# Keeping your restaurant and staff during the global crisis



## nicko (Oct 5, 2001)

Here in Chicago the governor has closed all restaurant and bars for dine in. Restaurants are allowed to provide pickup and delivery options which is helping to keep restaurants afloat. However fine dining restaurants like Alinea who employee many people have no option and it is has been reported that the restaurant group has had to refund over 300,000 in Tok reservations. 

My wife and I are opting instead of hoarding food from the grocery stores to support our local restaurants and purchase carry out / take away. I sincerely hope that all of the culinary professionals here are able to keep their restaurants going to some degree and that people will see the need to support their local restaurants. This discussion thread is to discuss ideas of how your keeping your restaurant and staff during this challenging time.


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## halb (May 25, 2015)

nicko said:


> My wife and I are opting instead of hoarding food from the grocery stores to support our local restaurants and purchase carry out / take away.


That suggestion has been made locally here on social media. Everybody is encouraged to purchase take-out twice a week.

Truly sad though is that everyone prepped for St.Patrick's day before the closings were ordered. One pub/restaurant is giving away corned beef and cabbage dinners until they run out. Hopefully customers will want Guinness to go with it.

Another said that they are stuck with 400 lbs of corned beef.


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## phaedrus (Dec 23, 2004)

I wish I had good ideas to offer. There's been no coherent Federal response, just a patchwork array of state and local efforts. In Bozeman, MT where I live there's been little change in operations (circa 3.17.2020, natch). The Walmart store is reportedly changing from 24/7 to 8 am to 10 pm I think and grocery stores are slightly curtailing hours of operations but so far I haven't seen restaurant hours changing but it will likely happen.


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## phaedrus (Dec 23, 2004)

Okay, all the restaurants in Bozeman have been ordered closed through March 24th. This order doesn't apply to the cafe at MSU since it's the only source of meals for the students.


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## seabeecook (Aug 23, 2008)




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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

Once again we have people (the government) telling privately owned business what to do and what's best for them without any first hand knowledge of how it will affect things. It's easy to sign a piece of paper and tell all the bars and restaurants to close or try and survive on take out orders but in reality a large portion of workers will be laid off and many businesses will be closed forever. 

I would think more people getting exposed to build antibodies would be a good thing. We can't close down the world every year for half of it because some people may die. And I do not see any of the data to support this being more deadly than the flu. You can look up official flu statistics and extrapolate potential numbers for covid-19. I know there is a lot of unknown but the simple fact that it is not killing off babies, young kids, pregnant women or 20-30's plus being admitted that an estimated 80% will self resolve just does not support the mania. Until there is evidence presented of perfectly healthy people and children without any preexisting conditions or diseases dropping dead, I will keep an objective look at this all. 

All we will get from this several months from now is a lot of unemployed people, closed businesses, a recession and the nation's children behind in schooling even more and the politicians from all sides will pat themselves on the back and go back to being useless.

I would love to support small business by going out several times a week but I simply cannot afford it, as I am sure many others are in the same position. I just hope we as an industry and survive this. One reason I went into culinary was because I always thought I would have a job and thankfully I still do but I feel for all the people out there who are not as fortunate.


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## jcakes (Feb 18, 2007)

By your numbers, the 20% that can't self-resolve (due to advanced age, pre-existing conditions such as diabetes, or a compromised immune system - such as those recovering from chemo) can't be treated at a hospital because those numbers would overwhelm the hospitals and medical facilities and as a result, die. I hope you have no loved ones in those categories because if you do, you should say good bye to them now.


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## chefpeon (Jun 14, 2006)

@Seoul Food, are you an epidemiologist? Epidemiologists do not share your opinion that this is no big deal. Perhaps you'd like to go on an epidemiologist's forum and share your opinion. Meanwhile, I don't think sharing your "nothing-to-see-here" rhetoric is very responsible. Our industry is going to suffer the fallout from this for years and I share your frustration in that regard. But I think listening to the people who REALLY know what they're talking about and keeping people safe is our first priority.


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## someday (Aug 15, 2003)

Seoul Food said:


> Once again we have people (the government) telling privately owned business what to do and what's best for them without any first hand knowledge of how it will affect things. It's easy to sign a piece of paper and tell all the bars and restaurants to close or try and survive on take out orders but in reality a large portion of workers will be laid off and many businesses will be closed forever.
> 
> I would think more people getting exposed to build antibodies would be a good thing. We can't close down the world every year for half of it because some people may die. And I do not see any of the data to support this being more deadly than the flu. You can look up official flu statistics and extrapolate potential numbers for covid-19. I know there is a lot of unknown but the simple fact that it is not killing off babies, young kids, pregnant women or 20-30's plus being admitted that an estimated 80% will self resolve just does not support the mania. Until there is evidence presented of perfectly healthy people and children without any preexisting conditions or diseases dropping dead, I will keep an objective look at this all.
> 
> ...


What an absolute joke of a post.

Explain to me where you get your information from, and also where you got your medical degree or advanced biology/virology/epidemiology degree? You're throwing a lot of info out there that most (indeed, every one that I've heard/read) experts disagree with.

The danger isn't just to one's self, the danger is spreading it around a society to people who may not be able to fight of the virus on their own (i.e. immunocompromised people, the elderly). A person may show only mild or no symptoms and still transmit it to a large number of people.

Here in the US, testing started late and is, to my understanding, still woefully inadequate. So while the number might look "low" to someone like yourself, the reality is there are likely thousands upon thousands of cases not being tested for and/or reported. If those undertested or asymptomatic people expose themselves to others, then the numbers go up exponentially from there. I certainly hope no one you know is in a vulnerable condition and catches the virus.

The reason this is probably going to be worse than the flu is that there currently is no vaccine, and the virus spreads easier than the flu. And while you are correct (at least according to the current statistics) that the novel coronavirus has a relatively low death rate (compared to things like ebola, etc) it is still higher than the flu. Even at a 1% death rate, that is 10x more deadly than the flu (0.1% death rate for flu). And I will further stipulate that the overall death % is likely to fall even more, since there is VAST under-reporting and under-testing currently in the US.

The bottom line is, if we do the right things right now, then in 6-12 months the pandemic might look "overblown" or whatever word you choose. But it's the chicken and the egg...was the outbreak not a big deal because the media overblew it and caused a panic, or was it "not a big deal" because the country locked down and stemmed the bleeding. We may never know, even with the benefit of hindsight, but I'd rather we be cautious and save lives than be wrong and make it worse.


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## phaedrus (Dec 23, 2004)

I think we're doing the right thing to close public spaces even if it causes some pain- better that than to see the US go down like Italy. That said, if the govt is forcing businesses to close then the govt (and by that I mean We the People) should help to keep those businesses afloat. That will mean a 'bailout' of some kind. I don't see it as a moral hazard issue as the restaurants are complying for the public good. It's only right that we use every fiscal tool to keep things working. What is the point of civilization if it doesn't pull together to help everyone when it's needed most?


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

someday said:


> What an absolute joke of a post.
> 
> Explain to me where you get your information from, and also where you got your medical degree or advanced biology/virology/epidemiology degree? You're throwing a lot of info out there that most (indeed, every one that I've heard/read) experts disagree with.
> 
> ...


You're welcome to your opinion as am I but you have no data to back up your claims. The reasons you are stating for avoidance to demographics at risk are the exact same people who would be in the same position during any flu season. Not having a vaccine is not the deciding factor when you consider how many people do not get shots each year on top of the number of cases that the vaccine was not effective against. You are yourself stating that there are many more cases out there than reported which would reduce your imaginary number of death rate even lower. The simple fat of the matter is even if people in danger demographics are more likely to die from complications from covid-19, there is still a huge portion of the population that have not been showing up in the fatalities. Simply being more deadly to one group does not make the disease overall more deadly. The data just does not support the reaction currently and anyone with any level of independent critical thinking can see that. If this is indeed so bad then show us the data supporting that, we can't just grind the world to a halt and instill fear in the world simply because it "may" get worse. It's an impossible task because there will be no way to quantify how much of an impact these shut downs had, and the majority of people that contracted it without complications will have better immune systems. If you don't have a problem with governments shutting down everyone's lives and imposing unilateral mandates that is up to you.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

jcakes said:


> By your numbers, the 20% that can't self-resolve (due to advanced age, pre-existing conditions such as diabetes, or a compromised immune system - such as those recovering from chemo) can't be treated at a hospital because those numbers would overwhelm the hospitals and medical facilities and as a result, die. I hope you have no loved ones in those categories because if you do, you should say good bye to them now.


Two issues there. One, these are the same people who would be in similar circumstances any flu season. Two, if people (social media, news, ect) didn't blow this so out of proportion all day every day people who really have no risk of dying from this wouldn't be flooding the health care systems.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

chefpeon said:


> @Seoul Food, are you an epidemiologist? Epidemiologists do not share your opinion that this is no big deal. Perhaps you'd like to go on an epidemiologist's forum and share your opinion. Meanwhile, I don't think sharing your "nothing-to-see-here" rhetoric is very responsible. Our industry is going to suffer the fallout from this for years and I share your frustration in that regard. But I think listening to the people who REALLY know what they're talking about and keeping people safe is our first priority.


I never claimed to be one. I am stating that in my opinion this is a vast overreaction and overreach to a mild problem. All I am asking for is more data, we are making huge long lasting decisions based on what we think may or may not happen to something we don't have a lot of data on. What I believe is irresponsible is just blindly assuming we are being fed nothing but the truth and to not think on our own. They shut everything down here for ONE confirmed case that was later admitted to be a community transfer. So for weeks everyone was going about their business and people were magically not dropping dead on the streets. Is it a real risk for certain demographics? Yes. Is it unfortunate when anyone dies from this? Yes. But the fact is based on data you can easily access yourself without being told from a new station is that as of now the flu is still more deadly and no one bats an eye each year about that. Will covid-19 be more deadly in a year when numbers are being crunched? Maybe, but we need to expect more from ourselves and our government than just having these blanket reactions to everything.


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## chefpeon (Jun 14, 2006)

It will be interesting to come back to this post in a few months. Hope you don't have to eat crow, but perhaps you should research some ways to cook it.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. I'm not stating that my position will never change or that my opinion is the final word, only the issues of wanting more data and currently viewing the reaction versus the reality to be disproportionate. I have many elderly family and would not want them to get sick obviously, I just think we all can have an opinion and shutting down any questions that reference the other implications (other than health) resulting in this is not a good way for open discourse.


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## chefpeon (Jun 14, 2006)

Seoul Food said:


> If I'm wrong, I'm wrong. I'm not stating that my position will never change or that my opinion is the final word, only the issues of wanting more data and currently viewing the reaction versus the reality to be disproportionate. I have many elderly family and would not want them to get sick obviously, I just think we all can have an opinion and shutting down any questions that reference the other implications (other than health) resulting in this is not a good way for open discourse.


Yeah, except you seem to be rejecting and discounting the reports and advice of EXPERTS in their fields to make your points. I don't know exactly what it is that YOU'RE reading, but everything I'm reading points to the fact that your opinions could be based on what the fringe element wants you to believe.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

Just because a professional in a given field states something as fact doesn't make it so. There are thousands of deaths each year from misdiagnosis from your "experts". Again you state that everything you believe and read/hear is the gospel and anything contradictory to that is flat out wrong. Unlike you I never stated that you were wrong and I was right, and again you aren't even referencing any data. You can look up the information yourself from the CDC, WHO and various other organizations compiling this data. Statistically the numbers do not justify the reaction as of yet. I actually work in elder care here in NY and have family that are medial professionals in hospitals as we speak. They are dealing with it every day and not seeing the doom and gloom that is being pushed on us. The biggest concern is going to be the lack of workers and medical supplies as we go into this. There is no new alarming rate of kids or young healthy adults contracting this and dying. So once again unless you and point to some compelling data based evidence of this happening, then if one looks at past pandemics we have faced you can draw your own conclusions about how severe it is.


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## chefpeon (Jun 14, 2006)

Wow dude. Why is it that you think you're right and everyone else, including the epidemiologists that are sounding the alarms about this (because there is NO leadership or game plan at the federal level), is mistaken? Again, I would say you need to hop on to an epidemiologist's forum and set them straight. I'm sure they'll listen to you. So do you think this is the ultimate prank on the world by disgruntled scientists? Do you even see what is happening in Italy? Your rhetoric, truly, is totally offensive and irresponsible. It doesn't belong here, and it doesn't belong anywhere.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

chefpeon said:


> Wow dude. Why is it that you think you're right and everyone else, including the epidemiologists that are sounding the alarms about this (because there is NO leadership or game plan at the federal level), is mistaken? Again, I would say you need to hop on to an epidemiologist's forum and set them straight. I'm sure they'll listen to you. So do you think this is the ultimate prank on the world by disgruntled scientists? Do you even see what is happening in Italy? Your rhetoric, truly, is totally offensive and irresponsible. It doesn't belong here, and it doesn't belong anywhere.


You can't have it both ways. You can't say there is no leadership at the Federal level when they are doing daily briefings with your beloved "experts" and then say to believe all the experts. You can't cite Italy as some magic model we should be looking at for comparison to the US without taking into account the variables going on in Italy, all the while completely ignoring the data from places like Japan and South Korea because it doesn't fit your doom and gloom attitude. Since you want to keep using Italy as some magic example, it along with China are two countries that put into place mandatory shut downs and forcing people home. Guess what?> They have the highest deaths and mortality percentages currently. No one is claiming this is a prank, only a over reaction to a possible issues touted by the same people who's job it is to oversee this type of thing. So before you go around with your high and mighty attitude trying to put down anyone with a differing opinion than yours, why don't you cite some ACTUAL DATA that states CONCLUSIVELY that millions of people are going to die if we don't shut down the whole world and give over unprecedented powers to governments and agencies. If at that time you can produce such data I would be more than happy to debate these points with you but I wont' debate your "feelings" on the matter. In the end I may be wrong but the truly offensive and irresponsible thing is your totalitarian outlook on differing opnions.


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## cheflayne (Aug 21, 2004)

nicko said:


> This discussion thread is to discuss ideas of how your keeping your restaurant and staff during this challenging time.


This thread has gone far far far sideways from the original intent. I would suggest taking deep breaths and looking for solutions rather than espousing personal points of view and "right". Offer restaurant deep cleaning hours to all staff that would wish to participate. Doing this would also make good use of the previously pulled out soap boxes that some responders jumped on.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

cheflayne said:


> This thread has gone far far far sideways from the original intent. I would suggest taking deep breaths and looking for solutions rather than espousing personal points of view and "right". Offer restaurant deep cleaning hours to all staff that would wish to participate. Doing this would also make good use of the previously pulled out soap boxes that some responders jumped on.


There is still a grey area here for that as a lot of restaurants don't know if they will be allowed to stay open even for take out orders with the ban on non-essential works from leaving their homes. I know a few guys I use to work with finally saved up enough to buy the business from the boss but now they're having some difficulties. I know for my company we are putting the word out to hire as many temp jobs to try and fill our needs for the eventual drop in labor force and to try and keep some people employed. I hope other local businesses that are deemed essential will do the same.


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## foodpump (Oct 10, 2005)

Gentlemen, if I may interrupt this with “stuff” that is happening “up north” Ie Canada.

Mandatory testing found one “corrections officer” ( jail guard) positive, that jail is bracing for the sh*t storm that will come. Suffice to say the prison hospital won’t be able to handle that kind of an outbreak. 

Our indigenous leaders and chiefs have severe knots in their knickers, since most if not all, reserves suffer from overcrowding and really crappy water supply. Should a reserve become infected, our medical system can not handle this.

Locally, two seniors from the same care facility have died,, 10 days apart, and as a result all senior’s homes and care facilities are in a lockdown mode..

According to the last news, the Italians have stopped counting their dead, albeit with 14 dead doctors so far.

And yes, our government is spending their way out of this, but I’m really worried that after this, say a year from now we suffer a natural disaster, and there’s no money left to spend our way out of it.

Having run my own business for close to 20 years, I know what kind of treatment we( small businesses) got from the municipal, provincial, and federal govts., The airlines, hotels, ski resorts, and other large parts of the hospitality industry will get bailouts, the small ones will get what they’ve been getting— nothing but the back of a large hand, and the usual demand of generating and collecting 4 separate taxes for these various govts.

The franchises will behave like franchises and fob off any financial burden on the franchisees, the smaller businesses who can remain flexible and creative ( the anti-theme of franchises) AND somehow make a buck without liquor sales will survive.

It’s all very sobering...


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## phaedrus (Dec 23, 2004)

I think this pandemic will require new ways of thinking about the types of social, economic and government systems we use. All have been found lacking so far. We may need a new way forward.


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## nicko (Oct 5, 2001)

Wrong topic guys. This is a topic on how to keep your staff during this crisis not your political opinion. Please respect the topic. Things I am seeing here in Illinois is:


many restaurants have converted to take out
creating new menus to accommodated this.
Not charging first res ponders for food or providing a deep discount.
Feeding their staff.
Selling gift cards to long time customers to generate income to pay staff.

SO.... WHAT ARE YOU DOING TO KEEP YOUR STAFF. No comments bout what the government is doing WHAT ARE YOU DOING?


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## cheflayne (Aug 21, 2004)

nicko said:


> Selling gift cards to long time customers to generate income to pay staff.


This is a great avenue that I hadn't considered


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## halb (May 25, 2015)

Might be nice to offer a free daily meal to any of your staff that you had to lay off. You know it's going to be hard to live for them without a pay check.


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## phaedrus (Dec 23, 2004)

nicko said:


> SO.... WHAT ARE YOU DOING TO KEEP YOUR STAFF. No comments bout what the government is doing WHAT ARE YOU DOING?


I'm working from home. We're locked out til the crisis passes.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

nicko said:


> Wrong topic guys. This is a topic on how to keep your staff during this crisis not your political opinion. Please respect the topic. Things I am seeing here in Illinois is:
> 
> 
> many restaurants have converted to take out
> ...


Again we are kinda going the opposite direction as most restaurant business and hiring a slew of temp displaced workers. We have the opposite problems being in health care, we are going to be short on staff not customer cash flow.

A lot of people have been talking about the gift card thing and a lot of locals have already been dong it but stores are actually running out of them, so not sure how long that will last.

I think what actions individual operations can or are taking will also depend if they are even allowed to be open now or in a few weeks. Best laid efforts to help your staff and community along may be a mute point, as places here are already being forced to close.


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## pete (Oct 7, 2001)

Seoul Food said:


> Once again we have people (the government) telling privately owned business what to do and what's best for them without any first hand knowledge of how it will affect things. It's easy to sign a piece of paper and tell all the bars and restaurants to close or try and survive on take out orders but in reality a large portion of workers will be laid off and many businesses will be closed forever.
> 
> I would think more people getting exposed to build antibodies would be a good thing. We can't close down the world every year for half of it because some people may die. And I do not see any of the data to support this being more deadly than the flu. You can look up official flu statistics and extrapolate potential numbers for covid-19. I know there is a lot of unknown but the simple fact that it is not killing off babies, young kids, pregnant women or 20-30's plus being admitted that an estimated 80% will self resolve just does not support the mania. Until there is evidence presented of perfectly healthy people and children without any preexisting conditions or diseases dropping dead, I will keep an objective look at this all.
> 
> ...


If you want a bit of data here's a bit for that I posted to FB the other day. Many people have been using the H1N1 outbreak of 2009 to compare this to to rationalize their beliefs that this is blown out of proportion, but it actually shows something very different. As of 3/20 there were 15,219 cases of COVID-19 and 201 deaths (yes these numbers have changed since then). The numbers usually used for the 2009 H1N1 outbreak are 60.8 million cases and 12,469. That puts the mortality rate of COVID-19 at 1.3% and the mortality rate of H1N1 at .02%. That makes COVID-19 65 times more deadly than H1N1. If COVID-19 infections reach the number of supposed H1N1 infections in 2009 that means we could, potentially have 790,000 deaths from this. Of course, because we have taken action I highly doubt that we will see 60 million cases, but if we hadn't then this could have been a real outcome considering that this virus spreads as easily as the flu.

Yes, the mortality rate will drop with more people getting tested and testing positive, but by how much? And if hospitals become overburdened with patients, how many people that would have survived with minor intervention will end up dying?

And yes, this hits home for me. I personally know someone that lost his life to COVID-19 this past week. I'm not going to say that we were friends, but he was a regular at the cafe and we spoke almost daily. He was just a few years older than me-mid 50's, he was overweight, and had a few minor issues, but he was not an "unhealthy" person. If this illness can take him out, there are a lot of other people that could be at risk, not just those high risk people that everyone talks about.

Sorry, but there is too many unknowns with this disease. So what happens when this virus rears its head again, and it will? We will be better prepared next time. By then we will know much more about it, how it works, who's at risk. Hopefully, we have a vaccine by then so we can stop its spread quickly, and may have drugs that can combat the symptoms.


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## jcakes (Feb 18, 2007)

Pete, I'm sorry about your customer.

Here in MA, non-essential businesses are now required to close; restaurants may only offer take-out or delivery. Our bakery is allowed to continue to offer curbside pickup for now. We do desserts/cakes/cookies though; no breakfast pastries or bread. I don't know if people will order for the upcoming Passover and Easter holidays; I'm hoping that can happen but with how this virus is trending, we will be dealing with more cases and perhaps more restrictions even though we are doing our best to flatten the curve.

I watched a webinar with ChefDeb yesterday, about how food businesses can weather this crisis; she had a lot of good suggestions. More along the lines of using this time to evaluate/create/strengthen your brand/message, engage in social media, don't pivot to something you don't do well or won't continue after the crisis is over. And, we will weather this crisis; the fact is though, that some businesses won't; but rebuilding is easier than starting from nothing.

I want to keep staff working but the reality is we are going to have to cut our hours (at some point, people with limited income won't be able to afford dessert, if you're sheltering in place, you can't have a birthday party with more than just yourself/people you live with). And so they're probably going to have to go on unemployment next month.

Our wholesale clients aren't having events so until that changes, that revenue stream is gone. My business will survive; when I started 18 years ago my mentor taught me to have 3-6 months in reserve and I socked away everything we made over the holidays to create that reserve. I'm so grateful for that lesson.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

pete said:


> If you want a bit of data here's a bit for that I posted to FB the other day. Many people have been using the H1N1 outbreak of 2009 to compare this to to rationalize their beliefs that this is blown out of proportion, but it actually shows something very different. As of 3/20 there were 15,219 cases of COVID-19 and 201 deaths (yes these numbers have changed since then). The numbers usually used for the 2009 H1N1 outbreak are 60.8 million cases and 12,469. That puts the mortality rate of COVID-19 at 1.3% and the mortality rate of H1N1 at .02%. That makes COVID-19 65 times more deadly than H1N1. If COVID-19 infections reach the number of supposed H1N1 infections in 2009 that means we could, potentially have 790,000 deaths from this. Of course, because we have taken action I highly doubt that we will see 60 million cases, but if we hadn't then this could have been a real outcome considering that this virus spreads as easily as the flu.
> 
> Yes, the mortality rate will drop with more people getting tested and testing positive, but by how much? And if hospitals become overburdened with patients, how many people that would have survived with minor intervention will end up dying?
> 
> ...


I know we are not supposed to keep drumming this up in this post but I think your math is a little off. We keep assuming the mortality rate based on confirmed cases and confirmed deaths. It is a little premature to go around scaring people with that 3% rate that keeps popping up when we have no idea currently the total numbers. Here in my county we had around 2000 tested, of those 60 were confirmed, of that 8 went to the hospital and of that 3 were in ICU and of that 1 died. That is just the ones that were tested and the county suspects many more have been walking around with it without knowing. It's one of those eternal dilemmas, how much is a life worth? Is a 75 year old grandmother's life worth more than the lively hood of 6 restaurant employees and their families? Who is to say, I just personally believe we eventually have to decide as a society the break away point where the financial impact of a larger percentage is the higher consideration than the mortality probabilities of a percentage of the population. Where that line is I have no idea as I have been blessed to still have income during this.


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## cheflayne (Aug 21, 2004)

Seoul Food said:


> Who is to say, I just personally believe we eventually have to decide as a society the break away point where the financial impact of a larger percentage is the higher consideration than the mortality probabilities of a percentage of the population. Where that line is I have no idea as I have been blessed to still have income during this.


When the break away point is decided, hope like hell that you are on the side of the break away point that you want to be.

Sorry I regressed, take to social media to share recipes and tips for making favorite dishes at home, which will help to keep the community stay connected and supportive of your establishment. Add a bonus to gift cards sold during this time. such as an extra 10-20% discount on menu items upon redemption. In addition to take out, offer meal kit preparation boxes with recipes.


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## chefross (May 5, 2010)

We are trying to stay safe at our grocery store here. We are discouraging people from coming into the store while encouraging the use of our call in and curb service.
I'm bringing up the age old story of latex gloves.
Everyone here must use them at work.
My personal feelings about their use aside, I must stand by and watch people touching everything with the gloves, and then their face or hair, then the telephone, the register.....see what I mean? 
I am reading information that the only people who should wear a face mask, are those with the virus to protect those around them. Wearing a mask to protect yourself from the virus doesn't work.
My nephew in New Jersey contracted the virus and survived. He said it wasn't the sickest he'd ever been. I am glad he's okay but worry about his future health.
Stay safe all and wash those hands.


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## halb (May 25, 2015)

chefross said:


> I must stand by and watch people touching everything with the gloves, and then their face or hair, then the telephone, the register.....see what I mean?


Yes. Why bother with gloves at all? Employees need to be properly instructed on food handling and hygiene. When they understand how it's supposed to work they won't do stupid things like that. Right now all they know is that they are supposed to wear gloves.


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## jcakes (Feb 18, 2007)

The first ServSafe class I went to was more years ago than I care to recall; but I remember the instructor saying "the gloves are to protect the food from YOU!" 

We go through a case of gloves in about a month; there are four of us and two different sizes in use. There are some things I am militant about: washing your hands and changing your gloves. And, disposable pastry bags - the thought of the cloth ones makes me retch!


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

We were finally issued masks. Kinda the same thing with the gloves. People aren't use to wearing them all day so they are constantly touching them, adjusting them, ect. Not to mention with the shortage they have to be worn multiple times. Kinda defeats the purpose if you touch it all day with soiled hands, then reuse it, but I guess it's more of a mental thing right now.


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## halb (May 25, 2015)

Seoul Food said:


> I guess it's more of a mental thing right now.


Given that the effectiveness of masks is questionable anyway. I thought that masks were being reserved for medical personnel?


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## pete (Oct 7, 2001)

halb said:


> Yes. Why bother with gloves at all? Employees need to be properly instructed on food handling and hygiene. When they understand how it's supposed to work they won't do stupid things like that. Right now all they know is that they are supposed to wear gloves.


This whole glove thing is driving me nuts. I watch people at the store wearing not only latex or vinyl gloves but gardening gloves, work gloves, winter gloves, etc. They wear them everywhere and touch everything. They don't realize that both they and the public would be better served if they just washed their hands often and stopped using the gloves that touch everything!!!!!!


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## halb (May 25, 2015)

I guess I have to reverse what I said above about masks. Now they are saying that masks are effective. That can change again tomorrow...


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

halb said:


> Given that the effectiveness of masks is questionable anyway. I thought that masks were being reserved for medical personnel?


While I am the food side of it I work in health care dealing with senior living care. So we're in that grey area, not a hospital but still health care.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

halb said:


> I guess I have to reverse what I said above about masks. Now they are saying that masks are effective. That can change again tomorrow...


Kinda like the health talks about butter and eggs, always flip flopping.


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## halb (May 25, 2015)

My wife told me this morning that she was watching CNN and they had John Taffer (the Bar Rescue guy) on. He was saying that after this is over, restaurants are going to be required to maintain at least 6 foot spacing between seated customers at different tables. He can say what he wants, but I haven't heard anything about it officially. 

I won't frequent restaurants that pack tables so close that you can hear the conversations of the people next to you, and after this I think most people will feel that way. Even though some restaurants are going to have to 86 some tables, this actually could be better for business.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

halb said:


> My wife told me this morning that she was watching CNN and they had John Taffer (the Bar Rescue guy) on. He was saying that after this is over, restaurants are going to be required to maintain at least 6 foot spacing between seated customers at different tables. He can say what he wants, but I haven't heard anything about it officially.
> 
> I won't frequent restaurants that pack tables so close that you can hear the conversations of the people next to you, and after this I think most people will feel that way. Even though some restaurants are going to have to 86 some tables, this actually could be better for business.


What did they say about booths and bar stools? If this is true then why does the restaurant industry get the shaft again? They would have to do the same for theaters, public transportation, nail/hair salons, gyms, and more. I agree they shouldn't shove people into a space like sardines, but 6 feet may be excessive. It's interesting that we were growing apart as a society from actual human interaction due to technology and now it is being added on to by this.


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## halb (May 25, 2015)

Seoul Food said:


> What did they say about booths and bar stools? If this is true then why does the restaurant industry get the shaft again? They would have to do the same for theaters, public transportation, nail/hair salons, gyms, and more. I agree they shouldn't shove people into a space like sardines...


I guess he was only speaking from his perspective in the bar/restaurant industry. I can see restaurants moving tables and chairs around to provide more space as a token gesture to make customers feel better. But other than that I don't think it's going to be practical for other areas of a restaurant or bar or anywhere else for that matter.

I think that when this is over we need to be cautious until we're sure it's really over, but we survived this long without "social distancing". Something like this is an overreaction to an unimagineable situation that never should have happened in the first place. Something that we will never see again in our lifetimes. We all should come away from this with a heightened awareness of proper hygiene and sanitation but normal exposure to our environment can be a good thing. Being a germophobe is not.


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## Seoul Food (Sep 17, 2018)

halb said:


> I guess he was only speaking from his perspective in the bar/restaurant industry. I can see restaurants moving tables and chairs around to provide more space as a token gesture to make customers feel better. But other than that I don't think it's going to be practical for other areas of a restaurant or bar or anywhere else for that matter.
> 
> I think that when this is over we need to be cautious until we're sure it's really over, but we survived this long without "social distancing". Something like this is an overreaction to an unimagineable situation that never should have happened in the first place. Something that we will never see again in our lifetimes. We all should come away from this with a heightened awareness of proper hygiene and sanitation but normal exposure to our environment can be a good thing. Being a germophobe is not.


I agree, and I hope you are right that we will never see something like this again in our lifetimes. But the cynic in me believe people will try to capitalize on this any way they can. Fear is a powerful motivator.


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## mystickrewe (Apr 27, 2015)

Seoul Food said:


> Just because a professional in a given field states something as fact doesn't make it so. There are thousands of deaths each year from misdiagnosis from your "experts".


This is a great example of the "exception which proves the rule fallacy."

There is overwhelming support among the lion's share of the scientific/expert community on this issue. Who are you going to listen to? The exception? Or the majority of the experts?

As far as whether it's not as bad as it seems, let's hope that's the case. That's a good thing.

Several years ago there was a big scare about the ebola virus. But at that time we had competent leadership which took the pandemic threat seriously and we took proactive steps to contain it early on. This was not done in the case of Covid-19, and now we're paying the price.

It's a sucky situation, but that doesn't mean it's the end. People are still going to need food. Some restaurants who don't adapt will fail. Some who pivot and address the environment will flourish. Things are different now. They may be different for awhile. Complaining that we can't go back to the way it was isn't going to change reality. If you really think this is an overreaction, talk so somebody -- anybody who is in the medical field right now. They'll tell you this is not like anything they've seen. The medical industry is overloaded. There aren't enough resources to care for just the Covid cases, much less what happens to the rest of us if we get ill.

My place was shut down. Where we're at in New Orleans, the restaurants can serve to-go, but the place I am associated with was so prep heavy they decided it was easier to close than pivot, but I'm hoping they'll adapt and take advantage of things. Right now the owner is researching all the different loan/grant options which seems really intimidating.


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