# Paco Jet Frustrations!



## nolachef

Let me start by saying hi. This is my first post....What a great site! 

I have found Paco Jet is great for making fresh fruit sorbets but ice creams are grainy and extremely inconsistent in texture.
Anybody have comments or suggestions?


----------



## montelago

I have not used one, but just by looking at the product specifications I have a few ideas for why you are getting these results. The ice cream recipes include a good deal of water in them. When the machine shaves the product, you are getting chunks of ice crystals in the product, making it grainy. The churning process for ice cream prevents the crystallization and keeps it all smooth. Also, depending on what fruit you have in the ice cream, it is also shaving the ice crystals present in the fruit, which then get mixed in to the ice cream. It seems like this machine would work great for sorbets and fruit ices, but maybe it is just not the best at ice cream. Just food for thought.


----------



## rat

I have to disagree with Montelago, graininess is caused by either the mixture being too rich (to much fat), incorrect preparation of your base (not homogenized, or incorrect cooking temperatures), the base being either too cold or too warm. I have found that cooling the base overnight before filling the beaker and freezing is better, it is even better to be sure your base is nicely emulsified and not separating. If the beaker is too warm the base will break like over whipped cream, If it is too cold it will take longer to process the beaker resulting in over churning.
Sorry for the brief note, hope this helps


----------



## brooklynchef

I used to work at a restaurant that used the in-house paco jet to make Creamed Spinach. Make a standard cream spinach with a very nutmeg rich bechamel. Freeze it in the paco jet liners and spin it in the jet. It makes the most velvety smooth outrageously refined creamed spinach.


----------



## guilty

mh, at my last job we only used the pacojet for makeing icecream - one big problem is that the icecream/sorbet/whatever must have minimum -18° celsius before u put it into the paco - if you don't have that temperature the consistence is like frozen soup 
if that doesn't work youse 2 sheets of gelatin (1g per sheet) and 100g glucose for every litre of icecream-mass - the glucose keeps it smooth, the gelatin is for the consistence (this is my basic recipte for every sorbet....)

what's your receipt for your sorbets - write it and maybe we'll find your problem out :chef:



if you need some recepts write me by icq (168837403) or tell me in that thread - i have many nice ones for the pacojet 

greetings from germany and again sorry for my bad english


----------



## nolachef

I am not having problems with the sorbet actually I love the sorbet from the paco jet. The ice cream on the other hand is my problem. If you have a basic vanilla ice cream recipe that works well in the jet I would appreciate it.
Thanks 
Nolachef

p.s. 
Don't apologize for your english....Its much better than my german!


----------



## guilty

ok, there's a basic recipe:



1 litre milk
1/2 litre cream
360g eggyolk
220g sugar



and for vanilla-ice cream:

3 up to 5 vanilla beans (scratched out)


that recipe should work proper, i often had the problem that it was to hard after 2 hours... 

you know what to do with the ingrediens or do you need a recipe-description?


----------



## nolachef

Thanks alot I will give a try. I don't need methods just one question. Whats a g? Just kidding. I'll let you know how it comes out.
Nolafoody


----------



## guilty

you're welcome ... ^^

if you need any other recips just write me... :chef:


----------



## vinmachine

try making your ice cream with just milk that should solve the grainyness
and substitute liquid glucose for atomized glucose:chef:


----------



## danychef

Hi to everyone!!

do u have a good recipe for an untoasted almond icecream?!?

thanks a lot...


----------



## cpc chef

Ok so i have a paco jet and like everyone else the sorbet is awesome and i use a sorbet stabilizer and it holds up perfect and i have no issues. But my ice cream base is hit or miss. We use liquid glucose, milk powder , heavy cream, ice cream stabilizer, and then your puree as the liquid, the issue we keep running into is the ice cream does not freeze all the way. i like using the ice cream stabilizer so it holds its form for plating, is that what is causing it to not set all the way up.


----------



## dan3040

Does anyone have a Pacojet vanilla ice cream recipe that doesn't use eggs?
Many thanks

Dan


----------



## dommes14

Recipe:

Cook 1 liter Milk (3,5%) with 200gr Sugar and 5 Gous de Vanille

+ 12 Feuille Gelatine

+ montée 2 liter Cream liquid

Ready for the pacojet-bacs!!!

You can also cook a lait d´amande caramelisée, lait au fevé de tonga, caffee au lait,....


----------



## nor cal chef

I just got my paco jet and the ice cream I am starting to make is not ready for a couple hours. What am I doing wrong? Its to soft! But it I lower the temp it turns to shaved ice.


----------



## jellly

Nor Cal Chef - You aren't doing anything wrong, that is the nature of the Paco Jet.  I always spin my bases a few hours before service starts, then they are the perfect texture.  If I am ever in a pinch where I have to spin and use it right away, I spread the base out in a 1-inch layer and freeze for 10 minutes to firm it up a bit before quenelling.


----------



## hozz

I can't give out the exact recipe, but look into locust bean gum for thickening your ice cream base. Just mix it in with your egg yolks and sugar before combining with the milk/cream. You won't get the jelly-like consistency of gelatine, instead you can turn an otherwise runny ice cream into creamy heaven.


----------



## Guest

HI Guilty- I've been using the Pacojet working in restaurants with great results.... but with my chef's recipes.  I now work as a private chef and the family I'm with recently bought a paco.  I was very excited to start experimenting with it, but am finding my own traditional recipes are hit and miss- too much air in my chocolate ice cream (feels like soft-serve), yogourt sorbet is too wet.... only my vanilla is working right.

I would love any ice cream recipes for paco you would like to share.

Specifically:

My employers would like me to make  pralines and cream ice cream, as well as stracciatella.  Not sure how either of these would be made with paco- do you happen to have a good recipe for this type ice cream?   

Thank you!


----------



## george sotirov

Hey guys if this will help you the problem with the paco jet withe the ice-creams is that the paco jet is braking it thats why you have problem with the texture. In the sorbet you use stabilizer or gelatin and the paco is baking it after it gets frozen. With the ice-creams with the recipies that you have you need an ice machine. The process there is quite different because the machine it cool it down slowly by slowly until it get smooth ice-cream. all the recipies that you have can be used either in paco either in ice machine you just need to change the amount of the sugar. For paco jet you need stabilizer and less sugar and for the ice machine reciepe you need more sugar and pure recipe from cream milk and angle + the aroma that you like  I hope that this will help. If someone need recipies i have few good ones for paco and for ice machine


----------



## lastcourse

The graininess of your ice cream is always too much sugar, I make ice creams and sorbets every other day with our pacojet and I too encountered this problem when I first dabbled in confections.  Monkey around with the sugar ratio, use stabilizers like trimoline, glucose powder, and what not.  For ice cream however I never need a stabilizer. My old chef told me a trick to use when adjusting sugar into your base. To check it before you freeze the beaker for 24 hours while it is still liquid float an egg in the mixture. If the sugar content is spot on you should only see enough of the top to equal the size of a nickel. I tested it once with a sorbet, seemed to check out. He was always right about everything else.


----------



## denty191

anyone have a recipe for a dairy & sugar free ice cream made in a pacojet?

I can still use honey and soya stop make it, if anyone has good qualities that would be a massive help!

Thanks in advance


----------



## someday

Denty191 said:


> dairy & sugar free ice cream


??????


----------



## Iceman

I read through this thread and I think I'm gonna puke.


----------



## someday

IceMan said:


> I read through this thread and I think I'm gonna puke.


Too far over your head it made you dizzy? I understand.../img/vbsmilies/smilies/tongue.gif


----------



## Iceman

The only thing over my head in this instance is hair. Making ice-cream is a very simple job. You don't need any voo-doo ingredients. If regular ice-cream is at all intolerable to you, for whatever reason you may have ... _HAVE SOMETHING ELSE_ for your dessert.


----------



## missdonna

Thank you chefs, for this thread on the Paco Jet. 

We have been dreaming of owning a Paco Jet and would love your opinion.

We have a Musso Polo 5030 Lello and LOVE it !

We are not professional chefs. We just cook at home.

The Paco Jet is SO expensive...but my boyfriend is turning 60 and

I'm searching for a gently used one!!

My question is this: IF one likes ice cream better than sorbet, is the Paco Jet worth it?

It seems not everyone on this thread feels it is as fantastic as we thought.

Currently, my boyfriend creates a sugar syrup, pure cream and guar gum and his ice creams

are very, very smooth in the Musso. 

We DID try the ice cream at Acadia in Chicago a few years ago and got to visit the kitchen and saw the paco jet.

The ice cream was delicious...but my question is...

Was it the recipe or the machine?

My boyfriend made a blueberry ginger ice cream the other day that was perfection. He cooked the fruit and ginger and used fresh lemon to act as pectin. Cooked for several hours, then finely strained it and it was very thick. Then he added sugar and cooked only long enough to dissolve.

He used powdered egg yolks and guar gum to heavy cream and warmed it. 

Cooled the fruit and cooled the cream base and letter combined them cold into the Musso. 

It was so smooth, I could not imagine the paco getting it smoother.

Do you think this man NEEDS a Paco jet if he really prefers ICE CREAM instead of Sorbet? 

I think for $5,000 he should study with a chef instead of buying this paco device!

For an ice cream enthusiast, what is the next best step in his home career? lol


----------



## mark westerweel

No, most certainly not.

I know a lot who don't prefer the paco, and go old school with a sorbetière.

I'd say, let the man know how to use nitrogen.


----------



## ljokjel

First of all, lets go through a couple of basic things. The Paco Jet is a tool. You have to learn to use it, just like a churner or a hammer. If you learn to use it properly, you will always have "freshly" made ice cream, and crystallization wont be a problem.

Then it comes to the "science" of ice cream / sorbet and the recipes. You want it to have the right consistency at any given temperature. Then you need to find out your need. Do you need it to be good to go straight from the machine, or do you want it at the right consistency for several hours after? As a private chef you would want it ready there and then. In a restaurant you want stability for hours. 

And when it comes to ice cream and stabilizers, why wont you just use good old fashioned egg yolks. They serve the same purpose as in the old ice cream machines. They stabilize. Banana is actually a great stabilizer as well.

Then learn the effect of the base ingredients. Fat, sugar (sucrose, lactose, glucose etc) and water. The more sugar you add, the softer it gets. Sugar lowers the freezing temperature of your base, just like alcohol would do. The more water you have, the more "shaven" it will be, and harder it will be. What happens if you use milk instead of cream for your ice cream recipe, and by doing so loose a lot of fat, but add a lot of water? Play around and see with your own eyes what happens if you go from 5 to 7 percent sugar in your recipe.


----------

