out your dough, spread your forms on the counter with about 3 finger's width between them, drape the dough over the whole mess, squeeze the forms together, tamp the bottoms down with a wad of floured dough, and use a rolling pin to cut the forms free.  I can do 24- 30 forms in one fell swoop with this method.  But I can't do this when the forms have perfectly plumb walls.


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

well I thought of two business concepts.... and having a very hard time deciding on which one that i want to do

1. mini desserts only... like mini cupcakes, mini shortbread cookies, mini tarts, mini entremet in a plastic shot cups (maybe), macarons (maybe) and a few other desserts...There is no mini desserts shop where I live except a cupcake shop that sell standard and mini sizes. Also people might enjoy eating different desserts at a small price point and good for dessert tables for wedding, b-day, corporate etc

2. general desserts shop but serve standard single sizes for day to day operation and have mini desserts for order only at a minimum amount... I think the usual tart size is 3" diameter and 3/4" in height.. probably price it maybe $4? so the mini tart would be 1.5" diameter and 3/4" in height... might price it at $2.25? ... There is a mini tarts shop in west hollywood and they sell it at 2.50, they serve in a 1.5" by 1.5" square size mini tarts

matfer doesn't have what I'm looking for... all got fluted tarts... I got a price quote from my metal shop guy and he said it will cost me .49 cents each stainless steel piece (1.5" D and 3/4" H) from a stainless steel pipe... not a bad price at all ... maybe they have a food safe non-stick glaze service or they can suggest a place


----------



## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Do yourself a favour, go down to a Home Despot or Lowes nd gt yorself a length of abs pipe in the diameter you want.

Slice it up into rings. It'll cut with a hacksaw or any table saw blade Now, clean them up and get some dough and try lining the suckers out.

I Insist on you doing this, O.K.?

It's a right royal pain in the arse. With a "proper" tart pan, the bottom is included, so you can pop in a disc of dough, press it into the corners, and use your thumbs to trim off. With pipe slices, you have no bottom, so the ring has to be *constantly* on the sheet pan, and when it shifts around, the dough shifts with it, ruining your work. And, because the walls of a ring are perfectly vertical, it will be very frustrating--if not impossible--to bake the tart blind, which you will need to do for maybe 50% of your tarts.. I believe I said this in my above post.

Yes the rings are cheaper, but your labour to accommodate lining a ring with dough will be 8-10 times MORE than with a "proper" tart form.

You can use the abs rings for indv. cheesecake-lets (wrap it in 2 layers of alum foil when you poach them)

You can use metal rings for cakes and other desserts, but for tarts, it will be a right royal pain in the arse.

You money, your time, your labour, your choice.

I've been there and done it,and my advice is free.

Just consider it, O.K.?


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

I get what you are saying now...I do agree with what you are saying.... I will look around and see if I can get a bottom for them or get something custom cause I don't want the fluted tart shell cause everybody have that... there is unfluted mini tart pan, but it look more like a shot glass and the height is too high

I actually sent an e-mail to the mini tart shop about where they got their tart shell and they told me that they got it custom made in asia but the customer service rep doesn't know the name of the company because she wasn't there when the business was launched..........do you know a company that does custom metal?

maybe I can ask the metal shop if they can put a disc underneath it but the problem with that .. is the welding marks that connect the ring and the disc... might not create a perfect circle... maybe they can take a sheet metal and push into a 1.5 diameter form and trim off the metal around it to make look like a  cap.. you know what i mean?


----------



## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Cruise your local supermarkets!

They have individual, tart size, crusts with an aluminum disposable pan.

Look at these: http://www.pastrychef.com/INDIVIDUAL-SERVING-PIE-PAN-SET_p_1230.html

And these: http://www.toaster-oven.net/minipiepanset.aspx

Or these: http://www.globalsugarart.com/cat.php?cid=885&s=&name=SILVERWOOD Cake Pans/Baking Supplies

PSST! Google CAN be your friend!


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

lol... google is not my friend right now... those tarts are the same ones that I saw which I don't want... it got a slope and it too high

I want something that is straight up

check this mini tart shop in west hollywood called fruute ... http://www.fruute.com/

I want something like that but in a circle form... they have a custom mold for these tarts


----------



## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

OK, but if you look closely, every one of their baked products have sloping sides, there IS a reason!


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

Yeah I know there are slopes... I have seen them personally

but not the tart rings, they are straight up like these

http://in102925451.trustpass.alibab...606491/Tart_Ring_3_5_6_7_8_9_10_10_5_11_.html

I just want 1.5" diameter with the same height of 3/4" in height and has a bottom

here is an example of a circle tart with no slope... http://www.valrhona-chocolate.com/Chocolatetart


----------



## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Like I said, get some 1 1/2" pipe and try it out for yourself, it's very hard to fit fingers in there, let alone fit in  a disc of dough so you don't have any air pockets between the bottom and the walls.

The graduated ring from India set starts at 3", which leaves you some room to move your fingers and the dough around, not ideal, but do-able.

The Valrhona pic looks great.  There are companies that make pre-baked tart shells, and companies that use "real" ingredients like butter, eggs, nuts, etc..  The method used to line these shells is the same for the ubiquitous tart shells you see in the freezer at your grocer, they are "hot stamped"

With hot stamping  you have a heated press which has a male die and a female die, a metal form (usually disposable alum foil) is placed in the female die, a wad of dough placed in the form, the male die comes down and squishes the dough into the form. Many small to medium sized bakeries have a manual version of this machine, which still allows the operator to line a good number of shells in a short period of time.

If you are serious about running a business that makes tarts, a large chunk of your  labour will be lining the shells with dough.  After you do a few thousand forms, and with crumbly dough like a sable with ground nuts, you will learn to appreciate a good tart form--not a ring, but a form. You will also learn to respect gravity, that is, gravity will always pull the dough down as it bakes.


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

I did had a run in by using a dough in a mini muffin pan like last year... I remember it was a bit of a pain in the butt... 1.5" diameter is smaller than the mini muffin... I would probably melt the mini tart pans out of frustration after a while lol


----------



## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Mulak,

I use the tart rings all the time, albeit 7" (actually 175mm) and they work well.

I tried 2" (made my own out of empty cans) and they didn't work worth, well, you know. Even 3" were not really workable.

Good luck on trying. Please let me know if you find something that works.


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

you guys make mini tarts sounds like they are the death of pastry shop/bakery haha


----------



## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

No, not if you use the right equipment. Why do you think tart or tartlet pans generally have sloped sides?


Mulak said:


> you guys make mini tarts sounds like they are the death of pastry shop/bakery haha


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

so it cling to the side and create a light crumbly texture or else let gravity compress it down taste like a hard cookie 

Do you guys know fat daddios brand?

there is a mini tart but it fluted

http://www.fatdaddios.com/catalog/mini-1-14

if I buy one and bring it to a metal shop and get them to create a smooth edge version of it... would that work?


----------



## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Sure, that would work, but take a look at a Google search for mini muffin pans: https://www.google.com/search?q=min...f2rAHX_syMCQ&ved=0CEgQ_AUoAQ&biw=1247&bih=543

I use them all the time for phyllo, pie dough, pate brisee, and shortbread tartletts. And I don't have to chase all over the kitchen for each little piece /img/vbsmilies/smilies/crazy.gif

The ones I have at hand are 3/4" tall, 1 1/4" at the bottom, and 1 3/4" at the top. They fit Athens Mini Fillo cups perfectly.

Oh, just a thought, but straight sides (not fluted) WILL get bent up with use unless you are REAL careful, /img/vbsmilies/smilies/laser.gifdon't ask how I know


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

aren't those pans a pain for tarts cause of the edging off the dough? it may or may not have nice smooth finish and the possibility touching the tart next to it and have to redo it again?

I have a few wilton mini muffin pans


----------



## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Not in the 10 years that I've used them.


Mulak said:


> aren't those pans a pain for tarts cause of the edging off the dough? it may or may not have nice smooth finish and the possibility touching the tart next to it and have to redo it again?
> 
> I have a few wilton mini muffin pans


Of course, I'm careful with the dough and I use a second pan to press the dough into place, then trim the tops.


----------



## mulak (Jan 2, 2006)

foodpump

I may have to bite the bullet and consider the matfer products ... but man they are pricey like what you said... approximately like 3-4 times but I will see if the metal store can do it for cheaper

there are two options of tartlet molds

Plain tartlet mold: Diameter 1 3/4", height 3/8", pack of 25 
http://www.culinarycookware.com/plain-tartlet-mold.html

or....

Deep plain tartlet: Diameter 1 3/4", height 5/8", pack of 25

http://www.culinarycookware.com/deep-plain-tartlet.html

foodpump... I saw your profile and you are a owner of a pastry shop/bakery in vancouver, what is the name of your place?


----------



## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

The forms with the sloped walls are made by either two methods, the first is stamping, which requires dedicated male and female dies, and the second is done by spinning a disc of metal on a lathe,and pressing the spinning disc onto a form behind the disc.  This is the method many bowls, pots and pans are made.  I doubt if any metal shop will have dedicated equipment for this.


----------



## mishka (Jul 12, 2012)

You can use tuna cans or other mini pate cans 

I have used Campbells for Brioche & they worked well


----------

