# Top 10 recipes in America's Test Kitchen



## sawse

*Most Popular Recipes on America's Test Kitchen

1. Bacon-Wrapped Pork Tenderloin Medallions
2. Glazed Meatloaf
3. Skillet Chicken, Broccoli, Ziti, and Asiago Cheese
4. Potstickers
5. Oven-Barbecued Spareribs
6. Thick-Cut Pork Tenderloin Medallions
7. Dark Chocolate Cupcakes
8. Marinara Sauce
9. Spiced-Rubbed Picnic Chicken
10. Chicken Ki

*


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## phatch

Any particular reason you think this list is important?


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## sawse

Do you know what America's Test Kitchen does?


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## phatch

It earns the people involved with it a living. 

But otherwise, yes, I know. And still, Any particular reason YOU think this list is important?

Phil


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## sawse

Just so you really know:
List is Top 10 popular, trustworthy, tested, and optimized recipes for the American palate.

Try this prize winner from a grandma in the kitchen (she was younger then):
*Peach Puzzle*
url: cookscountry dot com / recipe.asp?recipeids=4185&bdc=50220

Thank you for your question: phatch Culinary Experience: Can't boil water
Your answer about ATK was so helpful.


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## harpua

When my cookbooks were in storage and I was living at my parents' house, I used her ATK book often. I made a few things from there, and they were good. Let's see if I can remember...

Oh one recipe, was buttermilk biscuits. Instead of cutting them out, you drop them and roll them into a ball. I thought that was weird, but they turned out good, for b&g. 

Also some baked goods and a couple of soups. Not bad, but not my favorite. My mom loves the book and the show.


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## kcz

Sawse, if you want to start a discussion about that list of recipes, you probably shouldn't begin by insulting a long-time and very knowledgeable member of this forum. :blush:

But since you brought up the list, I think it's interesting that ATK's most popular recipes are primarily for meat. This speaks volumes about America's eating habits (and cholesterol level).

I also find it interesting that only 2 of those recipes are included in ATK's "The New Best Recipe." Do the editors believe that what America wants to eat isn't the necessarily the same as the best dishes possible? Or do they just want me to buy a bunch of different cookbooks to get all America's favorite recipes? :roll:


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## phatch

Yes, I already do know. I get spammed every few months to subscribe to Cook's Country. I watched Chris and Brigitte make the very Marinara on the list on Saturday, as I have also watched many other episodes. I was unimpressed with the Marinara. I've been disappointed in most every recipe they take to the grill. If they're using a spice rub, I think they have a lot to learn about combining flavors. 

My point about asking you about the list was covered by Harpua a bit. You posted a list of recipe by titles. You didn't say if you agreed, if you thought they were of any particular quality, if you had cooked any of them or anything else. That a recipe gets the most hits on a website is no indication that they were actually cooked, or even liked if they were cooked. Yes, there's something to be said for ATK's approach, but there are also flaws. 

Taste is not universal for example. People's preferences vary. An analogy will help me make this point. Movie Critics supply reviews of movies. As I get to know a particular critic's taste, I can more accurately use his/her reviews to judge my reaction to a movie. I don't have to agree with his review to do this. If he routinely reviews a particular genre more harshly, science fiction for example, and I like science fiction, I can learn to add a few more points to those movies than he gives them so even a negative review can influence me postitively. 

By hiding the comments of the reviewers of these subjective things, we have no ability to really determine how their judgements reflect our reality.

This is the year I'm letting my Subscription to Cook's Illustrated lapse. I enjoyed it for a time, and I learned a fair bit of stuff. But they're not offering any real level of new insight. I own a number of their books. I haven't bought one for some time. I'm finding my cooking has moved beyond their target audience. I often refer to things I've learned from them here on this site. When someone asks for a product review or technique, I frequently mention what I remember from CI as they do provide some value. But they are not the final judge of Best by long shot.

As to why I listed Can't boil water on my profile, that's a bit convoluted. The field was added somewhat recently. I was in tweaking something in my profile and I couldn't close my profile without entering something for that field. I build my judgment of a person's skills and knowledge through their posts and thought the field was mostly useless. So I gave it the most useless entry available.


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## kyheirloomer

Hmmmmm? Frankly, I thought the list was an ad for ATK. Basically, thinly disguised spam. The later responses merely solidified that belief. First we get a big-time plug for ATK, and then an attack on a valued member. 

Sort of the Lenny Bruce school of winning friends and influencing people.

I notice, too, that sawse spares no opportunity to promote ATK (see for instance his comments on the Devil In The Kitchen thread), and have to wonder what his connection with them might be.


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## sawse

I tried being nice, and I knew your valued member had 2000+ posts, but he insisted on being a smart-twit even after I gently probed and prompted about his knowledge of America's Test Kitchen.

He deserved the gentle ribbing that he got.

Let's talk about your characterization of my alleged attack. I stated:
I repeated his own tongue in cheek description of himself, and I accurately implied that his smarty answer held no content.

Your characterization of that as an "attack" requires the "willing suspension of disbelief." Seems like your ego is just bursting to attack and mischaracterize someone in order to inflate your own importance and self-esteem.

Yes, I am relative new. But I do not have to sit like bump on a log as target for senior members to attack gentle, well meant, good content posts.

Regarding Phatch, today, he did come through with new comments that contained thoughtful content and sincerity.

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Regarding the value of popularity:
ATK by itself cooked the recipes 30 to 70 times each, so they have been tested.
ATK gets 270,000 visitors per month, which is 10 X Cheftalk, which gets 21,000. Let's assume that a significant number of of ATK's 3.5 million visitors per year are sincere in their votes and comments about recipes. (After all, votes drive USA democracy and votes (links) drive the WWW Internet, so in sufficient quantities votes have real value.) 
ATK's list of 10 most popular recipes is a valid as any other, and more valid than many.


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## sawse

In a stream of conciousness, my comment/response in that thread was the precursor to this new thread that I created, which has some intrinsic value.

You will have to dig deeper and be smarter than you have been so far in order to make a valid critique.

I should ask if you found my post about the history of French cookbooks to be too shallow, or too deep for your tastes.


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## anneke

If this was an actual conversation, it never would have degenerated to this. Written conversation can certainly be tricky, nuances missed, tones of voices and irony lost... Can we please kiss and make up? You all have valid points and bruised egoes, naturally. Let's move on constructively please.


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## phatch

By which logic McDonalds is the best food in the world and Olive Garden is the pinnacle of Italian cooking.

Self-selected polls are not particularly reliable. And again, I know nothing about the people voting so why should I trust their opinions. My experience with the food itself tells me it's not the BEST. 

Best actually has a legal meaning for the purposes of labeling. You can call anything the Best without having to prove it. But if you call it better, you have to have some empirical data about why it's better than other things. 

Phil


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## sawse

This is true for its intended purpose, which is openly stated by McDonalds, and proven by millions of people consuming billions of meals.

"BEST", best, looking for "best" in a post by sawse; word count = 0.

Edit: ATK uses "best" in its mission statement as follows: In this context, "best" is the best combination of variables for a given recipe. But they make no claim to be the best food in the world.


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## phatch

I wasnt' referring to you using best, but Cook's Illustrated/ATK labeling their books "The Best Recipe". 

Phil


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## sawse

Ibid Post#14;


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## phatch

And yet, we're back to those anonymous tasters about whom we know nothing to rate their judgements against. So why should we accept their word for it?


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## foodnfoto

OK, put Sawse on my "Ignore" list. Name misspelled-should be "Sows"-no, that's an insult to our sweet little porcine friends. MYBAD:blush:

What a bully-barges in making bold statements with little to back it up but a few polls generated by the subject themselves and then gets all defensive if someone takes issue with it. Then starts calling everyone the equivalent of ignorant. Sheesh! Aren't there enough of these types driving on our highways to last us all a lifetime?

I also agree, the plug for ATK was thinly veiled promotion, especially with all the quotes from the mission statement. Maybe not, but seems fishy.

Phatch, I'm with you, man. ATK can be good, but the mag picks up too many of their old stories. Some recipes really are good, but frankly, those Yankees really wouldn't know a decent biscuit from a hole in the ground.

This actually brings up something I've been stewing on for a while and I wondered what other valued members of this forum thought.
A few days ago, someone started posting a few recipes that promote some product that they obviously sell and also, without even reading the previous posts of a thread, jumped in and asserted something like " frozen won't be any good, fresh is always best" to which the thread originator gave a proverbial bronx cheer. I PMed the poster and asserted that his/her blatant self promotion without even an introduction in the Welcome Forum showed the kind of manners one would use in crashing a party. Haven't seen posts from them since.

Which brings me to my question, what's the best way to address these nincompoops? I figured a PM was the best way to not embarrass them in front of the whole crowd. But then, maybe a public comment as in this thread lets the group set the standard of behavior.
Unfortunately, now *I* kind of feel like a bully, eventhough I believe my comments to be justified.

What do all of you think?


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## canadiangirl

foodnfoto, I think the best thing is to lightly reprimand @ first and if that doesn't work maybe something stronger both on forum and PM.
When I first started posting(I had never posted anywhere before) I made some mistakes and was gently reprimanded for my mistakes. I was embarassed but now I try to keep my thoughts and opinions w/in the thread/forum. Also I sometimes felt"picked on"(me being too sensitive) :blush:but I know that I am not a chef and don't have the knowledge nor experience,so now sometimes I just "lurk"!!!!!!!

canadiandirl


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## shel

Hmmm ... sounds familiar 


Perhaps a PM (Personal Message?) is a good way to go, but a public message can also be valuable as it may stimulate some good conversation and the flow of ideas. There is room for divergent opinions here.

That said, the person mentioned above may have done better for him/her self if some time was spent reading the boards for a while and using the introductory forum. 

I don't see you as a bully.

shel


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## foodnfoto

Thanks Shel
You know of whom I speak.


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## shel

Yeah - he/she annoyed me as well with the constant advertising in his/her posts.

BTW, I've been meaning to drop you a note to tell you that I like your sig - "Liquored up and laquered down ... " reminds me of a couple of big-haired gals from Texas that I knew back in the 70s and 80s. I think Texans have the biggest hair in the country :lol:

shel (probably gonna get in trouble)


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## kcz

Sheesh, insulting Yankee biscuits...what next? 

I found this thread became a lot more bearable after I hit the ignore button and poured myself a glass of wine. Maybe that's the best way to deal with idiots who are just looking for attention. It seems like the best way to keep my blood pressure down anyway.


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## sawse

Quick, without running to the internet, what is the 5th taste sense?
What is it's purpose.
How is it sensed?
What foods trigger it?
How can you use it to enhance cooking and dining?

-----------------

There, I needed a brief diversion from the abundance of shallow minded snobbery exhibited by the "senior" members posting in this thread. Good lord, ya'll have such little ego's that you mindless attack anyone who doesn't kiss up to you.

I started this thread with a completely innocent post. 
The first responder started a snide smarty pants routine, that I deflected gently, with logic and kindness. As he ran further afield in his statements, I simply presented neutral but accurate logic.


Then ya'll pile on with complete idiocy. Ad hominim attacks seem to be all you know. Do you little people feel better now?

Frankly, your extensive shallowness has taken the fun out of the logical reparte that phatch engaged in.

If you review the content of this thread there was a lot to be learned. For example:
a) The true pupose of ATK
b) The real meaning of ATK's book title, which is deeper than a simple boast. The simple boast interpretation is rather shallow.
c) The relevant size and # of visitor to both websites. (Why the huge difference? there are valid reasons.)
d) Why ATK is so beloved by so many cooks, chef's or not.
e) Why were so many of the recipes about meat? (insightful but not pursued because cheap insults seem to be more to your liking and level.)
f) What (e) says about the American palate. (insightful but not pursued)
g) History of ancient cookbooks (not pursued)
h) the value of polls and popularity
i) Democracy and the Internet
j) Unexpectedly good results from unexpected procedures (drop & roll the biscuit dough).
k) Legal meaning of best vrs. better, and legal requirements for their use.

So many good concepts presented a great opportunity in this thread for learning and discussion. Ya'll just wasted it.

But, i'm bored with you now. I may or may not return to this thread.
Enjoy.


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## canadiangirl

WOW, 
You're kinda like the energizer bunny... Keep going and going and going-pissing people off. Why be so confrontational coming into a new forum?:crazy: At least it was an interesting read....


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## jim berman

This is a forum for insight and meaningful discourse. If that spirit is not why you are posting, please refrain. In other words... cut the nonesense and move on; life's too short.


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## nicko

Sorry guys closing this one down doesn't seem like this is helpful to anyone. As always pm me if you have questions.


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