# Bread Help Needed



## bettyr (Feb 18, 2007)

I found this recipe on another forum, the lady that posted the recipe posted some pictures, and they looked really good. It's hard to tell what bread is going to taste like from a picture so I was wondering if someone with bread baking experience could tell me what he or she thought of this recipe. I can buy all the ingredients at the grocery except the dough conditioner; I figured that I would just leave that out.
Thanks,
Betty


Whole Wheat Honey Bread

1/3-cup honey
1/3 cup shortening
1-1/2 teaspoons salt
1-3/4 cup scalded milk
1/2-cup cool water
3 large eggs
5 heaping tablespoons vital wheat gluten (store in freezer)
1 heaping tablespoon of dough conditioner 
2 cups whole-wheat flour (store in the freezer)
3-1/2 cups all-purpose flour (stirred to fluff then spooned) 
2 teaspoons yeast (store in the freezer)

In the mixer bowl place the honey, shortening, salt, and scalded milk. Stir with a rubber spatula until all ingredients are dissolved and shortening is melted. Then add the eggs, water, vital wheat gluten, dough conditioner, whole-wheat flour and 1 cup of the AP-flour. 

With the paddle attachment beat this mixture on medium speed for 2 minutes. Add the yeast and beat 2 more minutes. Place the dough hook into the machine and add the last 2-1/2 cups of AP-flour. Knead with the dough hook for 22-25 minutes. 

Allow dough to rise to the top of the bowl. Cut into two equal pieces and form into loaves and place into prepared loaf pans and spray very well with no-stick spray.

Preheat oven to 325°. Bake bread for 48 minutes. Remove loaves from pan and allow to cool on cooling racks.


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## qahtan (Dec 7, 2003)

This is some of my whole wheat, made with out any conditioners etc, I just swapped 1 1/2 cups of white flour for home milled whole wheat flour.... I use butter, and you could swap the sugar for honey if you want...... qahtan

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## bettyr (Feb 18, 2007)

Thanks for the pictures they look really great!! 

What recipe did you use?
Betty


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## qahtan (Dec 7, 2003)

Basic white bread

5 1/2 cups flour
1 1/2 teaspoons salt
2 1/2 teaspoons yeast
2 1/4 cup water give or take
1 table spoon sugar
3 tablespoons butter.

I jiggle at will, add stuff like cheese, etc or increase amounts. qahtan


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## bettyr (Feb 18, 2007)

Does this make a good sandwich bread? 

I've been reading a bit and most sandwich breads use either scalded milk or dry milk for softer bread; do you ever use milk?

How long does this bread stay fresh on the counter?

With that many loaves, do you freeze some of them?

Thanks for your help I really appreciate it.
Betty


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## qahtan (Dec 7, 2003)

What I am not going to use, I put in the freezer, I can't see the point of baking one loaf at a time. This is that same dough baked in a pullman pan.

I does stale quicker than shop bought, but then most shop bought is not what you call bread, ))

qahtan


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## bettyr (Feb 18, 2007)

Thank you qahtan,
I really appreciate your help. I'm looking forward to doing some experimenting and trying my hand at some different breads. I've been making that no-knead bread and it's very good but I'd like to try my hand at some sandwich bread.
Betty


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## kylew (Aug 14, 2000)

The flavor of bread is as much a function of how it's made as what's in it  Flavor is developed by the mystical manipulation of time and temperature, from first mix to fresh from the oven.

I'm not a big fan of conditioners and vital wheat gluten either. You can bake great 100% Whole Wheat bread without either.


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## bettyr (Feb 18, 2007)

Could you post your recipe? I'd appreciate any help that I can get.


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## newbiechef (Dec 12, 2006)

since we are speaking of breads here... has anyone ever tried a sourdough bread? ive been thinking about making a starter and everything from scratch... also has anyone also done like sweet loaf breads? like something i could put dried fruit into? could i use like a sweet roll dough, but instead of rolling it out and what not just bake it as a loaf? or should i be using a different kind of recipe all together? thanks... bread looks awesome by the way everyone.


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## mikelm (Dec 23, 2000)

And, since we are speaking of breads here, there's an interesting aside in the latest Cook's Illustrated (March-April '07) about storing bread...

"...bread does not keep well in the refrigerator.

"...tests have shown that baked goods such as cookies, cakes, and muffins actually stale faster in the refrigerator that at room temperature. ...these same items can be stored perfectly well in the freezer for long periods of time."

They go on with an explanation for this- it's on page 30 of the issue. This was news to me. I am kind of snowed by their recital of all the tests and permutations of recipes that they do, so I guess I will accept this.

Off topic, but interesting...
CI also said a test showed that ginger was best kept in the refrigerator _unwrapped_ because a baggie trapped moisture and led to mold growth much faster. On-counter storage was also worse.

Mike 

Mike


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## jock (Dec 4, 2001)

Sourdoughs are very popular and there have been many discussions on the subject. Click on the search link at the top of this page and type in Sourdough.

I had a starter (or Barm as it is sometimes called) in the fridge for about 3 years until I broke the glass jar it was in when I was feeding it one day  Peter Reinhart (Crust & Crumb, The Bread Baker's Apprentice, etc.) says that unless you are making sourdoughs regularly and frequently there is no benefit to keeping a starter going for extended periods except for the bragging rights. Making a starter is not difficult and it makes a superior loaf IMO. 

For a sweet bread with dried fruit, try a Panetone. I'm not a big fan of them but if you like that sort of thing...

Jock


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## bettyr (Feb 18, 2007)

Jock,
I have seen that book ‘The Bread Baker's Apprentice’ mentioned several times in my quest to learn about making bread. Do you think this would be a good book for a newbie bread baker or is this book written for people who already have a basic knowledge of the craft?

I noticed that 'The Bread Baker's Apprentice' is one of the books that are being offered by my book club as a selection that can be purchased with bonus points. I have enough bonus points to purchase the book at no extra cost but I need to know if I will be able to understand it once I have it. 
Thanks,
Betty


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## kylew (Aug 14, 2000)

Buy the book Betty!  It is a great resource for both new and experienced bread bakers. Peter Reinhart is a great teacher.


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## bettyr (Feb 18, 2007)

KyleW,
Thank you, I'm going to do that.
Betty


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## jock (Dec 4, 2001)

I second Kyle's comments. The book is awsome and the Reinhart is a wonderful teacher. The first 100 pages of the book explain the science of bread making and whether you retain all the information or not it is well worth reading. The recipes (propery called Formulae) are well written for any competency level. You won't regret the purchase.

Jock


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## bettyr (Feb 18, 2007)

Thank you Jock, I'm going to place my order online tonight so I should have the book in about a week. I really appreciate the help; my grandmother used to make bread for each evening meal and what was left over is what my grandfather used to eat for breakfast with his eggs and coffee. 

My mom was the baby of the family and never really learned to cook that well, much less make bread. I really want to learn how but I don't have anyone to teach me; so I'm hoping that I will be able to learn with some good books and practice. 
Betty


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## newbiechef (Dec 12, 2006)

ive seen it in a few recipes, what does milk and milk powder do to a bread recipe?.... im a bit interested in figuring out how this stuff all works so i may begin to develop my own baked goods recipes...


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## greenawalt87 (Jul 26, 2004)

I second that buy it I did and I am a chef it is very helpful in all stages of exsperience.


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## qahtan (Dec 7, 2003)

Re: old posting: recipe in "bread help needed" 

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Hi,,, The size of my pans are 8 X 4 X 31/2. with aprox 20 ounces of dough, baked at 400f about 40 mins. Its the kind of bread we use every day as toast, sandwich, what ever..... qahtan ;-)





Quote:
Originally Posted by newbiechef 
hello, i saw your bread recipe posted a while ago, and it looked rather good, i just had a few questions... what size loaves were those? how were they bake (temp & time)? and does it make a good "everyday" bread, like for things like sandwiches and toast and stuff? thankyou.


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## kylew (Aug 14, 2000)

milk, powdered or liquid, adds fat which softens the crumb. Fat also extends shelf life.


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## texasflute (Jul 11, 2006)

As far as bread books, I'm a fan of Elizabeth David's "English Bread and Yeast Cookery". It is not solely recipes, but a history and discussion of bread making. There are some good recipes in there, and most are very basic. There's a great English Muffin recipe in that book.

Homemade bread has a longer "shelf life" if baked with honey and a bit of dough enhancer. I bake huge batches of bread and freeze the loaves, buns, rolls, etc. This way I only bake bread every 2-3 weeks. I make all the breads consumed in our house.

The only bread I've not been successful with is sourdough. My sourdough bread could kill a person it was so heavy, and made you want to gag it was so sour. After wasting over 5 lbs of fresh stone ground flour, I threw in the towel on that one.


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## siduri (Aug 13, 2006)

Milk makes bread softer. You don;t put milk if you want a crusty loaf, and you do if you want a soft one. Milk, actually, makes everything soft.


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## mizshelli (Feb 28, 2007)

Ahhh, sourdough, my daughter and my husband's favorite bread. I felt like making a starter the other day too, so I did. Problem was, I put it in one jar covered with the cloth. OOPS, forgot the starter was going to ferment...heh....couple hours later my laundry room was sprayed with sourdough starter  . I just took the lid off the jar and divided it into two jars. I figure I can sacrifice the 1/2 cup I lost in the name of art.
Sometimes I think I am smarter than I actually am.......


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