# Problems with croissants?



## greipfruktas

Hello,

First time here, first time asking help with croissants. I learned to make them basically from what my chef showed me one time... I admit, first when I got croissants with broken butter I wanted to quit but didn't because of reasons.  Anyway, practice after practice I now make really nice croissants:




  








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greipfruktas


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Jun 11, 2016







Baked:




  








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greipfruktas


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Jun 11, 2016







So about my problems.
To prevent butter braking in the dough - working with butter which is about 15 degrees celcius. (The dough temperature is 4 degrees celcius)
Then I do book fold, double turn and one single turn. After that I cut them to triangles and roll them, after this straight to shock freezer.
I know that I should be chilling the dough between rolling but then the butter brakes. 
And the biggest problem is that after proofing dought is braking:




  








image.jpeg




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greipfruktas


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Jun 11, 2016








So, can I get any advice how to improve my croissants?

P.S. Sorry for broken English:/


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## chefross

I don't understand what you mean by "the butter breaks" when you cool it in between folds.

If you evenly distributed the butter in the dough from the beginning, it should not do this.

As far as proofing goes, the croissants will leak the butter but absorb it again when baked.

After you cut the triangles are you stretching them a bit?

You pictures elude to that fact that your dough seems a bit thick.

Correctly made croissants should have 7 folds and yours look to be only 4-5. This may be your problem.


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## greipfruktas

I don't know how to explain butter braking in the dough... When I was rolling the dough the butter was too hard from all the chilling and the butter in the dough makes like a zebra pattern:/ very ugly actually. I will try to find frozen ones from the past if there are left any.

As for making my butter, I use corman butter, cut it to a brick and make a sheet 40x30cm:




  








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greipfruktas


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Jun 12, 2016











  








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greipfruktas


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Jun 12, 2016








I cut my triangles to 9x28cm so they do not need any streching. 
Yes, it is thick, when rolling I get to 3mm thick but because the dough is warm it gets thicker  
And going further, because the dough is warm and because chilling got my butter broken I decided to do 1 double turn and 1 single. Before that I was doing 2 double turns and 1 single... But I do not believe that because of the lack of layers my proofed croissants explode. :/ Proofing settings must be rechecked I believe...


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## fablesable

K, someone definitely does not know how to make croissants. You say that you are a pastry chef however, if you did the proper training then you would know as to the why's and how's of making croissant pastry.

Your croissants are incorrect and you can see that by the photo you have showing the inside of the croissant. You should be seeing layers rather than large honeycomb effect like yours have. Yours looks like a sourdough roll rather than a croissant layered roll. They should look more like these examples:




  








blog1.6.16Croissants069.jpg




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fablesable


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Jun 12, 2016











  








blog1.6.16Croissants075.jpg




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fablesable


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Jun 12, 2016











  








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fablesable


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Jun 12, 2016








The last one you can tell that even though there are layers in there, the dough was proofed a little too warm. Another example of too warm would be:




  








00.-Croissant-216-trimmed.jpg




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fablesable


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Jun 12, 2016







It is too bread like inside.

Yours turns out the way it does because your dough and butter are not at the right temperatures when folding so you get your too large of holes and no layers. Also I would venture to say that you do not chill your dough before baking, which also causes the large holes as well as not stretching and rolling your dough will also cause the insides to look like a bread dough rather than a layered croissant.

So many things you are doing wrong. The butter should not be rolled to a 40x30 sheet as that would make it way too thin and therefore hard when refrigerating in between folds. You need to condition the butter with some flour cut in and pounded to make the butter more pliable with the dough thereby preventing the butter from breaking through. The butter when played out onto the dough you are laminating should only take up 2/3's of the dough so that you can do a letter fold (single fold) to fold the butter for #! fold. Then you refrigerate and follow with a double fold, refrigerate and the another double fold, refrigerate, roll out to cut into triangles 6-8"x10-12", then at the bottom of triangle you cut a 1/4" slice in the middle and stretch the triangle so that it ends up looking like an eiffel tower, roll fold the bottom triangle towards the tip making sure to stretch the pastry the whole roll and then tuck the top tip under the roll, refrigerate before baking. You need to be chilling the dough after each turn. A proper croissant takes 2-3 days to make. Patience is key to getting it right. Yours are right out of a horror story! /img/vbsmilies/smilies/mad.gif


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## greipfruktas

I didn't do any training, one time my chef showed me how to make them and said that I will be doing croissants and because I always wanted to learn to make them. 

Let's be clear on something, I make them them in too days. First day: butter and dough, next day: layering and rolling. I bake them when I need them, usually its the next day morning when we send them to the "dessert boutique", so they are proofed over night from frozen.

Thank You for showing the correct croissants. 

What do you mean chill the dough before baking? I bake croissants straight out of the proofing machine, should I keep them in the fridge once they proofed (O_O never heard that)?

I will explain my process a little bit:

Dough: made the day before, left in the fridge overnight.

Butter: made the day before, sheet 40x30 cm.

So, I grab the dough from the fridge, quickly roll it to 40x60 cm and put the butter on:





  








IMG_5692.JPG




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greipfruktas


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Jun 14, 2016








Then I do the book fold and rotate it:





  








IMG_5693.JPG




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greipfruktas


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Jun 14, 2016


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3







Roll it to 6mm thick and do the double fold:





  








IMG_5689.JPG




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greipfruktas


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Jun 14, 2016








After that again to 6mm and do the single fold (sorry about the ugly end):





  








IMG_5695.JPG




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greipfruktas


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Jun 14, 2016








And now I roll it to 3mm thickness, transfer it to the table and cut in to 9x28cm triangles, cut in the middle to look like an Eiffel Tower:





  








IMG_5696.JPG




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greipfruktas


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Jun 14, 2016








And yes I stretch a little bit that middle cut and fold inner corners and then roll it leaving the tip underneath.

I would say its like a horror story, I will try to chill the dough before rolling every fold and do more folds next time. Just dont know about the mixing butter with flour (don't want that), so maybe I will make a smaller sheet of butter to get it thicker.


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## panini

@greipfruktas , showing more of the method you use is not going to make it right.

Please go back and read what @Fablesable, has stated. Your butter has to malleable. This is usually done by getting after it with a french pin. You beat it until the friction of beating it warms it a bit/ You don't roll the butter in an retard it to make it cold. Your goal it to rest the dough while the developing flour and butter is arriving at the same temperature. At this point the butter should be pliable to roll evenly into dough. folds. If you have the retarder set at a low temp and your using a high fat content then there may be a need to cut in some shortening when beating.

I ideal dough has time to develop the proper properties.gluten. Resting between folds is critical. If you endu breaking of the dough or butter that's just an indication the your dough is not developed properly. I personally don't see a problem with adding a dough conditioner.


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## greipfruktas

@panini I am just trying to be clear as much as I can.  I want to understand and make them as they should be done and that's why I am here.

I do not roll the butter in an retard, I use the rolling pin to flatten in, it gets warmer when working. Although never tried beating the butter instead of gently pressing and making it thinner.

Also, I am using dough conditioner...


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## panini

Chef, wasn't meant to be a slam. I guess what i was saying is that there is a pretty traditional method and procedure for croissant production. Fablesable was trying to get there.

I just thought you might be trying to validate your method. 

After mixing the dough, retarding it overnight is not proper. Cold dough and cold butter do not blend well. When the dough is mixed, it should chill for just a bit. Then add the malleable butter.

If your butter starts to migrate out as tp leak, dust a bit to contain it.

The resting part, I think is the most crucial. The gluten needs to relax. The laminating/creating layers is also very important. With the relaxed dough and butter between the layers it give the croissants the ability for steaming between the layers and separation. This takes it from the bread world into the flakey pasty world.

I also want to say, if your customers are loving your product and buying the heck out of it, why change things?


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## greipfruktas

Ok, so if after making the dough I do not need to leave it overnight in the fridge to rest then what makes it a 2-3 days work? :/

My recipe calls for at least 4 hours chilling in the fridge before laminating (or overnight) - so I make the dough in the evening and start to laminate in the morning the next day.

Could You explain what is "tp leak" ?

Oh that "why" question... Because no one is doing proper croissants in my country. And in the recipe it says that I have to chill the dough with laminated butter before making turns for 30mins, so I want to know what I am doing wrong and be able to do resting before turning.


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## ilovetheweeds

greipfruktas said:


> I didn't do any training, one time my chef showed me how to make them and said that I will be doing croissants and because I always wanted to learn to make them.
> Let's be clear on something, I make them them in too days. First day: butter and dough, next day: layering and rolling. I bake them when I need them, usually its the next day morning when we send them to the "dessert boutique", so they are proofed over night from frozen.
> 
> Thank You for showing the correct croissants.
> 
> What do you mean chill the dough before baking? I bake croissants straight out of the proofing machine, should I keep them in the fridge once they proofed (O_O never heard that)?
> 
> I will explain my process a little bit:
> Dough: made the day before, left in the fridge overnight.
> Butter: made the day before, sheet 40x30 cm.
> 
> So, I grab the dough from the fridge, quickly roll it to 40x60 cm and put the butter on:
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> greipfruktas
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> greipfruktas
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> After that again to 6mm and do the single fold (sorry about the ugly end):
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> greipfruktas
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> And now I roll it to 3mm thickness, transfer it to the table and cut in to 9x28cm triangles, cut in the middle to look like an Eiffel Tower:
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> greipfruktas
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> And yes I stretch a little bit that middle cut and fold inner corners and then roll it leaving the tip underneath.
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> I would say its like a horror story, I will try to chill the dough before rolling every fold and do more folds next time. Just dont know about the mixing butter with flour (don't want that), so maybe I will make a smaller sheet of butter to get it thicker.


you MUST chill dough and butter to the same temp before combining them and you must chill dough after each turn. Do yourself a favor and get the book THE MAKING OF A COOK by Madeleine Kamman. Her explanation of laminated doughs are old school and unparalleled. So old school that she slices cakes into layers with string.


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## greipfruktas

Thanks everyone for Your help and replies. 

I now roll the butter with some flour a bit thicker than I made it before and I chill the dough before rolling again. It's all OK now. 

Also, now that I chill the dough, I tried to make Francois Brunet colored croissants:





  








13590369_10205410540616899_9069685988507074501_n.j




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greipfruktas


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Jul 16, 2016








Perfection. Thanks again!


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## Lugi

Hi Greipruktas
In my opnion, your croissants are on in the same line of Brunet products and I ask you an a little help to get an honeycomb crumb structure like yours? Thank you Luigi


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