# Does anyone have any experience with "Konosuke" or "Richmond" "lasers?"



## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Hello all,

I was speaking with someone who says they have a lot of experience as a sushi knife, and they recommended "Konosuke" which they apparently have 2 knives from that are their go to knives (Suji and I Deba I think).

I found what is called "Lasers" http://www.chefknivestogo.com/konosukelasers.html and it seems to be an extremely thin, and light blade.

There are a ton of great reviews on a bunch of these knives, so I am interested if anyone has any recommendations on them?

I am basically looking for a good sushi knife for a gift, but the person is a beginner to knives, but not cooking.

I was thinking probably a 270mm Sujiki Konosuke Laser, but I would like more opinions?

I was given a lot of choices of companies, Suisin, Tojiro, Misano, Togijaru, etc, but he's the first person who mentioned konosuke, and this was the first time I've heard of "chefknivestogo," but someone else I think mentioned it right above his post.

I also have been checking out the house brand of "ChefKnivesToGo" called "Richmond" and they are lasers, and also AEB-L steel which seems to be a very good favorite for a lot of people.

So I'm curious if anyone would recommend these knives, and if they have any preference, as there are a few types of steel I can choose from,....?

Thanks so much for any advice!


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

I have a 210mm gyuto. They are too short for me. No knuckle clearance. I use it as a long petty.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

short from top to bottom, or from tip to toe?

I've heard they are smaller from tip to toe, butg Idk about height wise.

How light was yours?  Did you lke it's lightness?  What about it's thinenss?

I'm looking at probably a 270mm suji,


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

MillionsKnives said:


> I have a 210mm gyuto. They are too short for me. No knuckle clearance. I use it as a long petty.


I can certainly see 210mm being too short from heel to tip as a gyuto, *especially* on knives that run short like Konosuke. But assuming you mean too narrow from spine to edge, maybe you've gotta work on your pinch grip. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/wink.gif I hear a soft pinch grip even works for those crazy BBQ guys...

I keep my knife hand off the counter so I don't have to worry about knuckle clearance, but I'm pretty sure the Konosuke gyuto is wide enough that my knuckles clear the edge.

Footnote: By "single-bevel" I mean a chisel-ground knife as opposed to one with a Western-style V-shaped edge. Google if you're not familiar with the difference. "Single bevel" and "double bevel" can also have the completely separate meaning of whether or not you've added a secondary bevel/compound bevel to a knife, and this will almost certainly be in the context of Western-style V-shaped (i.e. "double beveled") knives. Try not to get tripped up if you come across the single vs double terminology in a thread or article that's actually talking about this latter topic.


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

Mine was only 40mm tall. With a pinch grip this is still short. Anyway, for a suji, you don't need height. For a gyuto I want more than that. It's basically exactly what I expected, real thin, real light, great fit and finish.


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

For Maki I also feel the gyuto is a better choice. It stands to reason that the cross-section of the blade that actually comes in contact with the roll is going to be thinner where the gyuto is concerned.. With the suji you are going to be burying the [relatively] thick spine into the roll.

As for the Konosuke stainless vs semi-stainless, I would have to think that the semi-stainless can take a keener edge. It is closer to pure carbon after all.

Devin Thomas is a certified Master Bladesmith who is coveted for his work with AEB-L, and 52100 steel as well. According to him AEB-L does have better edge stability than the carbon steels, meaning it will hold an extremely acute angle better. So there is possibly a "perceived" sharpness advantage there.

Rick


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Thanks for the tips. The user is new to high end knives, but I wanted to get something that would be good to start with, I also am looking for a knife for myself now, so we would have to learn together, since we live together.

I'm not sure if I'm going to get him a Gyuto or a Sujihiki. I was speaking with someone, on another forum, who said he's been a sushi chef for over a decade, and claimed only "beginners" cut rolls with Gyuto, and that you should use a sujihiki. He has a Konosuke Gyuto/Suji, and a Yoshihiro Yanagi.

It seems a Gyuto would be better, and since he's a beginner anyways it should be okay... Plus if it's a laser, the Gyuto should work well, but I do like the look of the Sujihiki. I think I'm going to get myself a Gyuto though....

I want to learn how to sharpen and all that stuff, but I have no clue what stones to get. Someone recommended Naniwa, but they seem pricey, and might require more of an expertise, so I'm not sure if there are "beginner stones," as well.

I wont get an electric sharpener, and if you want to know the reason please see the thread about them which I think is in this sub-forum, people say they are not worth it at all.

I don't know if the person will invest time learning about sharpening, but I do. I think it's important to know how to treat the knives well, and I think it would be nice to have an awesome blade to use. I just want to make sure it will cut through things, and that he could use it for other things, besides sushi.

He is an avid orange/grapefruit eater, so it would be nice for the knife to be able to cut that. I did however seee someone slice through a pineapple, but who knows how much sharpening he did, and how dull it made the knife.

How often are we looking to Sharpen it? I was watching someone use a "Richmond" laser and he was scared his edge dulled after about 10 mins of video, if that. It seemed the knife was still going, but he was using a wood cutting board...

That being said what kind of cutting board should I use? It seems we shouldn't let the blade hit it at all, but It seems people do from the videos I see.

The thing is CKTG is all sold out basically of the knives, so I don't know when they will come back in... It seems they are only stocking certain items like Honyaki blades.


Rick Alan said:


> For Maki I also feel the gyuto is a better choice. It stands to reason that the cross-section of the blade that actually comes in contact with the roll is going to be thinner where the gyuto is concerned.. With the suji you are going to be burying the [relatively] thick spine into the roll.
> 
> As for the Konosuke stainless vs semi-stainless, I would have to think that the semi-stainless can take a keener edge. It is closer to pure carbon after all.
> 
> ...


 I was speaking with someone, on another forum, who said he's been a sushi chef for over a decade, and claimed only "beginners" cut rolls with Gyuto, and that you should use a sujihiki. I personally like the suji better, b ut I feel the Gyuto would work out better overall in the kitchen, and not just "for sushi."

AEB-L seems interesting, but the Konosuke's don't habve them... The "Richmond" blades do, however, and I'm interested in the "Richmond Lasers." Someone mentioned that Mark Richmond is the owner of CKTG, so that might be something to look at. In the one video I saw of the Richmond he was using a laser Gyuto for about 10 mins and was concerned with the edge being dull, granted it seemed to cut through the green pepper no problem, and he commented on that as well. I don;'t know how long the edge lasts on these knives, but he also hit the cutting board a lot which a lot of people seem to say you shouldn't sdo that... Not too sure if there are special boards to use as well.... He was saying the AEB-L steel is as good as "White #1" with edge retention, but I'm nto too sure what the differences between #1 and #2, and there was no mention of blue, which is interesting that the AEB-L would have such a great edge, while having good SS properties...

Thanks all.


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

I would say... you're overthinking it.  You have no experience using or sharpening any of these steels, so nuances will be lost on you.

Just pick stainless or carbon, and pick a maker with good reviews.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

MillionsKnives said:


> I would say... you're overthinking it. You have no experience using or sharpening any of these steels, so nuances will be lost on you.
> 
> Just pick stainless or carbon, and pick a maker with good reviews.


Possibly.... How do I gain experience without getting knives to test? Technically I should go with cheaper knives, but I rather not buy multiple knives, and just get great knives we can use for awhile.

I want to learn what I can, so I will check out youtube videos, and ask for advice.

We will see what steel I go with, the AEB-L seems interesting...

The point of this thread it to see if people like these companies or not, and then I wll see what to go with..

Sadly most of the Konosuke's are sold out, so I don't know when they will return.. .


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

For freehand sharpening, you'll want at least a coarse stone for occasional reprofiling, a medium-coarse stone for sharpening, and a medium-fine stone for polishing. One of the best affordable examples of the first is the Beston 500, two of the best affordable examples of the second are the Bester 1200 and the Arashiyama 1k, and two of the best affordable examples of the third are the Suehiro Rika (it's 3k-5k depending on mud buildup) and the Arashiyama 6k. CKtG sells a package deal of the Beston 500, the Bester 1200, and the Suehiro Rika. If you can afford even better stones, Japanese Knife Imports sells a package of the Gesshin 400, Gesshin 2k, and Gesshin 6k. Those stones are said to cut faster yet leave a higher polish than other stones at similar grit levels. They have an amazing reputation. If and when I switch from my Edge Pro to freehand, I'm almost certainly getting Gesshin stones.

I highly recommend taking that thread about the Chef's Choice with a grain of salt (or less). The negative opinions in that thread were not by people who use the Chef's Choice. If memory serves, they were a mix of people who were speaking from experience with other electric sharpeners eating too much metal and of anecdotes someone heard about someone who used the Chef's Choice improperly and damaged the knife (I think it was the tip). I've heard or read from a number of people who have actually used the Chef's Choice (one who comes to mind is the former CT contributor BDL), and my understanding is that as long as you read the instructions, you are not at any greater risk of damaging your knife than with stones, and the speed at which it eats metal is at the order of magnitude of stones, not of metal-eating electric sharpeners. The Chef's Choice is the one good electric sharpener, and is a virtual necessity if the gift's recipient isn't going to be sharpening knives by some more manual means [1]. That said, the Chef's Choice does have downsides, just not those. The downsides are that it restricts you to one or two preset bevel angles and gets your edge pretty sharp rather than extremely sharp, so it's probably not worth it on premium knives that can take an extremely sharp edge. It's probably more worth it on less expensive high-end knives. That said, if this person doesn't have any means of sharpening and certainly none better than a Chef's Choice, then any premium knife is going to be a waste of a gift unless you also give a sharpening kit. Sharpening is far more important than the knife. Decent sharpening (even a Chef's Choice) plus a $5 Tramontina knife is literally a gift that's orders of magnitude better than no sharpening plus a Konosuke, at least after the first couple weeks go by.

If you're dead-set on getting him a high-end knife and not a Chef's Choice (which, again, does seem reasonable for something as high-end as a Konosuke), then you really have to find out if he's willing to learn to sharpen. If not freehand, then you'll really need either to get him a rod-guided jig or get him to get one. The Wicked Edge is the easiest to learn but also really expensive. The Edge Pro has a learning curve but much less than stones. If he won't be getting either of these or some other way to sharpen, then a high-end knife is useless. All dull knives are equal, and dull lightweight knives are even less equal.

[1] The only other real option is *if* he lives near someone who happens to be a skilled knife sharpener, then he could send his knives out whenever they start to dull. But that means he won't be keeping his knives sharp unless he intends to pay around $15-$20 a week per knife, which defeats the purpose of a high end knife, *and* he won't be able to use the knives while they're in the shop. Additionally, it might be difficult to even find a real sharpener. Most "professionals" at best run your knife through a Chef's Choice and more likely through something that eats a ton of metal and leaves an obtuse edge with a coarse scratch pattern.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Gladius said:


> For freehand sharpening, you'll want at least a coarse stone for occasional reprofiling, a medium-coarse stone for sharpening, and a medium-fine stone for polishing. One of the best affordable examples of the first is the Beston 500, two of the best affordable examples of the second are the Bester 1200 and the Arashiyama 1k, and two of the best affordable examples of the third are the Suehiro Rika (it's 3k-5k depending on mud buildup) and the Arashiyama 6k. CKtG sells a package deal of the Beston 500, the Bester 1200, and the Suehiro Rika. If you can afford even better stones, Japanese Knife Imports sells a package of the Gesshin 400, Gesshin 2k, and Gesshin 6k. Those stones are said to cut faster yet leave a higher polish than other stones at similar grit levels. They have an amazing reputation. If and when I switch from my Edge Pro to freehand, I'm almost certainly getting Gesshin stones.
> 
> I highly recommend taking that thread about the Chef's Choice with a grain of salt (or less). The negative opinions in that thread were not by people who use the Chef's Choice. If memory serves, they were a mix of people who were speaking from experience with other electric sharpeners eating too much metal and of anecdotes someone heard about someone who used the Chef's Choice improperly and damaged the knife (I think it was the tip). I've heard or read from a number of people who have actually used the Chef's Choice (one who comes to mind is the former CT contributor BDL), and my understanding is that as long as you read the instructions, you are not at any greater risk of damaging your knife than with stones, and the speed at which it eats metal is at the order of magnitude of stones, not of metal-eating electric sharpeners. The Chef's Choice is the one good electric sharpener, and is a virtual necessity if the gift's recipient isn't going to be sharpening knives by some more manual means [1]. That said, the Chef's Choice does have downsides, just not those. The downsides are that it restricts you to one or two preset bevel angles and gets your edge pretty sharp rather than extremely sharp, so it's probably not worth it on premium knives that can take an extremely sharp edge. It's probably more worth it on less expensive high-end knives. That said, if this person doesn't have any means of sharpening and certainly none better than a Chef's Choice, then any premium knife is going to be a waste of a gift unless you also give a sharpening kit. Sharpening is far more important than the knife. Decent sharpening (even a Chef's Choice) plus a $5 Tramontina knife is literally a gift that's orders of magnitude better than no sharpening plus a Konosuke, at least after the first couple weeks go by.
> 
> ...


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

No problem! Keep in mind that I don't freehand myself, so my stone suggestions are just based on what I've heard from people whose knife knowledge I value. I personally sharpen on an Edge Pro using Shapton glass stones for most work, with an Atoma 140 and Nubatama 150 for coarse work. I do want to switch to freehand at some point, and I'm not at all trying to steer you away from it. I was trying to steer your father away from it *if* he doesn't express interest in spending the time to learn since his knives will be dull if he doesn't end up putting in that time!

The Edge Pro is great for a full reprofiling+sharpening+polishing progression since it lets you set an exact angle. I find it a pain for regular sharpening and quick touch-ups, though, because you can't just click in the angle by feel as you can with freehanding. You've got to configure the machine to the approximate angle that the bevel is currently at, and then check your results to see if you're hitting the right angle. If I were to freehand and keep my set of stones permasoaked, I could literally pop a stone out of the water and touch up a knife in a minute or two whenever it started to lose its polish. I suspect that that convenience would make the sharpening process feel less like work and more like fun, resulting in me doing it more frequently. If I were to do it over again knowing what I know now, would I have started with stones? Probably. But it does sound like there's more of a learning curve both in holding your hands at a consistent angle and in getting the pressure right. It sounds like you have enough interest in learning to freehand that you wouldn't mind that learning curve. If I'm right about that, then yes, you should probably just start with stones. You'll want to start practicing with a medium-coarse stone (e.g. Gesshin 2k, Bester 1200, or Arashiyama 1k) until you get the technique down. Then you'll want to try your hand at a finer grit (e.g. Gesshin 6k, Arashiyama 6k, or Suehiro Rika) at which point any errors in technique should become obvious. Polishing is much less forgiving than coarser sharpening. Once your technique is good enough for polishing, then you can move on to coarse work like reprofiling or repairing a chipped edge. Coarse stones remove a lot of metal, so you don't want to use them until you know that your sharpening technique works!

Regarding the Chef's Choice, yes, it's said to not eat your knives like other electric or pull through sharpeners. No clue about the temper issue.

Naniwa makes different lines of stones. Their Chosera stones, for instance, are supposed to be very good (at least at most grits) but very expensive. At that price point, though, I've heard you're probably better off getting Gesshin stones.

Choseras are normally referred to just as "Chosera" without the "Naniwa" part, so I suspect you were reading about their Super Stone line. I don't know much about them, but I vaguely recall hearing that they gouge easily and aren't the best value at their price point. From other people's recommendations, I'd definitely recommend going with either the Gesshin set or the less expensive Beston + Bester or Arashiyama + Arashiyama or Suehiro Rika triplet, depending on how much you want to spend. Regarding buying from one vs multiple sites, do you happen to be in the continental US? If so, I believe both CKtG and JKI have free shipping on orders over a certain amount, and that certain amount should be less than the cost of a stone set or knife.

Edit: You also asked about whether better quality stones are worth it for a newbie. That depends on the stones and the newbie. If they're unforgiving stones like a good diamond set, then you absolutely don't want to use them. Some stones are more forgiving despite cutting pretty quickly. Jon Broida told me his Gesshins definitely fall into that category. I assume they're no more likely to damage your knives as you learn than a cheaper set, and again, you should start with the medium-coarse stone when you're first learning so that any damage from user error will be minimal and not a problem. And as long as you pay attention and follow good video tutorials, I don't expect you to damage your stones while learning. Do read and watch as much as you can before you start. Whether it's worth getting great stones over good stones when you don't have experience with the latter to appreciate the contrast, well, that's up to you! Is it worth getting a great knife over an entry-level J knife when you won't be able to appreciate the contrast? Is it worth buying a beautiful home before living in a fairly pretty home? etc.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Gladius said:


> No problem! Keep in mind that I don't freehand myself, so my stone suggestions are just based on what I've heard from people whose knife knowledge I value. I personally sharpen on an Edge Pro using Shapton glass stones for most work, with an Atoma 140 and Nubatama 150 for coarse work. I do want to switch to freehand at some point, and I'm not at all trying to steer you away from it. I was trying to steer your father away from it *if* he doesn't express interest in spending the time to learn since his knives will be dull if he doesn't end up putting in that time!
> 
> The Edge Pro is great for a full reprofiling+sharpening+polishing progression since it lets you set an exact angle. I find it a pain for regular sharpening and quick touch-ups, though, because you can't just click in the angle by feel as you can with freehanding. You've got to configure the machine to the approximate angle that the bevel is currently at, and then check your results to see if you're hitting the right angle. If I were to freehand and keep my set of stones permasoaked, I could literally pop a stone out of the water and touch up a knife in a minute or two whenever it started to lose its polish. I suspect that that convenience would make the sharpening process feel less like work and more like fun, resulting in me doing it more frequently. If I were to do it over again knowing what I know now, would I have started with stones? Probably. But it does sound like there's more of a learning curve both in holding your hands at a consistent angle and in getting the pressure right. It sounds like you have enough interest in learning to freehand that you wouldn't mind that learning curve. If I'm right about that, then yes, you should probably just start with stones. You'll want to start practicing with a medium-coarse stone (e.g. Gesshin 2k, Bester 1200, or Arashiyama 1k) until you get the technique down. Then you'll want to try your hand at a finer grit (e.g. Gesshin 6k, Arashiyama 6k, or Suehiro Rika) at which point any errors in technique should become obvious. Polishing is much less forgiving than coarser sharpening. Once your technique is good enough for polishing, then you can move on to coarse work like reprofiling or repairing a chipped edge. Coarse stones remove a lot of metal, so you don't want to use them until you know that your sharpening technique works!
> 
> ...


From what it sounds like is that other methods are either a PITA and get it good, or that it's easy, but doesn't get it to "perfect."

I think it would be better to just get into it, but I can see it being a PITA at first, but I think it will be better overall to learn technique.

I don't know if dad will like to sharpen on a stone, but now that I am thinking about getting into it myself, I think I might go with stones, but I can see him possibly getting annoyed by it. He would probably like the Chef's Choice better because it's "easier" but who knows.... I feel the stones would also feel "like work" but maybe not? Maybe it will be fun as you describe it . Knowing how to do it well can be enjoyable. I'll have to learn about soaking the stones though, what's that about?

So medium "coarse" is what i want? Your above post mentioned "coarse" for "sharpening" and "fine" for "polishing...?" Here you mentioned coarse and polishing, so I was curious about that.

How do you know what you've done is "correct" or "right?" Just the way it cuts or looks?

Not too sure about the Chef's Choice, I would check out the posts on the last page of that thread, because it was interesting info, but I cannot verify it's validity.

Most of the stones seem to be pretty pricey (around 50$), but I see the "chosera" stones are being more expensive and labeled "professional."

Someone just mentioned that they have tried a few brands of stones, and that the naniwa ones were superior.

His comment was 


> _I also have some japanese whetstones - a 1k and 6k King, and 400 grit and 2K Naniwa Super stones. The Naniwa are much higher quality in feel and performance. _
> _I like sharpening in 3 steps. Where you start really depends upon how bad the edge is, how much you like the current profile, and how long you want to spend at it. You usually roughly double the grit as you move up. The coarse grit is to profile the edge and set the burr, the medium helps refine the edge, and the fine is to further refine and polish up the edge. But that's a whole 'nother thread. _


What do you mean by "gouge easy?"

Also yes, I do live in the USA, so I guess the shipping isn't an issue then...

I didn't want to spend that much on a stone honestly, but it seems I'm left with not many choices hahah..... Some stomnes are really cheap, others are expensive.

Hmm, yeah I guess I'll have to make another thread or something and get more opinions to see what people think like, but the gesshin stones sound good. What have you heard about them specifically, compared to others, that makes you want to get them?

I'm just making sure that whatever I get works out well overall, and I definitely don't want anything crappy. I know a lot of people recommended cheap knives, the last post on another forum said I should be buying a bunch of 50$ knives and trying them out to get "my feel for a knife..."

I feel I rather spend a good amount on a good knife, and get some good stones and just learn my way through it then to get a crap knife, a crap set of stones and it just not working well. I feel the appreciation for the good knife, and not wanting to ruin it will help with the learning process.

I'm thinking about the Richmond laser, since Konosuke is OOS, we shall see how that works out!

Thank you for your time, I really appreciate it.

EDIT: I just looked up the Gesshin stones and they are expensive....

http://www.japaneseknifeimports.com/sharpening-supplies.html


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

LasagnaBurrito said:


> So medium "coarse" is what i want? Your above post mentioned "coarse" for "sharpening" and "fine" for "polishing...?" Here you mentioned coarse and polishing, so I was curious about that.





LasagnaBurrito said:


> How do you know what you've done is "correct" or "right?" Just the way it cuts or looks?





LasagnaBurrito said:


> Someone just mentioned that they have tried a few brands of stones, and that the naniwa ones were superior.





LasagnaBurrito said:


> What do you mean by "gouge easy?"


What do the people who've reported that mean?  I assume they mean to cut a hole in the stone.

Sharpening is even more important than the knife. If you're willing to pay ~$300 for a Konosuke HD over, say, $185 for a similarly-great-but-not-quite-as-great Mac Professional, then you probably should be even more willing to spend a lot for stones that give good feedback and cut quickly.  Going with a less expensive knife will also give you more cash for the stones! If you do want a laser and would still purchase the Konosuke if it were in stock, then you should check out the Gesshin Ginga. The quality of its heat treatment, grind, and F&F should be at least as good as the Konosuke. Many would choose it over the Konosuke. If you want a laser and don't want to spend that amount of money to ensure quality, I'd probably go with the Richmond Laser in AEB-L. I think I've heard the grind is better and more consistent than most other Richmonds, although their reputation for not polishing out grind marks on the side of the blade might still apply to the Laser, which you may or may not find aesthetically displeasing. Otherwise, it looks like a beautiful knife. Beautiful profile, beautiful handle options, etc. Do be sure to get it in 270mm though since they appear to run even shorter than Konosukes. A "240" (really 230mm according to CKtG) will require more lifting between cuts, and the knives are almost as light as Konosukes, so the extra length on the "270" (262mm) shouldn't take long at all to get used to.

Yes, Gesshin stones are expensive!


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Gladius said:


> What do the people who've reported that mean?  I assume they mean to cut a hole in the stone.
> 
> Sharpening is even more important than the knife. If you're willing to pay ~$300 for a Konosuke HD over, say, $185 for a similarly-great-but-not-quite-as-great Mac Professional, then you probably should be even more willing to spend a lot for stones that give good feedback and cut quickly.  Going with a less expensive knife will also give you more cash for the stones! If you do want a laser and would still purchase the Konosuke if it were in stock, then you should check out the Gesshin Ginga. The quality of its heat treatment, grind, and F&F should be at least as good as the Konosuke. Many would choose it over the Konosuke. If you want a laser and don't want to spend that amount of money to ensure quality, I'd probably go with the Richmond Laser in AEB-L. I think I've heard the grind is better and more consistent than most other Richmonds, although their reputation for not polishing out grind marks on the side of the blade might still apply to the Laser, which you may or may not find aesthetically displeasing. Otherwise, it looks like a beautiful knife. Beautiful profile, beautiful handle options, etc. Do be sure to get it in 270mm though since they appear to run even shorter than Konosukes. A "240" (really 230mm according to CKtG) will require more lifting between cuts, and the knives are almost as light as Konosukes, so the extra length on the "270" (262mm) shouldn't take long at all to get used to.
> 
> Yes, Gesshin stones are expensive!


Thanks it seems I have a lot of work to do for research. I think it's best I BUY THE KNIFE first, give it to him as a gift, and then talk to him about what choices we have, and then figure out together what's best for us.

I'm looking at this knife now http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kogi24gy.html

Seems very thin, and a good steel. Really the only Konosuke in stock, he just got 10 of them a few weeks ago.

Another guy I was speaking with was interested in it and might get one himself.

The a few posts

Someone mentioned I might get a "beefier" blade, which he recommended.



> Ok, here are a couple recommendations for your dad. I think you're right to get him a gyuto as a first, general purpose knife. There are good stainless wa handled knives in your price range that would be a good gift. Modern stainless can get just as sharpe and hold and edge well so I usually recommend them for gifts.
> 
> This would be what I would like as a gift. It's a really nice knife and I'm shocked it's still in stock. http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kogi24gy.html
> 
> ...





> maiko Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2015 12:49 pm
> 
> I have both the first two knives recommended by Mark and would more highly recommend the Sukenari as a first J-knife as it is a bit beefier of a blade. The Konosuke is very thin behind the edge and seems like it requires a bit more finesse. I'd recommend the Ginsan steel too for anyone that likes carbon but wants stainless.





> SteveG Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2015 12:59 pm
> 
> Forum Moderator
> 
> +1 to the Sukenari Ginsan 240 Gyuto. It's a great knife with good performance. As maiko mentioned, it's got enough thickness at the edge as to be a bit more forgiving during use.


Thanks again for all the help


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

LasagnaBurrito said:


> Thanks again for all the help


No problem! Do note that that knife is made of san-mai construction where only the core is made from ginsan steel, and it's sandwiched between two other layers of steel. That keeps production cost down. The Konosuke HD and HH, as well as the Gesshin Ginga and the Richmond Laser in AEB-L, are all made of a single steel. I have no experience using san-mai knives, but do note that some forum-goers find cladding to mute the feedback of the knife against the board. That said, I've heard some Japanese chefs prefer san-mai, and I believe the majority of contributors here find them pretty equivalent.

If you've fully committed and set your heart on the Konosuke Ginsan, I won't attempt to dissuade you. It's probably an amazing knife. However, if your mind is still open to other options, I do wish to ask if you'd take the Konosuke HD2 over the Ginsan if it were in stock. If so, I highly recommend looking into the Gesshin Ginga, which should be at least equivalent to the Konosuke HD in almost every relevant way besides the alloy (choice of excellent carbon or excellent stainless--and I'd imagine but can't confirm that the stainless Gesshin Ginga will have at least slightly better edge-taking than the Konosuke Ginsan). I've heard the Gesshin Ginga's grind is impeccable.

Having not used the Ginsan, my current calculus is that the Ginga and HD are slightly better performers and the Ginsan a slightly better looker. Even if the Ginsan were at the same price point as the other two, I personally would prefer to buy one of the other two. That said, I'm not you. You said the Ginsan is a little thicker (and a little stiffer?) and you might find that that works better with your cutting technique. Are there more affordable options than the Ginsan for amazing knives that are slightly thicker than the Gesshin Ginga and Konosuke HD? If you're open to carbon, absolutely. The Masamoto HC comes to mind. In stainless I don't know. If you're worried about using a laser, I wonder if you'd be better off looking slightly to the other end of the spectrum and going with something slightly thicker and a decent amount heavier than the Ginsan like the Richmond Ultimatum in AEB-L or the Mac Professional MBK-110. I've heard great things about both, and you will have significantly more leeway with cutting harder food.

If you do think the Konosuke Ginsan is the right knife for you and/or your father, you might very well be right. I do just want to make sure you've thought this out, considered other options, and have specific reasons for your decision. I also do think you should strongly consider going with 270mm, and even more so for knives that run short like Konosuke. That "240mm" Ginsan is actually only 225mm, which is really half-way between a 210 and a 240. That's *very* short for a gyuto and will require both more handle lifting and more judicious use of its sweet spot. If your choice is between a 270mm Gesshin Ginga and a 240mm Konosuke Ginsan, I'd personally suggest the former in a heartbeat. All right, done talking for now!


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Gladius said:


> No problem! Do note that that knife is made of san-mai construction where only the core is made from ginsan steel, and it's sandwiched between two other layers of steel. That keeps production cost down. The Konosuke HD and HH, as well as the Gesshin Ginga and the Richmond Laser in AEB-L, are all made of a single steel. I have no experience using san-mai knives, but do note that some forum-goers find cladding to mute the feedback of the knife against the board. That said, I've heard some Japanese chefs prefer san-mai, and I believe the majority of contributors here find them pretty equivalent.
> 
> If you've fully committed and set your heart on the Konosuke Ginsan, I won't attempt to dissuade you. It's probably an amazing knife. However, if your mind is still open to other options, I do wish to ask if you'd take the Konosuke HD2 over the Ginsan if it were in stock. If so, I highly recommend looking into the Gesshin Ginga, which should be at least equivalent to the Konosuke HD in almost every relevant way besides the alloy (choice of excellent carbon or excellent stainless--and I'd imagine but can't confirm that the stainless Gesshin Ginga will have at least slightly better edge-taking than the Konosuke Ginsan). I've heard the Gesshin Ginga's grind is impeccable.
> 
> ...


Thanks, do you know for a fact this is created as a "san-mai" or w/e, and not one piece of steel? Is that how the Ginsan works?

I'm not commited at all to this knife, and in reality it is a lot more expensive than the other knives, so it's interesting that you prefer the HD2, which is less expensive (but also less steel).

I'm not worried about using a laser, I think the light blade would be nice, but some people said that a "beefier" knife might be better, but I don't know....

I might just wait for the HD2 Laser to come back in stock, but that's probably 5 months away. I would like to get my dad his gift, at least. From what others mentioned they really didn't like the Richmond blades, but the Richmond Ultimatum was created by Konosuke, so I don't know how good they are though.

I have my heart set on nothing right now, but Konosuke seems to be the brand that I'm going with. There seems to be others, but so far everyone seems to agree it's a great brand, but I'm not 100% if that's what I should get, but looks to be that way .

I could always get my dad one knife, and then get the laser at another time for myself, and we can switch knives if need be too.

Thanks for all of the help and advice , much appreciated! 

Any new advice is also much appreciated.


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

No ginsanko refers to the name of the steel. San=3. Is also called G3 steel. San mai is cladding on 3 sides, the sides and top


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Hmm I see that... "Gin-3" or "Silver-3..."  Boo that sucks...?

So we don't even know what the outer layers are?  Why is this so expensive?

Thanks MillionsKnives...


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

I have a lot of clad knives. Nothing inherently wrong with it. There are a lot of reasons to clad. Maybe for reactivity, for cost, to put on a certain look (ex. damascus patterns), or maybe it's easier to forge straight (that one is a guess, I have no idea about forging)


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

^ What MillionsKnives said. Ginsan aka ginsanko aka G3 is just the type of steel they use in the core. You can tell it's san-mai because of the cladding line in the picture. That's the wavy line by the edge, not that secondary bevel line closer to the spine.

I believe only the Ultimatum HD is made by Konosuke. I'd imagine Lamson or some other American OEM makes the regular heavier duty line of Ultimatums.

I'd say getting your dad something a little stouter makes sense. If I were in a position like I understand yours to be, I'd probably go with a Mac Pro 270mm (MBK-110) or Ultimatum AEB-L 240mm for the gift, depending on whether my father had an adequate size cutting board or not. Then I'd either wait on the Konosuke HD if I really wanted to try out the semistainless alloy, or I'd get a Richmond Laser or Gesshin Ginga now.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Gladius said:


> ^ What MillionsKnives said. Ginsan aka ginsanko aka G3 is just the type of steel they use in the core. You can tell it's san-mai because of the cladding line in the picture. That's the wavy line by the edge, not that secondary bevel line closer to the spine.
> 
> I believe only the Ultimatum HD is made by Konosuke. I'd imagine Lamson or some other American OEM makes the regular heavier duty line of Ultimatums.
> 
> I'd say getting your dad something a little stouter makes sense. If I were in a position like I understand yours to be, I'd probably go with a Mac Pro 270mm (MBK-110) or Ultimatum AEB-L 240mm for the gift, depending on whether my father had an adequate size cutting board or not. Then I'd either wait on the Konosuke HD if I really wanted to try out the semistainless alloy, or I'd get a Richmond Laser or Gesshin Ginga now.


Hmm, I see, thanks.

I don't really know what a knife "should" feel like, so I'm just guessing what I would like, and he has no real mention when I've asked him. Why would you choose those 2 kinds?

I don't know if we have a good sizes cutting board I guess I should go out and buy one for him too, it seems wooden ones are preferred.

The Richmonds seem to have mixed reviews on them.

I'll probably wait for the Laser, but Idk what I should get now . I think something super thin would be good still, but Idk about the Richmond knives..

You seem to really like Gesshin , but they are out of stock in the options I was looking at.


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

I have never used a Gesshin and personally own a Konosuke HH (same as HD but for alloy/heat treatment), but the Gesshin Ginga is by all accounts pretty identical to the Konosuke HH/HD in performance. The two are *far* more similar to each other than the HD is to the Ginsan, for example. Some say the Ginga has more consistent F&F than the Konosuke, but many report both being equally great. FWIW the F&F on my Konosuke was very good but not great.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

What exactly is the F&F on the knife?  Do you like the Konosuke HH Laser?  How does it feel?


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## brianshaw (Dec 18, 2010)

Fit and finish


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

BrianShaw said:


> Fit and finish


Sorry, I mean to ask what exactly is the fit and finish of a blade??

From Google it mentions "attention to detail" so I guess how well the final product comes out?

There was a mention of the Ginsan 210mm Handle being wobbly of something, which was kind of a concern, which I brought up on their forum.

I'll ask the other guy what his F/F is on his 2 knives from Konosuke .

Thanks all.

-----------------------------------------------------

It seems that lot of people enjoy their lasers. Would HD2 be the steel to go with, since they have white and blue #2 steel as well as another one called

"Konosuke KD Ginkgo" IT seems we have to call up Mr Richmond to find out about those, so i'm assuming priceeeeeeyyy.....

It seems people also recommend going with 270mm over 240mm due to the size being smaller than listed?

There doesn't seem to be a 270mm Gyuto laser, except for this one

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/riul270gyhds.html

I'm not sure how it compares to other Gyuto, it seems to be made for Mr. Richmond, by Konosuke. I'm not sure why it's labeled as such, is it certain specs that he wanted?

There are also 270's in the "HH Stainless" section. http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kost.html

I also noticed that it seems the GS knives are restocked.

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kogsla.html

Hmm so I guess there are some choices besides the HD2.


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

It's the details.  I want the spine and choil rounded.  The handle should be installed straight and cleanly.  Woodworking should be on point.  The grind should be consistent and not wavy.  The metal is polished good, no weird scratches. Things like that.  If you're paying $200 for a knife, you expect something not crudely made.  You want some craftsmanship pride going into it.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Thanks....

It seems a lot of people are mentioning the Sukanari as a good choice, but Idk....


So hard to decide lolol...

I feel like I personally would like a Konosuke HD2, and then i'll get a nice handle for it, but for my dad, I don't know....


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## millionsknives (Apr 25, 2014)

Get the HD2 for yourself.  Let him play with it and gauge his reaction.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

MillionsKnives said:


> Get the HD2 for yourself. Let him play with it and gauge his reaction.


Problem is his gift comes first, and the HD2's wont be in stock for a few months lol 

I know, you all think I'm crazy.... There's some truth to it.... 

Knife Crazy, new term. 

Wait.... Apparently the GS Lasers are also San Mai... Is the HD2 also, or no?

You guys made it seem like we should only go with what they seem to call "monosteel?"

Thanks


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Gladius said:


> ^ What MillionsKnives said. Ginsan aka ginsanko aka G3 is just the type of steel they use in the core. You can tell it's san-mai because of the cladding line in the picture. That's the wavy line by the edge, not that secondary bevel line closer to the spine.
> 
> I believe only the Ultimatum HD is made by Konosuke. I'd imagine Lamson or some other American OEM makes the regular heavier duty line of Ultimatums.
> 
> I'd say getting your dad something a little stouter makes sense. If I were in a position like I understand yours to be, I'd probably go with a Mac Pro 270mm (MBK-110) or Ultimatum AEB-L 240mm for the gift, depending on whether my father had an adequate size cutting board or not. Then I'd either wait on the Konosuke HD if I really wanted to try out the semistainless alloy, or I'd get a Richmond Laser or Gesshin Ginga now.


I was looking at this post, and that I mentioned before about bad reviews, and noticed you were the one who was commenting on the knives and their "grind issue." I guess it's not a big deal, and doesn't affect performance, just looks?

I don't know where else I saw a bad review on them, maybe it was just your comments, but I thought there was 2 separate comments on them...

http://www.chefknivestogo.com/rilaaest.html

There seems to be very good reviews on both the 240, and the 270. I'm curious if it's worth it to go for the 270(262mm total), because I do like that handle better, but not sure if it justifies the price increase/size increase, or if I should stick with the 240?


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

LasagnaBurrito said:


> I was looking at this post, and that I mentioned before about bad reviews, and noticed you were the one who was commenting on the knives and their "grind issue." I guess it's not a big deal, and doesn't affect performance, just looks?


I think there were two things recently mentioned either by me or others regarding Richmond knives that could be called "grind issues", and the answer to your question depends on which one we're talking about. The first is that some people have reported problems with the grind on some Richmond knives. The grind of the knife refers to the shape of the actual steel as it tapers from the spine to the edge. The shape and consistency of the grind very much affect cutting performance. I think those reports were mainly of the budget Richmond Artifex line and not the Ultimatum or the Laser line. I could be wrong.

The second thing you might be referring to by "grind issue" is that many (all?) Richmond knives are said to come with grind marks on the blade--I guess they don't polish out the scratches left on the blade from manufacturing. This is predominantly or entirely an aesthetic issue. For carbon steel knives, a lot of people voluntarily scratch up the surface of their knife with a scotch-brite cloth to scrub the blade with baking soda, which inhibits patina and rust formation and leaves a worn metal appearance that some find attractive. With stainless steel, most people probably prefer shiny blades with no scratches. Some people don't care. If you do, Richmond knives might not be for you.

I suspect you'll get to choose which handle you get on either the 240 or the 270, but I definitely recommend the 270. Less handle lifting between cuts and a longer sweet spot on the edge. Normally this comes at the cost of weight and ease of wielding, but lasers are so light that the extra weight is practically insignificant (even more true on the Konosuke than the Richmond) and the length on both the Richmond and Konosuke runs way shorter (even more true on the Richmond) anyway, making 240 feel quite small to many and 270 easy to wield.


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

It was also mentioned that the HT of the American made AEB-L Richmonds was a problem. 

Rick


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Rick Alan said:


> It was also mentioned that the HT of the American made AEB-L Richmonds was a problem.
> 
> Rick





Gladius said:


> I think there were two things recently mentioned either by me or others regarding Richmond knives that could be called "grind issues", and the answer to your question depends on which one we're talking about. The first is that some people have reported problems with the grind on some Richmond knives. The grind of the knife refers to the shape of the actual steel as it tapers from the spine to the edge. The shape and consistency of the grind very much affect cutting performance. I think those reports were mainly of the budget Richmond Artifex line and not the Ultimatum or the Laser line. I could be wrong.
> 
> The second thing you might be referring to by "grind issue" is that many (all?) Richmond knives are said to come with grind marks on the blade--I guess they don't polish out the scratches left on the blade from manufacturing. This is predominantly or entirely an aesthetic issue. For carbon steel knives, a lot of people voluntarily scratch up the surface of their knife with a scotch-brite cloth to scrub the blade with baking soda, which inhibits patina and rust formation and leaves a worn metal appearance that some find attractive. With stainless steel, most people probably prefer shiny blades with no scratches. Some people don't care. If you do, Richmond knives might not be for you.
> 
> I suspect you'll get to choose which handle you get on either the 240 or the 270, but I definitely recommend the 270. Less handle lifting between cuts and a longer sweet spot on the edge. Normally this comes at the cost of weight and ease of wielding, but lasers are so light that the extra weight is practically insignificant (even more true on the Konosuke than the Richmond) and the length on both the Richmond and Konosuke runs way shorter (even more true on the Richmond) anyway, making 240 feel quite small to many and 270 easy to wield.


That's for that. The knives look polished, but that's just one knife pic though...

I'll look into the 270, so many people have mixed feelings so we shall see.

I finally got a message from Jon, he was busy, and he was recommending a Gessin Ginga as well. He said that's their inhouse brand, but he gets it made in Japan... I might go for one of those too as an option, we shall see....

Rick Mentioned "American Made" and the guy who recommended Konosuke seemed to have a thing about American vs Japanese made blades, preferring the latter.

Thanks guys .


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

HT=heat treat.  Lamson, the maker, was apparently not doing a great job here either, AEB-L is not the simplest steel to do properly and also they apparently were not using a high end outfit like Pete's Heat Treat.

Their Japanese made knives were not getting bad reports though.

Rick


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Rick Alan said:


> HT=heat treat. Lamson, the maker, was apparently not doing a great job here either, AEB-L is not the simplest steel to do properly and also they apparently were not using a high end outfit like Pete's Heat Treat.
> 
> Their Japanese made knives were not getting bad reports though.
> 
> Rick


Sorry I ddn't get back to you, but thanks for that.

Interesting info on the steel.

@Gladius I was talking to my chef buddy who mentioned that the chefs he learned from, and others recommended starting with a 1000 grit king stone. He said that's what he started on until the stone was "paper thin and cracked" and then he moved onto a better stone...?

Is 1000 grit good? I'll go look up and see if it fits your "medium" option.

Also, I guess I didn't mention this here, but I have a knife set from "Faberware" and I was looking at some of the bigger knives in the back, and noticed one that looked like a Suji, and one that looked like a Gyuto... From the feel of teh Gyuto one it seemed REALLY big. Idk how I feel about the big knives, I feel like I might want a smaller knife?

Maybe I need to just get used to using knives??!?

Thanks all.


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

1000 grit for a King is going to be what I'm calling "medium/coarse", meaning in the same coarseness/fineness class as the Bester 1200, Arashiyama 1000, and Gesshin 2000. In the three-phase profiling/sharpening/polishing model of sharpening, you do the sharpening phase on the King 1000. That's enough to put a decent (albeit toothy) edge on soft European stainless knives, but if you're paying the money for a Japanese knife that can take a highly polished edge, you'll want to at least go up to a medium/fine stone like the Arashiyama 6000, Suehiro Rika, or Gesshin 6000 for some polish. King stones are, by reputation (again, I don't have personal experience freehanding), totally capable of putting in an edge but significantly slower at doing it than the above alternatives. At higher grits like the medium/fine category, I'm not sure how polished an edge one typically gets from, say, the King 6000. That doesn't mean I believe it to be bad, but merely that I don't know.

If you have the board space, longer knives are generally touted as better. That usually means 270mm for a gyuto and 300mm for a sujihiki. What does better mean here? I use a 240mm gyuto and 270mm sujihiki, so I'm not the one to ask, but presumably less handle lifting between cuts and greater sweet spot on the edge. And for a suji, increased chance of getting through a slice in one go, meaning a straight cut. Does the initial awkwardness mean longer isn't better *for you*? Maybe, maybe not. The very first time I used my 270mm suji as a gyuto, I got comfortable with the length after half an onion. But I'm also fairly new to cooking and cutting, so I didn't have years of unlearning to do. As for what will work best for you, in the words of former CT contributor BDL: ¿quién sabe?


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

Gladius said:


> 1000 grit for a King is going to be what I'm calling "medium/coarse", meaning in the same coarseness/fineness class as the Bester 1200, Arashiyama 1000, and Gesshin 2000. In the three-phase profiling/sharpening/polishing model of sharpening, you do the sharpening phase on the King 1000. That's enough to put a decent (albeit toothy) edge on soft European stainless knives, but if you're paying the money for a Japanese knife that can take a highly polished edge, you'll want to at least go up to a medium/fine stone like the Arashiyama 6000, Suehiro Rika, or Gesshin 6000 for some polish. King stones are, by reputation (again, I don't have personal experience freehanding), totally capable of putting in an edge but significantly slower at doing it than the above alternatives. At higher grits like the medium/fine category, I'm not sure how polished an edge one typically gets from, say, the King 6000. That doesn't mean I believe it to be bad, but merely that I don't know.
> 
> If you have the board space, longer knives are generally touted as better. That usually means 270mm for a gyuto and 300mm for a sujihiki. What does better mean here? I use a 240mm gyuto and 270mm sujihiki, so I'm not the one to ask, but presumably less handle lifting between cuts and greater sweet spot on the edge. And for a suji, increased chance of getting through a slice in one go, meaning a straight cut. Does the initial awkwardness mean longer isn't better *for you*? Maybe, maybe not. The very first time I used my 270mm suji as a gyuto, I got comfortable with the length after half an onion. But I'm also fairly new to cooking and cutting, so I didn't have years of unlearning to do. As for what will work best for you, in the words of former CT contributor BDL: ¿quién sabe?


Hmm gotcha, thanks, I'll have to do more research on stones when the time comes.

As for the knives they just felt really big, maybe a big heavy, I don't know, just felt long. Jon from JKI mentioned he has 1 Ginga in White Carbon left, in a Wa handle, I think it's White #1. He did post a review from someone of the same specs knife so Id on't know if he sold it yet...


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

So I think I'm going to possibly go with this one http://www.chefknivestogo.com/katkgy21.html

A few people on CKTG forum recommended it, and it seems to be highly rated for a cheap knife, and I think it's best to go cheap, experiment with the knife to learn about it, and if I ruin it in the process I'm not out 300$+.... 

Anyone have any thoughts on this company/knife? Should i maybe get him both a Gyuto, and Suji for this price?

Thanks again for all the help everyone!!!


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## jbroida (Nov 13, 2011)

LasagnaBurrito said:


> Hmm gotcha, thanks, I'll have to do more research on stones when the time comes.
> 
> As for the knives they just felt really big, maybe a big heavy, I don't know, just felt long. Jon from JKI mentioned he has 1 Ginga in White Carbon left, in a Wa handle, I think it's White #1. He did post a review from someone of the same specs knife so Id on't know if he sold it yet...


white #2 FWIW


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## gladius (May 26, 2015)

Haha I was going to say I'd be surprised if you were selling a V-bevel Ginga in white #1.

Lasagna, I don't know anything about that knife, but if its grind and heat treatment seem usable, it looks like it might replace the CarboNext as a good entry-level semistainless knife, and if its OOTB edge is significantly better than the CarboNext, it might be a good entry-level *first* knife. I do want to repeat the suggestion of erring on the longer side of your comfort zone (or your dad's), whether that means 270 or 240 in this case.


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## lasagnaburrito (Jun 9, 2015)

JBroida said:


> white #2 FWIW





Gladius said:


> Haha I was going to say I'd be surprised if you were selling a V-bevel Ginga in white #1.
> 
> Lasagna, I don't know anything about that knife, but if its grind and heat treatment seem usable, it looks like it might replace the CarboNext as a good entry-level semistainless knife, and if its OOTB edge is significantly better than the CarboNext, it might be a good entry-level *first* knife. I do want to repeat the suggestion of erring on the longer side of your comfort zone (or your dad's), whether that means 270 or 240 in this case.


Yeah, I didn't have the info in front of me, so I wasn't sure haha..... Must have been looking at something else in White #1, or maybe I'm just going crazy?  I don't know what the numbers mean, nor real differences in steels anyways so lol . Trying to look it up, but no real info.

As for this one, I think I read a forum post talking about the "CarboNext" and it sounded similar to what you posted, so I'm guessing you might have research it a little bit? It sounds pretty good though. I'm not sure what you were commenting about "grind and heat treament seem usable" in what instance would it not be, and how can you tell from the info provided?

As everyone already knows, I'm all over the place, but honestly I think I should just get a cheaper knife now, and just learn everything on it, and then when the winter holidays roll around, it will be time for a better knife gift, plus more time to research hahhaha.

As for this gift, I'm still open to cheaper suggestions I guess, but maybe this topic has gone off-topic a little since it's about Konosuke Lasers and such.

I still would like a Wa Handle, but I'm not sure how picky I should be if I'm going cheap....?

As for size, it seems these guys liked the 210mm, and personally these big knives are big... but again I don't know how to use a knife, so I will have to look up youtube videos. I did try to mimic how both of the guys in the CKTG videos use their knives which is a back and forth motion, and it seemed to work okay, except the knife felt pretty dull so yeah I definitely need a better knife myself.. also...

2 month long journey, but getting closer to what I want to start with!

Thanks again.


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## beardedcrow (Oct 1, 2012)

Hello, sorry I'm late to the thread.

I'm a sushi chef and have been for almost a decade.

Yanagiba, is solely for sashimi. One stroke to cut slices of fish.
Considered a chisel edge, only sharpened on one side.

Sujihiki, is a multi purpose knife, doing many things like many already said.
This is my preferred knife for cutting maki. 
And maki is not hand roll, maki is just roll. You do not cut hand rolls as they are shaped like ice cream cones 

Gyuto is another multipurpose knife, more suited for vegetable than the sujihiki.

I have a konosuke sujihiki and gyuto, both at 270 mm.
The spine of the gyuto is slightly thicker than the sujihiki.

I have rarely seen chefs use gyuto for cutting maki, it can he done, but the suji would excel compared to the gyuto.

Thanks!


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