# Couple knife questions



## chrismit (Nov 18, 2012)

I recently received a chef choice trizor sharpener which sharpens to 15 deg. This was given to me for my Mac pro chef. I have other knives family members use

1. Can a victorinox fibrox 8in chef handle this angle?
2. How about a calphalon katana 5in santoku

Separate question, anybody have an opinion on the 12 in victorinox granton slicer


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## drewkal (Jan 14, 2013)

I've put a trizor edge on all my knives, probably 40+, have practically worn out the sharpener doing this.  The edges are fantastic, for everything related, I wouldn't shave with them daily.  The reason I've almost worn out the sharpener, Model 15, is that several of the knives were thick bladeded hunting/skinning knives, had to remove a lot of steel for those.  Read the directions (please!) and you'll be happy with what it does to your blades.  Unhappy users of the Model 15 have been those who havent read how to use it.  Older knives need more work.  My Globals, Sabattires, Forschners,  older Gerbers, Rapalas  (their fillet knives, especially the 3 1/2" and 6" are great kitchen tools) are all happy happy with their new edges.   My only warning is to be careful of the sharpness.  I never cut myself while cooking, as Im focused, but have cut myself a few times cleaning the knives. and my 17 yr old son cut right thru his thumb nall on a Global chef's knife that was just in the Kapposh knife block, blade forward ! All knives in that block are now facing blades away!


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

The cheaper knives can handle the 15deg edge.  Following on the first reply, you should consider a coarse/fine combination india stone to thin your edges as they wear.

Rick


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

The Forschner can handle 15*.  Expect to steel the knife a little more often than you do with the factory 20* set, but not a helluva lot more. 

I don't know about the Katana for sure.  The factory set is 22.5*, and since the edge isn't particularly stable at those angles, I suspect you'll end up spending a lot of time steeling a 15* edge.  But, you'll never know until you try. 

BDL


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

boar_d_laze said:


> The Forschner can handle 15*. Expect to steel the knife a little more often than you do with the factory 20* set, but not a helluva lot more.
> 
> I don't know about the Katana for sure. The factory set is 22.5*, and since the edge isn't particularly stable at those angles, I suspect you'll end up spending a lot of time steeling a 15* edge. But, you'll never know until you try.
> 
> BDL


Opps maybe on my part, the site I went to for the Katana showed a fau damascus described as vg10 cored though, dah, if it is in fact anything like my vg10 Shun, then the edge possibly could be very rather unstable.

Rick


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## boar_d_laze (Feb 13, 2008)

Whoever told you that Katanas are made with VG-10 told you wrong. The Katana alloy IS NOT VG-10, The Katana alloy IS VG-1.

Heat treating is always something of an issue in terms of any number of alloy properties, but -- since we're not comparing different VG-10 knives, the differences between various VG-10 treatments is not at issue.

_*Regarding Heat Treatment, Hardness, and Edge Angles*_

*Calphalon Katana: *

Calphalon publishes a Rockwell C hardness of 59-60 for their Katana series, but the knives don't behave as if they're that hard. Edges are extremely wearing, and prone to impact burring which seems to indicate something tougher and softer. Note that the Rockwell hardness test is almost impossible to perform accurately, and that Rockwell numbers provided by knife manufacturers are notoriously optimistic.

Takefu, the steel manufacturer, lists the optimal tempering hardness range for VG-1 as 58 and above. To the extent that Rockwell hardness numbers mean very much (they usually don't), and to the extent that anyone's guess is particularly valid (they almost never are), I'd say 58 is putting a pretty rosy picture on those knives.

For what it's worth, there are a number of things besides heat treatment and hardness which go to how acute a bevel a knife will hold well. Your Victorinox knife is nominally hardened to 57RCH, but will hold a 15* edge angle much better than your Katana.

It's easy enough to find out by trying. And the good news is that even if a 15* edge angle proves too steep for the Katana you don't have to resharpen the knife completely. You can build a very strong edge by just slapping a micro-bevel on top using whatever it was used to sharpen the Katana before you got the "Asian angle" CC.

*Shun:*

The VG-10 _hagane_ in Shun Classics (and other VG-10 san mai knives) is nominally hardened to around 61 RCH; and it acts like it. Shun's VG-10 acts considerably stronger than tough. So the heat-treatment/hardness issues are not collapse, but edges which wear quickly, can be chip prone, and require some babying. The Kai factory (Kai makes Shun) Shun factory set is a flat 16* on both sides. That's Kai's way of saying that it's really 15* like most other Japanese made knives but they want you to either buy one of their gags or send the knives back to them for sharpening. No Shun VG-10 Classic should have any problem with a 15* edge angle. If your edges are unstable at 15*, the problem is something else.

BDL


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