# Secret to THICK mayo



## benway (May 24, 2009)

Recently I had the pleasure of dining in a Japanese steakhouse that served shrimp covered in "Kogane" sauce.  This was a thick yellow egg sauce that is used in blobs to top butterflied shrimp who are then squirted with brandy and covered.  The sauce steams and the result is a firm, impossibly light, deliciously eggy topping.  Naturally I decided that I had to make this and after a bit of googling discovered that the stuff was pretty much steamed mayo with perhaps a little extra yolk.

I've always known how to make Mayo but never in my professional career had I ever been called upon to make it myself as Hellmann's has handled all mayo duties in every kitchen I've ever worked in.  Its not a difficult concept but I was disappointed with my first attempts.  I need a THICK mayo, like cold Hellmann's to recreate this dish.  My mayo is passable but just isn't the tightly wound emulsion that I'm after.

2 yolks

1 c soybean oil

juice of 1/2 lemon

pinch of salt

few dashes of tobasco

Using the recipe above, my trusty stick blender, and the tall narrow container that came with, this is what I've tried:

First I mixed everything together and slowly added the oil, eventually in a stream.  Runny, almost pourable mayo.

I've seen people do it where they'll add everything into the tall narrow container including all the oil at once, push the blender down to the bottom, and go to town.  I tried this and my result was exactly the same.

I heard that my eggs should be at room temperature for a better emulsion.  Didn't help.

At this point I suspect that my woes are for two reasons.  I did my experiment at my parents house using their eggs that might not be fresh enough for what I'm attempting.  Does this really make a HUGE difference?  My next guess is that the mayo is supposed to be like that and the only way to thicken it up is to chill it.  I'll try more experiments soon but first I'd like to poll the cheftalk community.  Who knows the secret to very thick homemade mayo?


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## phatch (Mar 29, 2002)

I've done it with a stick blender much like your recipe and it came out much firmer than commercial mayo.

Perhaps you need a more powerful/higher speed blender to get the air whipped in? My stick blender is just an inexpensive Cuisinart. But my old Braun had slowed down noticeably over the years before I replaced it with the current Cuisinart. You should try your food processor too.


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

Your mixing apperatus to slow or your ingredients to warm, or not mixed long enough.  Keep in mind many commercial Mayonaises have thickeners and stabilizers added and some even preservatives.

Your recipe is fine as far as ratios go.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

FWIW, Michael Ruhlman's ratio is:

* Exported from MasterCook *

Mayonnaise

Recipe By :Formatted by Pete V. McCracken, 657 Village Green St., Porterville, CA 93257 (559) 784-6192 [email protected]
Serving Size : 0 Preparation Time :0:00
Categories : Fat-Based Sauces

Amount Measure Ingredient -- Preparation Method
-------- ------------ --------------------------------
20 parts oil
1 part liquid
1 each egg yolk

Source:
""Ratio", Michael Ruhlman, ISBN-13: 978-1-4165-6611-3 ISBN-10: 1-4165-6611-2"
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Per Serving (excluding unknown items): 38602 Calories; 4365g Fat (100.0% calories from fat); 3g Protein; trace Carbohydrate; 0g Dietary Fiber; 213mg Cholesterol; 7mg Sodium. Exchanges: 1/2 Lean Meat; 872 1/2 Fat.

Nutr. Assoc. : 0 0 0


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## chrisbelgium (Oct 2, 2010)

The trick is quite simple. When making mayo by hand whisking, only use eggyolks. When using machinery, such as a handmixer or stick blender as you call it, add the eggwhites too and you'll have the perfect and thickest mayo. That's the secret.


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## benway (May 24, 2009)

My stick blender is a beast--a commercial robot coupe.  I don't think its the issue.

chefedb,

I tried both cold and room temperature eggs with room temperature oil.  I can't imagine this is too warm as everyone keeps their soybean oil out.

ChrisBelgium,

Why would that make sense?


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## vohrtex (Apr 21, 2009)

In my experience, a yolk can hold a cup of oil, and the more oil the thicker it gets. Increase your oil a bit and it should thicken up.


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## grumio (Apr 16, 2006)

The first & second times I made mayo with a stick blender, it worked perfectly.  Third & fourth times it didn't work at all.  Then it worked again.  Then I quit using the stick blender & tried my food processor, which has worked perfectly every time.


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## french fries (Sep 5, 2008)

I usually make mayo by hand, but I've tried using a stick blender in a tall narrow container, and it works great to make instant super thick mayo. Just pour everything in the glass, put the stick blender all the way at the bottom of the glass, start blending and as the bottom gets thick, slowly bring the stick blender up the glass until the top is thick. Should take no longer than 5-10 seconds max.

By hand, the slower you pour the oil, the thicker the emulsion.


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## petalsandcoco (Aug 25, 2009)

Ben,

. Maybe the egg ration, I don't know ? Pete has the recipe straight out....and French Fries has the technique ....so I will still add my one cent.

1 egg

1/2- 1 cup oil

plus 1 tbsp lemon juice

all ingredients at room temp. Using the right oil helps.

 The way French Fries makes his is basically they way I make mine, starting from the bottom and working your way up in a narrow container. The smart stick or stick blender is the fastest way to make it.....seconds really, giving a nice thick mayo.

For a really rich tasting mayo (not really thick) use just the yolks......just a thought.


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## butzy (Jan 8, 2010)

Why it makes sense to use the egg yolk, I don't know, but it works!

I think it's just that the speed of the food processor can emulsify the whole egg as opposed to only the egg yolk by hand mixing.

I use the food processor and as said the whole egg. It makes for a light yellow, firm mayonaisse


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## chrisbelgium (Oct 2, 2010)

_Quote Benway; Why would that make sense?_

It has indeed to do with the speed of the blades of the foodprocessor (so I'm told). You can never beat that intense by hand.

Adding the eggwhites too seems a little odd, but, try it and see for yourself, it makes a big difference in consistency!

Also, the method that French Fries explains is the easiest way to make mayo. Use also eggwhites and you will have the thickest mayo in seconds...


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## benway (May 24, 2009)

Theoretically the major players in the thickness of mayo is oil, water, and the emulsifier lecithin.  The thickness should come from a lot of fat bonding with very little water, making big blobs of tightly wound emulsion.  To my understanding the thickest possible Mayo, should be when the amount of water, with lecithin in excess, is as low as possible while the amount of oil is as high as possible.  The limiting factor of course being when the sauce breaks.  Leaving the egg white is essentially just leaving water.  More water means more oil is needed to reach the thickest state, which means that I'm diluting my yolk flavor, which I'd rather be concentrating.  Anyways what do I know, I'm the one who can't get it to work.

As I mentioned above, I tried the method described by french fries, I had seen this done and it looked pretty fool proof.  I still think the eggs are to blame.  The lecithin content of eggs supposedly decreases with age.  The eggs in my parents fridge are probably pushing it.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

From Michael Ruhlman's "Ratio", page 167-168


> Harold McGee, in _On Food and Cooking_, notes that there is plenty of emulsifying power in a single yolk: "A single yolk can emulsify a dozen cups of oil or more." Importantly, he goes on, What is critical is the ratio of oil to water."
> 
> The above ratio is updated to account for and underscore that fact that without water (or some form of it, such as lemon juice or vinegar) a handmade mayonnaise is virtually impossible. Mayonnaises can and will break, not if too much oil is added relatively to the quantity of yolk, but relative to the amount of water you've included...
> 
> ...But if there is not enough water, the oil droplets will break through the barrier and join with the other oil droplets and the mixture will quickly turn to an oily soup.


Further on on page 169-170, Ruhlman provides a solution to broken mayonnaise:


> To reemulsify a broken mayonnaise, get a new bowl, add a teaspoon of water (and if you wish a little more egg yolk), and begin adding the broken mayo to the water while whisking continuously until you have a properly disciplined sauce.


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## petalsandcoco (Aug 25, 2009)

Those are Excellent points !


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## blueicus (Mar 16, 2005)

The secret is simple, small oil droplets, not too much water and also broken down into small droplets.  You can make mayo of any texture from runny hollandaise to spackle.

If you're using a whisk you will need a lot of elbow grease to get that thick consistency.  Easier to use a blender or food processor.  Proportions you listed are not a problem but it is true that one egg yolk can emulsify a lot more oil (provided you have enough water to hold the emulsion).


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## durangojo (Jul 30, 2007)

water in homemade mayo? that's a new one.....

joey


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Water OR lemon juice OR vinegar OR some other flavorful liquid that is not fat based!

Lecithin, the emulsifier in egg yolks, is a bi-polar molecule, one end is attracted to fats, the other to water, for it to work correctly, there has to be both available.



durangojo said:


> water in homemade mayo? that's a new one.....
> 
> joey


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## french fries (Sep 5, 2008)

I don't use water or vinegar or lemon juice or anything, however I always add a tablespoon of dijon mustard to the yolk, I guess that gives me the needed amount of water you guys are talking about.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

French Fries said:


> I don't use water or vinegar or lemon juice or anything, however I always add a tablespoon of dijon mustard to the yolk, I guess that gives me the needed amount of water you guys are talking about.


Well, the ingredient list for the Dijon mustard I have is:

Water
Mustard seed
Distilled Vinegar
Salt
White wine
Citric acid
Tartaric acid
pectin
spices
So, three of the first five ingredients are water or water based liquids


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## chrisbelgium (Oct 2, 2010)

I'm sure all scientific literature, facts, measurements and explanation are very correct, but I prefer to go for pragmatic simplicity, performed by a billion housewives and cooks in the past and present, who made and make their own mayo. It still works, it always will. Also, when making a traditional mayo first, you can always add all kinds of other stuff afterward to make your personalized version.

Here's the very classic recipe from.. 3 Michelinstar cook Peter Goossens. Exactly the same as my mother used to make the stuff, many decades ago.

He also makes it with a stick blender in a narrow tall recipient; the one that usually comes with a stick blender for home use. 

His ingredients;

- 3 whole eggs, yolks and whites

- 3 tbsp of homemade tarragonvinegar. 

- 1 tbsp of mustard; he uses this one; http://www.tierenteyn.be/ It's an artisanal made mustard, comparable to Dijon-style, only a little stronger.

- 500 ml grapeseed oil

- s&p

His recipe;

Put everything together in the recipient and mix. Done in less than 10 seconds, thick as you will like it!

If you want to see him make it, he did it in this video where he makes "Vlaamse Stoverij", also worldwide known as "carbonades flamandes", but, with... pig cheeks. It's in dutch.

Here it is; http://www.njam.tv/recepten/vlaamse-stoverij-de-klassieker

BTW, I think it's unnecessary to remind that all ingredients should have the same temperature? Take everything out of the fridge some time in advance.

Maybe I could start another thread "How to pimp your homemade mayo" for the tarragonvinegar and adding all kinds of other stuff to mayo to make other delicious sauces.


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## durangojo (Jul 30, 2007)

PeteMcCracken said:


> Water OR lemon juice OR vinegar OR some other flavorful liquid that is not fat based!
> 
> Lecithin, the emulsifier in egg yolks, is a bi-polar molecule, one end is attracted to fats, the other to water, for it to work correctly, there has to be both available.


Bipolar mayonnaise for a bipolar planet...kinda funny, don'cha think?

joey


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## benway (May 24, 2009)

Chris my man, you've cured my mayo.  Last night I left in the egg white while making mayo and the results couldn't have been more different.  It made a huge difference.  My thin milky mayo was a thick tightly wound emulsion.  Don't know why that's the trick but thanks for sharing!


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## jona (Mar 26, 2011)

I think make a thick mayo when you make the mayo with hand whisking technique is at egg yolk so more egg yolk more thick too more lime juice or acid will make the mayo thick too. CMIIW.


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## granny smith (Jan 31, 2011)

I haven't bought mayo in years, since it's so easy to make. I use a food processor (the little one)

Put these ingredients in the food processor~

1 whole egg

2 T. white vinegar (cider vinegar gives it an off taste)

1/2 t. salt

1/2 t. dry mustard

Turn on FP, then slowly add:

1 cup oil (I use corn or peanut oil)

Once all the oil has been added, scrape down lid of FP, then replace lid and turn it on for a few more seconds.

If I'm using homegrown eggs, I put the mayo right in the fridge. If I'm using eggs from the store, I allow the mayo to sit at room temperature for a couple of hours before refrigerating. This gives the vinegar time to kill any bacteria that might be in the eggs.

This always results in mayo so thick I can turn the jar upside-down with no spillage.

This recipe can be doubled or tripled, but you'll need to use the big food processor if you do that. (I hate washing my big FP, which is why I usually make it in the little one)


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## chrisbelgium (Oct 2, 2010)

benway said:


> Chris my man, you've cured my mayo. Last night I left in the egg white while making mayo and the results couldn't have been more different. It made a huge difference. My thin milky mayo was a thick tightly wound emulsion. Don't know why that's the trick but thanks for sharing!


De nada, amigo!


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## mezzaluna (Aug 29, 2000)

This is a wonderful discussion. It's why I've been active here for so many years. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif

Heck, I was going to ask which side of the sub-continental divide your water comes from. Lots of people swear by Milwaukee water. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/wink.gif


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## kumaon (Sep 11, 2011)

Hellman's, slowly beat in olive oil till thick and glossy - no worry about contaminated raw egg yolks.


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## durangojo (Jul 30, 2007)

you're kidding right?

joey

if you're really wigged out about raw egg yolk contamination i think you could use an egg beater type product...something that is pasturized


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## kumaon (Sep 11, 2011)

I'm not wigged about it, but many people are.  I know how to make mayonnaise from scratch, but this is the fastest way I know to make quite a good mayonnaise, and it has a minimal chance breaking the emulsion.  I usually add a bit of mustard and lemon juice to the Hellman's before adding the oil.


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## kumaon (Sep 11, 2011)

I don't think eggbeaters have lecithin.


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## athomechef (Sep 16, 2011)

I make a great mayo with an egg poached 1-2 mins (cool slightly) put in blender with 1 tsp dijon, 1 tsp red wine vinegar, a little lemon juice, crushed garlic clove, cayenne and maybe smoked paprika. Give it a zap and add 1 cup peanut oil slowly through top. Super thick. My problem is, I saw somewhere on this site that you can't make mayo with poached egg. Please tell me this isn't true. I have concerns about the raw egg yolk and this mayo is delicious!  By the way the peanut oil makes it half the calories of mayo make with olive oil. (If anyone cares).


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## susan wheeler (Sep 9, 2013)

I've also had problems. I did everything you did. I even have my own chickens. I tried fresh eggs, older eggs, egg yolks, whole eggs. I go through so much oil it isn't funny. I've used olive oil, grapeseed oils. I've tried FP's, blenders, and stick blender. I even went and bought a different stick blender. Maybe one in 4 batches will come out nice. I try to duplicate it, nope. It has got to be one of the most frustrating things I ever try to make. I hear other people say they have no problems. And to be honest, I don't even care for it that much, it tastes oily and flavorless. So your answer is not in the eggs, believe me. I figure when I want mayo and I've failed a few times, I hope this time I will be lucky. Second frustration is making bread and getting the crumb I like using wild yeast. Another frustration. Bread and mayo don't like me. Do I have any answers for you, sorry no, but it is nice to know there are other people that mayo has it out for.


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## french fries (Sep 5, 2008)

Susan Wheeler said:


> I've tried FP's, blenders, and stick blender.


Have you tried doing it by hand?


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## susan wheeler (Sep 9, 2013)

That is probably about the only thing I haven't tried. I don't know if  I have the endurance to do that, lol. I'll keep at it from time to time, and I sure wish I had that magical touch to get a good mayo at least more so than not, I end up with a lot of salad dressing that I don't eat that much. But I thought of a question yesterday. I just received a bottle of beef gelatin, have you heard of or know of anyone adding that to help with a thick mayo. I may give this a try if I get another runny batch(which I most likely will). I have no idea if this will work or not work. Have you heard of this?


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## french fries (Sep 5, 2008)

Never heard of this and it sounds nasty. Look, I'm not sure what's wrong with your mayo-making attempts, but as has been repeatedly stated in this thread, making mayo should be an easy task, and IMO trying to learn an easy task by making it convoluted is a bad idea, you have to, one way or another, learn how to make a simple mayo with regular mayo ingredients. 

FWIW in France where I grew up, mayo, like vinaigrette, is considered an easy task and is typically given to kids (while the mother/father handles the skillets on the stovetop). I started making mayo probably at age 6. I never tempered ingredients or the bowl (mustard and egg right out of the fridge, oil at room temp), I've never had it break on me (except after leaving it overnight in the fridge sometimes), never had a problem making it. 

I really can't think of any reason it should be so hard, so I'd say try it by hand, and make sure you add a bit of strong dijon mustard.


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## chefgcarves (May 14, 2013)

I haven't made mayo by hand since the first year in Culinary school.

So much easier in a blender, FP or w/a stick blender.

Mustard (dry or prepared) is also an emulsifier in addition to the lecithin in the yolks.

Water based liquid is necessary in small amounts, as others have mentioned. I have adjusted the thickness and saved broken mayo with the addition of a little more water, a little more elbow grease and maybe some more yolk.

@athomechef - if you are talking about fully poached eggs (like on eggs benedict) I don't think that is feasible, as the whites would be chunky and the yolk would be denatured by the heat.

If you are talking about slightly _coddled eggs_, then those should be fine. Slightly coddled eggs have been cooked at low temps so that the whites look slightly cloudy, but are still liquid.

You can find how to pasteurize your own eggs online, if you can't find pasteurized eggs in the market, or if you prefer to DIY.

Good luck!


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## susan wheeler (Sep 9, 2013)

Well, I tried again yesterday and it worked beautifully. Here is what I took under consideration. After reading the science behind some here, I hadn't used dried mustard for one, and maybe, just maybe I wasn't using enough vinegar. So I tried just the yolks again, eggs from that morning, 2 tbl of coconut vinegar(acv is a tad strong, cv is milder and sweeter), tsp sugar, tsp salt(about), and grapeseed oil, 1 tsp dried mustard, and 2 yolks. I let it sit in a qt mason jar for a bit, then put in the immersion blender let it sit for 30 seconds and tried it again using that, and held my breath, ready to throw something if it didn't work . It did, So I will try this again and cross my fingers that I will succeed using these ingredients. I still may try adding a pinch of gelatin just for the health benefits and see what it does.  I am happy and it tastes nice. I thought adding more liquid would make it runnier, but maybe that was the problem. Most recipes have just a little, and the dry mustard. We shall see.


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

When mayo isn't thick the most likely culprit is an improper emulsion. You guys either didn't add enough oil, or added the oil too fast (especially in the beginning) and the oil never formed a complete emulsion. Think a vinaigrette as opposed to a mayo. 

It can/will even look like it is properly emulsified because the blender will force it together temporarily. So if it is thin and runny, but doesn't look broken, it is only because the blender temporarily made it an emulsion...given some time it would probably separate. 

Try adding, literally, a few drops at a time for a bit before you add a slow, steady stream of oil. The few drops ensure that the emulsion will form.


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## soesje (Dec 6, 2012)

susan, when it ain't broke don't fix it : leave the gelatin out.

there are no health benefits in a pinch of gelatin .

sounds you have mayo now!!! great!

aside from that, I don't get the dry mustard.

here in europe, you just use wet (dijon type) mustard for the emulsion forming.

esp when the eggyolks are from the fridge, the wet mustard helps the emulsion  to form and the mayo to work.


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## rick alan (Nov 15, 2012)

Cross-posting in this old post here as I had started my own post on this subject and the title here is more to the point, so to reiterate and elaborate the revelation here:

Whole egg goes into narrow jar along with the usual suspects

Tilt jar slightly to get the egg all in one place to fit within the skirt of the stick blender.

Hold there and wiz until you see the emulsion is not traveling upwards any further, then draw the SB up to finish the rest.

Once it sets up in the fridge the resultant is a very firm paste, I mean beautiful thick as you could just about ever want it.

Rick


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