# Bringing your own china and silverware to a restaurant



## snausages (Jan 21, 2011)

My friend, who posts here, asked me to start this topic as he feels my behavior in restaurants is excessive.  However, I feel that I'm not doing anything that far outside the norm.

I keep a set of dinnerware in the trunk of my car - plates, silverware, glassware, and disposable napkins - for use at every restaurant I visit.  I just don't feel comfortable using the pieces they provide, which have been used by hundreds of patrons before me.

After the meal, I ask that they wash the dishes - again, not out of line; they'd have to wash them anyway had I used the plates and silverware provided by the restaurant.  Besides, this hardly takes fifteen minutes.

So, what do you think?  Of course, I feel like I'm doing no harm; the customer is ALWAYS right, and if they're taking my money I get to do whatever I want while inside their restaurant.


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## gunnar (Apr 3, 2008)

OMG, well while they may do it...I know any crew I worked with would be be making fun of you in the back of the house. Also just because your a customer does not mean you can do ANYTHING you want but a nice place will let you get away with quite a bit. I am surprised your friends put up with it. I certainly would be embarrassed to have to sit at the table with you.


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## trooper (Jan 21, 2011)

They could play the "Sorry, your dishes and cutlery are not NSF Certified" card... But more likely - They don't mind if you use your own flatware; But to ask a line to plate o your own dishes is excessive. Maybe on a Tuesday when the place is slow- the BOH may get a laugh out of the request, and not mind. Come in on a busy Friday night and make the same request - your dishes may just get "opps! Smash! Here- take one of our plates as a condolence and GTFO!"

I bring a tasting spoon with me when I go to fine dine/multi-course menu dinners. People think that is odd enough - Just one little serling silver, perfectly round bowl tasting spoon. Since I am a germaphobe as well - I could even see someone using their own silverware setting.

But to bring your own cup, plate, bowl, glass.... seriously now. They have 191degree water and salamanders in the kitchen for a reason.

And maybe if you worked in a kitchen - you would see that most :germs: that end up on your plate come from how the elements are prepped, not by way of a dirty plate. Seriously.... If you get a dirty dish - send it back. But spare the kitchen the extra overhead of tracking your dishes on the line and at the dish station.


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

I agree that it's rather obsessive, and unfair to the boh people, as it interferes with their systems and work flow procedures.

More to the point:

Back of house, where they are obsessive about sanitation to begin with, they plate on service that's gone through a detergent/water washing at about 180 degrees (to put that in perspective, the typical household hot water is 120), been rinsed, then dipped in a sanitizer as well. The cooks and/or expeditors, who are either wearing gloves or who have just washed their hands, arrange the food on that serviceware.

Next comes, a server who has perhaps just bussed a table, getting left-over, partially eaten food, on his/her fingers. Maybe he or she has paused to wipe them. For sure those fingers weren't washed. The server then picks up your order, laying his/her thumb over the plate to stabalize it, and lays the dish before you.

Question: Do you really think your serviceware, no matter how well washed (either at home or in the restaurant's kitchen), is protecting you from contamination? The unfortunate, mostly unstated fact is, that in most restaurants cleanliness and sanitation stops at the pass.

My advice: Leave your serviceware at home, stop embarrasing yourself and your companions, and just enjoy the dining-out experience.

_I feel that I'm not doing anything that far outside the norm._

Of course you are. "Normal" is defined as the way the majority of people behave. The norm, in a restaurant, is to use the serviceware provided. How many other people have you ever seen ask that they use the patrons cups, plates, bowls, and flatware.


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## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

Haha who is this?  Are you one of our own forum members with a made up screen name just to pull on our leg?  That's just too funny.

There's a big difference between "the customer is always right" and "the customer is crazy" and bringing your own dishware and then requesting that the staff clean it is not only rude but a little insane.  Are you sure they're cleaning your dishware?  How can you be sure?  Are you sure they're not cleaning it by dipping them in the toilet bowl?  Just saying, if I was back there and was asked to do someone's personal dishes I may drop them into the toilet bowl and wipe them dry with napkins I found in the trash... by accident of course.

But besides that, restaurants should really not be allowing this to happen.  I used to work at a lunch counter and from time to time people would bring in their own mugs and ask me to put their drinks in there so that I didn't have to waste a paper cup.  I'm not sure if this was a health regulation or not but the owners of the store absolutely did not allow this.  A restaurant holds enough responsibility to keep things sanitized without people bringing in their own questionably clean dishes.

You should bring your own salt and pepper shakers while you're at it.  Do you have any idea how many people (who have just licked their fingers) have touched the salt/pepper shakes at your table?  You should bring your own chair while you're at it.  When does it end?


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## chefbuba (Feb 17, 2010)

snausages said:


> My friend, who posts here, asked me to start this topic as he feels my behavior in restaurants is excessive. However, I feel that I'm not doing anything that far outside the norm.
> 
> I keep a set of dinnerware in the trunk of my car - plates, silverware, glassware, and disposable napkins - for use at every restaurant I visit. I just don't feel comfortable using the pieces they provide, which have been used by hundreds of patrons before me.
> 
> ...


I agree with KY... sanitation stops at the pass. Servers are not gloved or constantly hand washing.

I would not allow it in my place. Your comment, "Besides, this hardly takes fifteen minutes" Do you think that any restaurant is going to spend 15 min to wash your plates ?

And just because you are in my place of business, no you can't do what ever you want. Stop embarrassing yourself and your friends, and get some professional help.


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## phatch (Mar 29, 2002)

I don't believe it.

If he's worried about sanitation to the point of brining his own setting, then why have them wash it? It's no cleaner then than any of the other settings.


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## kyheirloomer (Feb 1, 2007)

Phil, I believe he means he brings them in clean (which, itself, is kind of questionable), but has the restaurant wash them after the fact.


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## snausages (Jan 21, 2011)

Thanks for all the replies, I'm a bit surprised as I expected more people to side with me.

I didn't think it was that unusual, and I'll admit to doing things that are a bit more extreme on occasion - for instance, bringing my own ingredients (meat, mostly) to the restaurant to ensure what I'm served is not old inventory.  I don't do this at finer restaurants, only places which I consider to be questionable.

Public/shared things just get under my skin, I couldn't imagine going to the store and touching things without my heavy rubber gloves.  I'm trying to get more comfortable in my daily routine, but it's hard when you've lived your entire life as a germaphobe.

It's not only a cleanliness issue...I'm just very particular about my things, and hate sharing with other people.  I refuse to share enclosed spaces such as elevators, taxi cabs, etc. with others.  Maybe weird, but just the way I prefer it to be.

My friends are very tolerant of my behavior, and have gotten used to it for the most part.  Besides, being the only person carrying a plastic bag with raw chicken on ice to a 40th wedding anniversary dinner tends to be a light-hearted icebreaker.


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## snausages (Jan 21, 2011)

I really try to make exceptions at finer establishments out of respect. For instance, I trust Alinea in Chicago to have above-average sanitary conditions, so rather than bringing my complete kit into the restaurant I simply brought in a small container of rubbing alcohol to disinfect my silverware and empty glassware with. Our waiter was very discreet and accommodating as one would expect at Alinea.

Of course, I brought my own napkin - using a cloth napkin at a public restaurant is on par with wiping my face with a used pillow case.


Gunnar said:


> OMG, well while they may do it...I know any crew I worked with would be be making fun of you in the back of the house. Also just because your a customer does not mean you can do ANYTHING you want but a nice place will let you get away with quite a bit. I am surprised your friends put up with it. I certainly would be embarrassed to have to sit at the table with you.


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## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

You must have very good friends who tolerate that.  I would not.  But the further you explain your behavior the stranger it sounds.  I really don't think this is a case of kooky character, it sounds more like a severe dsability of OCD, germophobia and agoraphobia all rolled into one.  I don't think any of our suggestions will really help you here, have you thought about seeking counseling?  It sounds like a terrifying way to go through life.  Dissinfecting silverware and stemware with alcohol is not exactly healthy you know, you're putting chemicals on your dishes that are more hazardous than the germs that may or may not be on it.

Furthermore, why go out to a restaurant at all if the environment disgusts you so much?  I know some people of an older generation like my grandmother and my inlaws who do not trust the sanitary practices at restaurants but rather patronizing dining establishments and bringing their own food and dishware they choose not to go at all. 

If someone came to your home and brought their own plate and accused you of not being clean enough to eat off your dishes and then handed you their dirty plate to wash, wouldn't that be insulting to you?  It is, and it is insulting and uncomfortable for everyone around that has to watch it unfold.


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## gobblygook (Aug 26, 2010)

This isn't completely universally true. Sanitizer is required if the water temp doesn't get up to a certain temp (I think 170 degrees). As such, the food service companies LOVE to "lease" dishwashers to restaurants which are low-temp (130 degrees) and require the sanitizer chemicals, which the food service company sells. At one time, and probably still the case, handwashing could also use head instead of chemicals, but then you have to find a way to get those dishes out of 170+ degree water and you only stick your hand in there once. For those using temp, an immersion heater is used in that tub of the sink. So, in my experience, it has to be chemical OR temp, not both.

As to the original poster, bring in anything you want, but don't expect the kitchen to wash it. Large restaurants have specific dishracks that fit their dishes. This keeps the dishes from banging up against each other during the wash cycle. In addition, dishes are done when they're done, not immediately after bussing. Smaller restaurants often don't "do" dishes during lunch, but let the dishes build up and bang them out between 2-5pm. In addition, your meal should come out on the restaurant's plate and you can move it to a cedar shingle if you want.

I appreciate that germaphobes exist and that they have special issues, but those issues are for the germaphobe to resolve, not the restaurant. In short, most servers would be waiting for Ashton Kutcher to jump out to tell them they'd been "punked".



KYHeirloomer said:


> Back of house, where they are obsessive about sanitation to begin with, they plate on service that's gone through a detergent/water washing at about 180 degrees (to put that in perspective, the typical household hot water is 120), been rinsed, then dipped in a sanitizer as well.


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## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

snausages said:


> Thanks for all the replies, I'm a bit surprised as I expected more people to side with me.


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## abefroman (Mar 12, 2005)

snausages said:


> I didn't think it was that unusual, and I'll admit to doing things that are a bit more extreme on occasion - for instance, bringing my own ingredients (meat, mostly) to the restaurant to ensure what I'm served is not old inventory. I don't do this at finer restaurants, only places which I consider to be questionable.


Do they give you a discount since your bringing in the meat?


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## jim berman (Oct 28, 1999)

Wow! Has anybody ever seen http://tinyurl.com/23urfrn (My Strange Addiction' Focuses on Unusual Obsessive Behavior Bizarre Uses of Blow Dryers, Ventriloquism and Toilet Paper)?

And I don't say that to poke fun or be mean. But, some people do some.. uh.... interesting stuff:

Lori Broady could not live without her hair dryer. Since she was eight years old, she says, she couldn't fall asleep without it turned on next to her in bed.
a woman addicted to ventriloquism
one who can't stop eating toilet paper


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

snausages said:


> ...- for instance, bringing my own ingredients (meat, mostly) to the restaurant to ensure what I'm served is not old inventory. I don't do this at finer restaurants, only places which I consider to be questionable...


If I have reason to question the age of the inventory, there are probably a host of other more serious concerns that will prevent me from eating there.

Restaurants, at least in the USA, have far more stringent food safety regulations than you can possibly equal on an individual basis.

Perhaps you should contact your local health inspector and have your kitchen/dining area at your home inspected to the same standards that restaurants must meet. My guess? Your home facilities will not pass.

The first hurdle is the requirement for a minimum of seven (7) sinks in your kitchen. Take a look at the 2009 Food Code.


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

Oh, BTW, you DO realize that allowing ANYTHING into a commercial kitchen that has been handled by un-trackable persons or processes is illegal in most jurisdictions, correct?SUBMIT


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## gobblygook (Aug 26, 2010)

> Restaurants, at least in the USA, have far more stringent food safety regulations than you can possibly equal on an individual basis.
> 
> Perhaps you should contact your local health inspector and have your kitchen/dining area at your home inspected to the same standards that restaurants must meet. My guess? Your home facilities will not pass.
> 
> The first hurdle is the requirement for a minimum of seven (7) sinks in your kitchen. Take a look at the 2009 Food Code.


I disagree about the health inspection part because you may see the health inspector 4 times a year for 15 mins a visit. A health inspector only evaluates at a specific point in time. He also doesn't dig into the back of the walk-in and check to see if there's anything old and moldy. Gordon Ramsay's Kitchen Nightmares (the US version) had some outright nasty kitchens that obviously had passed health inspection at some point.

I am not sure where the 7 sinks requirement comes from. You need a 3-basin dishwashing sink, a hand sink, a prep sink, and a mop "sink". Perhaps you're counting "basins" and then counting the hand sink that must be with the restroom too?


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## irenie (Jan 21, 2011)

There is a health concern for the restaurant to plate on your own dishes in the first place. How do they know that's they have been sanitized (sitting in the trunk?)? If they touch your plate with a shared utensil for plating, there could be potential cross-contamination. So they would have to be very careful - not sure if I were the owner - I would allow this.

As for them washing your plate ...  If you were concerned about using their plates in the first place, how can you be sure they would wash them/handle them any cleaner?


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

My place is inspected by my local health dept. and a report is available for your inspection. I would not let you bring your dishes in from an un -inspected kitchen(yours)  Mine are certified cleaner then yours by the health inspector.  Unless you are observing dietary law. Which in fact if you were you would not be in my place anyway. If I let you do this I could be sued as it is illegal, at least here in Florida. I think for your own sake I would see a Doctor and ask him the signs of Paranoya


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

gobblygook said:


> ...I am not sure where the 7 sinks requirement comes from. You need a 3-basin dishwashing sink, a hand sink, a prep sink, and a mop "sink". Perhaps you're counting "basins" and then counting the hand sink that must be with the restroom too?



Ware washing sink , ware rinsing sink, ware sanitizing sink, often called triple sink (3)
Floor sink to drain ware washing sinks (1)
Hand wash sink (1)
Floor sink to drain hand wash sink (1)
Mop sink (1)
Total = 7
At least in California

If you have a prep sink, add 2 more (don't forget the floor sink to drain the prep sink!)


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## pete (Oct 7, 2001)

Sorry, but would not allow it my kitchen.  I don't know where you plates have been.  I don't know what is on them.  If you get sick due to a foodborne illness is it my fault, or was it brought in on your plates?  Also, if one of my staff breaks your plates, are you going to hold me responsible?  I'm not paying for it, but then again I'm not plating my food on your plates.

If you bring in your own food and ask me to cook it, forget it.  It is illegal and I won't do it.  One question though, if you bring in your own food, what do you expect to be charged for the preparation?  If you expect anything less than paying full price, why would I want you taking up a seat in my place?  Yeah, sure you can argue that you are saving me the food cost, but still, I'm not going to play.

The up shot of this whole thing is I would be highly offended if you pulled this in my place and I would ask you to leave.  If you feel my standards are not up to par, then why would you even venture into my place.


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Nope, not in mine neither.  What else is in the trunk of your car?

My chinaware is vitrified and NSF certified, it won't break or chip, don't know about the original posters and don't care.

My dishwasher does the dishes as and when needed, not when the customer wants a single plate done.  My dishwashing machine is high temp and may or may not damage the o.p.'s china ware.

All of my ingredients are sourced from inspected and licensced suppliers, don't now about the O.P's and don't care. 

Although I am not "high end" I do take extreme pride in my food, and feel the rascism inbtween high end and "regualr" restaurants is unjustified.


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Y'know, the moe I read through this mess the more I don't like it.

The original poster wants to bring his own china ware and silverware, and also wants to bring his own ingredients.

The more I think about this, the more I feel the O.P has already pre-determined that the restaurant's sanitation is not up to his standards.  In the case of meat, that the restaurant's standards don't meet his expectations either. Well then, how about the starch and vegetables?  The apps, the dessert?  Maybe bring his own thermos of coffee? 

All this begs the question, if the O.P. doesn't trust the place he goes into, why does he bother going?   Somehow I get the feeling that no matter how hard a place tries with this customer, the customer has laready pre-determined that he will have a lousy dining experience before he even walks in the place.


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## pattypan (Dec 12, 2010)

mmmmmm.........is it April fool's day?


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## abefroman (Mar 12, 2005)

foodpump said:


> Y'know, the moe I read through this mess the more I don't like it.
> 
> The original poster wants to bring his own china ware and silverware, and also wants to bring his own ingredients.
> 
> ...


He would like the korean bbq places where you can cook your own food.


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

OK. Now I'm now sayin', I'm just sayin" ................... but there is an absolutely okey-doakey tangent here that I would like to bring up. I've been to numerous places, both high-end and cheap seedy dives that allowed BYO. They were just fine with us, and any other patrons I'm sure, bringing in our own stems, you know, wine glasses. I've even brought my own stems to high-end places that didn't allow corkage because they were aware that theirs just might not be as good (wine geek) as mine. I've never had any problem with that before.


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## pete (Oct 7, 2001)

Iceman, I would probably allow someone to bring in their own wine glasses, though it would amuse me to no end.  And here's why:  1.  it doesn't interupt the flow of things like having to use someone else's plates for plating and since the wine glasses don't enter the kitchen I don't have to worry about potential cross contamination.  2.  Have you ever heard of a foodborne illness from wine?  I haven't and a search of the web didn't turn up any that I could find so if someone got sick from wine they drank from their own glasses I would have a pretty good argument, in court, that it was from the glass not the wine itself.  3.  I would never assume the responsibility of cleaning the clients wine glasses.  4.  As amused as I am that some wine snobs feel the need to own a special glass for every type of conceivable wine, most places I have worked at only offer red wine glasses, white wine glasses and champagne flutes (in a few of the really high end places we would have 2 styles of red wine glass).  If someone felt the need for a special wine glass for their wine I wouldn't take it as a dig at my restaurant as with someone bringing their own plateware because they felt mine weren't sanitary enough.  Yes, that might be egotisical, but it's how I feel.  As for BYOB, since all the restaurants I have ever worked for sold wine, we usually had a policy to only allow wines to be brought in if the people called ahead and informed us, and it was a special occasion or a very special bottle.  Even then we would charge a corkage fee.  If you hadn't made previous arrangements then you were not allowed to bring in your own bottle.


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## teamfat (Nov 5, 2007)

Do you bring in your own chair, or muster the courage to sit where who knows what has gone before?

mjb.


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

_*Pete,*_ your points are all good. I'm not calling you out on this, and believe it or not, I'm not speaking as a _"snob"_ but as a _"wine geek"_. I'm also not telling you that you are wrong so much, but to say that I think your thoughts would be different if you had better wine experience. NO, I've not ever heard of any _"foodborne illness from wine"_. Also, I would not want any of your staff to wash my glasses. I don't have any this expensive but they can run north of $85 each. There really are specific glasses for different wines. I didn't believe this until I was given the chance to see for myself. Different shapes and sizes make for different drinking/appreciating experiences. This, I believe is most related to the olfactory senses related to drinking the wine. As an example I will use flatware. You can eat a green leafy salad with a spoon, but you generally don't. Please tell me that you are aware of the different styles of glasses for beer (cold frosty mugs, pilsner glasses, lager glasses, pints, baseball stadium paper cups). I've never had any restaurant have any problem with this. I have seen places charge anywhere from zero 0, to $50 for corkage. Let me tell you this, zero 0 or really cheap corkage ($2-$5) brings in a much higher spending class of people into high-end places. Even in really big places that charge +/- $20 corkage, you will find numerous people taking advantage of it and up-spend on their food orders. The wait-staff in these places know it too. So many times you will see whatever amount the corkage that was to be charged added to the tip when that fee was waived. Now on the other side of the coin, people who BYO need to realize that no place wants them bringing in _"$2-Chuck"_ expecting to get free corkage. It's also very common to see corkage fees waived when another bottle is bought off the list. I often get fees waived by offering the Chef, Sommelier and/or server a taste.

These glasses all have different purposes, and give you best specific experience for the wine:

   

Trust me, I'm not making this stuff up. LOL.


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Well, yes it's common knowledge that certain wines "favour' certain wine glass shapes.

Liquor laws are kinda funny here and you need (or used to) have a certain kind of license for byob.  Don't know about now.

I don't have a problem with byob provided, as Pete says, you call in advance, and I would charge a corkage fee too.  I would politely refuse to wash your glasses, as they are expensive and much more delicate than regular commercial stemware.

Heck, if you're gonna bring a 160 bucks worth of stemware, then you're probably gonna bring at least a 150 buck bottle, and that means you're gonna blow at least 100 on food, so I don't mind, not at all.

But that's wine.

But the guy who brings his own plate and cutlery, and his own meat to  a restaurant... That's asking for trouble.  Dude's already made up his mind that your place sucks and he'll be whining and moaning like shot bearings in a power steering pump all evening.  Dude's got to ask himself why he's even out of his home in the first place. 

Snausages?  Did you want to interject here?


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## siduri (Aug 13, 2006)

Snausages, if you're pulling our leg, then ok. But I think the question is *not* whether or not there is more risk of germs with your own dishes than with the restaurant ones. It's that you're AFRAID there will be, and maybe the business of the germs is just a justification you do by reasoning after the fact - you feel safer with your dishes, and no amount of reasoning is going to change that. Same with chicken, if you carry it in a plastic bag even on ice, you are obviously getting a greater risk of it going bad than if it is maintained in the restaurant's refrigerator. But this is all irrelevant. It makes you FEEL safer.

The problem is anxiety and the solution for the anxiety is your own familiar dishes. Anxiety is fear, fear is a feeling and we can be afraid without any "actual" or "real" threat. The danger may not be objectively real, but the fear IS REAL. So if this makes you less afraid who are we to say otherwise. You know what reassures you, and if you can get away with it, fine.

The thing that worries me, snausages, is that you seem to be unaware that nobody else is doing this. You can do what you want and you may get away with it. It may salve your fears and that's fine. You may not care if they think it's funny or not. You may not CARE what others are doing. But do you really not SEE that the other customers are not *actually* carting all their dishes and food to a restaurant? It IS unusual. I never saw it in my life, except perhaps the person with the mug, wanting to carry coffee home in his own, perhaps thermal container. So if you can get away with it, that's fine, but do you really have to ask us if anyone else is doing the same thing? Do you see anyone else carrying dishes and chickens into a restaurant?


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## dc sunshine (Feb 26, 2007)

I can't believe this is a serious post. The OP sounds completely OCD. To whit, the plates and glasses are in the trunk of the car - what happens if food poisoning happens ? Is the restaurant liable because OP has brought their own gear with them? I cannot envision that very many places would agree to this, or wether its allowable by the laws of the local area there.

Their friends must be remarkably tolerant. I wouldn't put up with such a fuss. i also wonder if the OP takes their own gear to said friend's places - personally, I would see this as an insult in that situation.

As for bringing your own ingredients /img/vbsmilies/smilies/eek.gif no restaurant would or should allow it. Many many reasons for that, as listed by others above. You want to take it to a friends place and they are happy with it - fair enough if they agree. Still could be issues there.

I think it must be April Fool's day......snausages - your friend has a very valid point.


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## ishbel (Jan 5, 2007)

If this poster is not just yanking our collective chains...

I would suggest that you always eat in your own home - prepare all the food, wash the dishes etc yourself.  That way, you will at least convince yourself that your meal will be germ-free.


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

I strongly suggest you see a doctor and discuss your  phobia and other mental problems problem. Please if you vacation in Florida do not come in to our place.


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## abefroman (Mar 12, 2005)

Does he keep the meat in his trunk as well?


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## pete (Oct 7, 2001)

Iceman, while I will agree that different glasses can make subtle differences in the taste of wine, it doesn't offer that much in the way of changing the flavor profile and I stand by that.


> I'm also not telling you that you are wrong so much, but to say that I think your thoughts would be different if you had better wine experience.


Since you don't know me, I won't take offense to that but I will let you know that I have worked in some of the best restaurants in Atlanta, Chicago and New Orleans, studied with a number of very knowledge wine instructors at culinary school (ages ago), and was part of many, many tasting sessions at the Beverage Tasting Institute while living in Chicago (if you are not familiar with them then look them up) where I tasted and rated many wines, beers and liquors. So I feel I am very qualified to speak and give my opinion about wine.


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## snausages (Jan 21, 2011)

Too many posts to reply to individually, but let me just reiterate the point that it's not _just_ about germs - it's about sharing things that other people have used so many times before.

Also, I don't expect a discount for bringing my own ingredients - I'll happily pay menu price. I wouldn't even mind paying extra for bringing my own dinnerware, though no restaurant has requested that I do so.


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## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

snausages said:


> Too many posts to reply to individually, but let me just reiterate the point that it's not _just_ about germs - it's about sharing things that other people have used so many times before.


 If that's not about germs then I don't understand what it's about. If something has been cleaned it is clean no matter who has used it before.


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## chefbillyb (Feb 8, 2009)

I don't know if you are welcome at a lot of restaurants, but you would fit right in at any tailgate party..................May as well pack a BBQ in that trunk, some of those grills are a bit dirty..........................ChefBillyB....................Super Bowl.................Jets/Green Bay


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

_*Pete,*_ I tried to phrase my post as politely and ac PC as I possibly could. If I wanted to be offensive I would have said things much differently.

Quote:


> Since you don't know me, I won't take offense to that ...............


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## abefroman (Mar 12, 2005)

ChefBillyB said:


> I don't know if you are welcome at a lot of restaurants, but you would fit right in at any tailgate party..................May as well pack a BBQ in that trunk, some of those grills are a bit dirty..........................ChefBillyB....................Super Bowl.................Jets/Green Bay


You mean Jets/Chicago


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## snausages (Jan 21, 2011)

I'm just very particular about 'MY THINGS'. I absolutely try to avoid things which have been used by another person before, whenever possible. I'll only buy brand new cars, or live in new-build units, wear shirts one time, etc. I keep separate dishes and silverware in my kitchen for myself, and have other sets that guests can use.



Koukouvagia said:


> snausages said:
> 
> 
> > Too many posts to reply to individually, but let me just reiterate the point that it's not _just_ about germs - it's about sharing things that other people have used so many times before.
> ...


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

_*I was going to say the same thing, but I've got enough guys jumping down my throat already. *_



abefroman said:


> You mean Jets/Chicago


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## abefroman (Mar 12, 2005)

You need to watch What About Bob?



snausages said:


> I'm just very particular about 'MY THINGS'. I absolutely try to avoid things which have been used by another person before, whenever possible. I'll only buy brand new cars, or live in new-build units, wear shirts one time, etc. I keep separate dishes and silverware in my kitchen for myself, and have other sets that guests can use.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## petemccracken (Sep 18, 2008)

snausages said:


> Too many posts to reply to individually, but let me just reiterate the point that it's not _just_ about germs - it's about sharing things that other people have used so many times before...


If the reuse of items is your concern, then simply use only disposable (single use) items, i.e. plastic, paper, take-out containers, etc. Voilà, the problem is solved!

And this solution is much more socially acceptable as well.

With regards to "old inventory", think about this for a moment. The steak you want to bring yourself can only be guaranteed "fresh" if you, personally, slaughtered and butchered the animal in the first place. Otherwise, you have absolutely no idea how "old" it might be.


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## abefroman (Mar 12, 2005)

PeteMcCracken said:


> snausages said:
> 
> 
> > Too many posts to reply to individually, but let me just reiterate the point that it's not _just_ about germs - it's about sharing things that other people have used so many times before...
> ...


Maybe behind his car, he tows a trailer, with a cow, pig, a couple chickens, fish tank, etc.


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## siduri (Aug 13, 2006)

Fears like this are not accessible to rational arguments - no point trying.  Just try to tell anyone with a phobia there's no need to be afraid.  We're very subject to fear - since it's always safer to be afraid than not to be afraid.  These things get lodged in parts of the brain where fear is very hard to dislodge. 

What seems strange is that the restaurants go along with it, and that you don't notice that you;re the only one doing this. 

If it's a joke, well, not a very good one - it;s not such a far stretch to believe it, so not very funny.


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## chefbillyb (Feb 8, 2009)

IceMan said:


> _*I was going to say the same thing, but I've got enough guys jumping down my throat already. *_
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You will both be eating Chicago style dogs at the beginning of the game, but in the end you will be eating Wisconsin Cheddar Cheese.............Green Bay 32 ..Chicago 10


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

What makes you think your silver or plates are cleaner then restaurants?  Like Pete says use disposable (Like Kosher)

In addition how do you go to theater, movie restauranst etc. as someone has sat in the chair before you.  If you breathe, someone else has also into the same room. How do you take a plane, or train or for that matter anything, even the shoes you wear came from something else that was alive. When you stay in a hotel do you bring your own bed? Give us all a break.


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## snausages (Jan 21, 2011)

chefedb said:


> What makes you think your silver or plates are cleaner then restaurants? Like Pete says use disposable (Like Kosher)
> 
> In addition how do you go to theater, movie restauranst etc. as someone has sat in the chair before you. If you breathe, someone else has also into the same room. How do you take a plane, or train or for that matter anything, even the shoes you wear came from something else that was alive. When you stay in a hotel do you bring your own bed? Give us all a break.


I do need to factor these things into my daily behavior - for example, I don't visit movie theaters, etc. When I need to travel, I only fly first class and bring my own cotton-linen seat cover on the plane.

To reiterate, it's not only about the cleanliness of the plates, but rather I prefer to not use communal wares when dining.

When I stay in hotels, I make sure they have at least 4.5 star rating and I do bring my own linens to use on the beds (I know these types of hotels use Frette linens or above, which is a nice attempt, I simply prefer better).


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## dc sunshine (Feb 26, 2007)

chefedb said:


> What makes you think your silver or plates are cleaner then restaurants? Like Pete says use disposable (Like Kosher)
> 
> In addition how do you go to theater, movie restauranst etc. as someone has sat in the chair before you. If you breathe, someone else has also into the same room. How do you take a plane, or train or for that matter anything, even the shoes you wear came from something else that was alive. When you stay in a hotel do you bring your own bed? Give us all a break.


Well said Ed. This poster has a phobia which needs attending to, as I believe it will only get worse. Does the OP bring their own pavement to walk on as well?

Snausages,

If this is all for real, please at least talk to your GP about it. They may well be able to point you in the direction of a therapist who can help. Or at least talk to a friend or family member whom you can trust and feel comfortable tqlking about, well, let's call it what it is, an obsession.

I hope we are not acting as subjects of a Psychology study here. I reckon we've done enough. Forgive the cynic in me.


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## katbalou (Nov 21, 2001)

reminds me of Jack Nicholson in "As Good As It Gets"


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## chrisbelgium (Oct 2, 2010)

Hilarious thread, Snausages! Thank you for this humoristic contribution.

How about we started a list of accessoires you absolutely cannot do without? I'll start;


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## chefedb (Apr 3, 2010)

DCSunshine '''Good Points   I also feel sorry for him as he can't date or have a partner as they previosly have most likely dated others.prior to him.


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## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

Snausages, why don't we start over?  We welcome new members to this forum and those of us who frequent the site get to know eachother in a culinary sense.  However I'm not sure we need to know all these personal things about you.  Your quirks about restaurants gave us plenty to talk about, but there's no need to go into more detailed parts of other aspects of your life.  I'm sure you would agree with all of us that you have some personal psychological issues that may need attending to, but none of us are qualified to address these issues or comment on them further than what we have.  I fear that we are collectively getting mean spirited in a way our threads never do around here.  Your behavior is none of our business, I hope you find a way to cope with your symptoms so that you can function better within your social environment.

Now, on to more important things.  Do you like to cook?  If so what are your specialties, we would love to hear about what you've been cooking and would be happy to have discussions with you about recipes or other culinary topics.


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## trooper (Jan 21, 2011)

I guess I'm guilty of bringing my own wine glasses - but only because we went to the same place twice-three times a week, we knew the owner well and he was a small operation. He didn't mind keeping our stems for us. We would also order by the bottle, so there was never a question of exploiting glass pours. The staff would break one of our glasses at least every other month, and they would also use them for other VIP customers from time to time. We just ended up "donating" ten of our stems to him - he had room at the bar and something else to market, we always got excellent service and everyone was happy with the deal. I would never think of walking into an Elephant Bar or Carraba's or Cheesecake Factory and expecting the same thing - But only because I'm aware of what really goes on back there.

If you are seriously bringing dishes and are that paranoid - yes: get help. and yes: Find the two mom&pop places in your town that will allow that, and just eat there.

So - I have admitted that not only do I bring my own tasting spoon to high-end places, but I have also left stems there as well. I guess I should show up with some dutch ovens and copper saute pans now, eh?


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## indianwells (Jan 2, 2007)

This is a wind up surely?


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## dc sunshine (Feb 26, 2007)

I'll echo what Koukouvagia posted.  We are here to help -  only you can get over your issues.

As KKV said - do you like to cook?  plenty of discussions here that you could join into.

What sort of cuisines do you prefer?  i.e. French, Asian, Moroccan etc.  There's more than likely to be many people here who will enjoy discussing any and all aspects of cooking


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## gonefishin (Nov 6, 2004)

Welcome Snausages!

     I wouldn't attempt this or feel a need to try to bring my old plates etc to a restaurant. But if you're able to do this with little or no grief...I say do what you need to do.  However, I would try to tolerate more places, if you're able. 

  Be good,

   dan


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## mmecyn (Jan 31, 2011)

Oh my. Considering one of my favorite places to eat is a dive in rural Japan where you are practically guaranteeed to see a roach running across the dining room in midsummer, I find the OP highly amusing, Clearly I'm a total food philistine (though I'm never sick). Thanks for the giggle.


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## jim berman (Oct 28, 1999)

Very Andy Kaufman-esque! Cotton-lined toilet seat covers on the plane?!


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## phaedrus (Dec 23, 2004)

snausages said:


> I keep a set of dinnerware in the trunk of my car - plates, silverware, glassware, and disposable napkins - for use at every restaurant I visit. I just don't feel comfortable using the pieces they provide, which have been used by hundreds of patrons before me.


At my restaurant we got a 95/100 on our last health inspection. How did your car's trunk score?


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## shroomgirl (Aug 11, 2000)

Julia Butterfly Hill brought a canning jar (glass), chop sticks and a cloth napkin to lunch.....it was  more environmental than germ based....thought it was kinda cool 6 years ago.


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## french fries (Sep 5, 2008)

shroomgirl said:


> Julia Butterfly Hill brought a canning jar (glass), chop sticks and a cloth napkin to lunch.....it was more environmental than germ based....thought it was kinda cool 6 years ago.


But then again, she's a vegan who lives in a tree. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/lol.gif

Seriously, is the canning jar for taking home leftovers? I've always been appalled at the insane amount of foam/plastic/cardboard containers etc.. restaurants use for take away, deliveries, doggy bags etc...


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

OK. Just in case anyone needs to know, or is the least bit interested in who _Julia Butterfly Hill_ is, here's her story:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_Butterfly_Hill


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## shroomgirl (Aug 11, 2000)

Julia came through STL for Venus Envy Event several years ago....since I was catering the opener (fun sexy menu) the board asked me to join them for (raw) lunch at Cardwells @ the Plaza...the chef d' cuisine at the time was Dave Owens (veg head) and on the board of MO's chef collaborative with me.  Julia did not make a big deal about it, she just preferred using her jar to drink from and the chopsticks instead of silverware.   Not showy at all. Just what she chose to do. 

Since then I use a wide mouth pint jar as my default coffee cup, works well...


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## brianshaw (Dec 18, 2010)

I can't tell if this is a punking, a cry for help, or what.

But I can relate in one way.  I get totally disgusted when I find someone elses lipstick on a water glass but trust in an establishment's cleaniliness by requesting a replacement.

What is quite disgusting is to find baked on egg/cheese on a fork, or unidentifiable "whatever" on a spoon.  I get really annoyed when I find bent tines on a fork, but I can (and do) correct that prior to use.  Another pet peave is the really cheap and flimsy fork/knife that many "budget" eateries use.  Oh, I also hate the three-tine forks that some places seem to think are chic.  For that reason I've thought about discreetly bringing my own flatware to a restaurant... but I haven't done so yet.


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## siduri (Aug 13, 2006)

shroomgirl said:


> Julia came through STL for Venus Envy Event several years ago....since I was catering the opener (fun sexy menu) the board asked me to join them for (raw) lunch at Cardwells @ the Plaza...the chef d' cuisine at the time was Dave Owens (veg head) and on the board of MO's chef collaborative with me. Julia did not make a big deal about it, she just preferred using her jar to drink from and the chopsticks instead of silverware. Not showy at all. Just what she chose to do.
> 
> Since then I use a wide mouth pint jar as my default coffee cup, works well...


I don't understand - why is a jar better than a cup or a glass? am i missing something? in what way is it better?


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## Iceman (Jan 4, 2011)

It think _"it's better"_ because it's _"her choice"_. If you are making a choice of your own, you make your own _best_ choice. Whatever her reasons are, maybe she just likes drinking out of a jar.


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## koukouvagia (Apr 3, 2008)

BrianShaw said:


> I can't tell if this is a punking, a cry for help, or what.
> 
> But I can relate in one way. I get totally disgusted when I find someone elses lipstick on a water glass but trust in an establishment's cleaniliness by requesting a replacement.
> 
> What is quite disgusting is to find baked on egg/cheese on a fork, or unidentifiable "whatever" on a spoon. I get really annoyed when I find bent tines on a fork, but I can (and do) correct that prior to use. Another pet peave is the really cheap and flimsy fork/knife that many "budget" eateries use. Oh, I also hate the three-tine forks that some places seem to think are chic. For that reason I've thought about discreetly bringing my own flatware to a restaurant... but I haven't done so yet.


I agree but all of those things happen without intent of bad sanitary practices I'm afraid. There's some compound in lipstick that makes it nearly impossible for a dishwasher to remove in most cases.

And how many times have we opened our dishwashers to find stuck on food on utensils simply because they were placed improperly in the dishwasher? Of course in my house I check each and every dish when it comes out of the dishwasher for that reason. It would be nice if restaurants did the same but there might be some lazy guy back there not checking the dishes. But still, you'd think that someone would have caught it at some point - the person unloading the dishes, the person setting the place settings, or the server all have chosen to overlook it. It's laziness.

Oooooh I hate those three tined forks too!


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## trooper (Jan 21, 2011)

Quote:


Koukouvagia said:


> BrianShaw said:
> 
> 
> > I can't tell if this is a punking, a cry for help, or what.
> ...


I've sent entire plate and glass racks back to dish because of crap like this. Nothing more frustrating than being in the weeds, pulling a plate - and seeing filth on it... then another, then another...

"DISH! Take every Effing Plate off my station NOW and RE-WASH IT, NOW!"

Only takes one of those meltdowns to get everyone focused. If it was my kitchen, I'd throw the damn plates at the wall above the 3-sink. There is no excuse for half-assing a job.

The only thing worse than that is when servers don't check their place settings. If a server hands me a dirty plate or glass It really P*sses me off.


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## breadmaker man (Jan 25, 2011)

Your friend is right. It's really, really odd. Surely any half decent restaurant will be washing the plates and cutlery in a fashion that would eliminate any germs.


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