# Baker's Joy and Bannetons



## kokopuffs (Aug 4, 2000)

At Fante's, a cooking equipment supply company, they recommend using Baker's Joy as a food release spray on Bannetons (Brotforms). Among other ingredients, it contains soybean oil, enriched flour and propellant. Would PAM be a suitable substitute for Baker's Joy? Any other suggestions for release sprays used on bannetons would be generously appreciated.


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## m brown (May 29, 1999)

Bakers Joy is the bomb. 

I love the stuff, it cuts prep time and finishing time down. 

It contains the oil but also the flour, so sticking to the pan is not a problem.

Pam is okay but it does not have the flour power.

(sorry, i had too!):roll:


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## kokopuffs (Aug 4, 2000)

What about spraying with PAM followed immediately by dusting with flour? Would that procedure be the equivalent? Can Baker's Joy be gotten at supermarkets like Safeway, Super Wally's and Kroger?


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## shakeandbake (Feb 24, 2007)

Pam makes a version with flour. It's called Pam Baking.


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## jbd (Mar 17, 2008)

Yes Baker's Joy is available in many grocery stores. Good product IMO. I have not tried the PAM Baking product but it should be a good product as well.


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## kokopuffs (Aug 4, 2000)

Found some PAM Baking this morning. Great! Onward and upwards.


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## mezzaluna (Aug 29, 2000)

Let us know how it comes out, Kokopuffs. I'm getting more and more into baking and pastry, so sooner or later I'll try one of these products.

(Good to see you again Kokopuffs!)
Mezz


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## erik (Jan 23, 2006)

I got some Pam Baking recently and had good results with it :smiles:


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## jessiquina (Nov 4, 2005)

i didnt think that you grease a banneton , i just thought you heavily floured them and then they kinda get seasoned that way.. i dont know. thats how i've done it. .. 

and after googling, i see that they also have cloth liners for them. i've never used those.


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## brook (Oct 27, 1999)

I've heard that you are never supposed to wash bannetons. But if they have been floured (and shaken after use), how do you prevent bugs?


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## jessiquina (Nov 4, 2005)

thats a good question. maybe you can keep them in an airtight container. ??

.. the only time i ever got bugs was when i was working on my pastillage at home for like a month, and then i noticed little bugs and then they went away. ..


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## kokopuffs (Aug 4, 2000)

My instructions from FANTES.COM state to periodically rinse and brush out the old flour. Place in a 250 F oven along with a pan of water (I use boiling water) for 20 minutes. Remove and allow to air dry before stacking in storage. Prior to placing a new dough in them, use the Pam Baking or whatever aerosol oil/flour mixture followed by dusting the innards very well with flour.


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## stir it up (Oct 15, 2007)

I totally disagree with using Pam, or any other bakers spray on Bannetons. Ew. Maybe that is more foolproof in Fantes' mind, but I think most bakers wouldn't resort to that. Bannetons are expensive, hopefully you haven't sprayed yours with Pam yet.

Use a non-stick type of flour to flour them, rice flour or rye flour is usually what I use depending on the bread. Wheat flour is more sticky due to its wheat gluten, so I recommend avoiding wheat flour on your bannetons.

The imperative part is to form the loaf correctly. You should also have already done your first bulk fermentation in another container, use the Banneton for the final proof. 

Richard Bertinet's books have a DVD which shows a decent boule formation technique. You want surface tension on your loaf, it would take too much to describe it in full, but on a floured board, pull the edges inward to the center around the circle, the underside that's touching the floured board becomes the top surface of the loaf, and the surface that's put in contact with the banneton.

It is easy to say flour heavily, if you flour too heavily, you will not get a nicely defined ring pattern. When you turn it out of the banneton you will also get too thick and chunky flour on top of your bread, if you brush that away, say goodbye to those nice rings.

I think where people go wrong and stick to their banneton is using the wrong flour in the banneton, and not using a well formed loaf that is ready for the banneton, the loaf being a little non-stick itself due to being properly formed and having a gentle invisible flouring on its surface, as well as good gluten quality from your technique. Another way to stick to your banneton is to put just beaten dough that's too wet in there. You really want a well formed loaf, with proper gluten worked up, after its bulk fermentation. Then with moderate flouring with a non-stick flour, and no spray, you will have a good result coming out of your banneton.

BTW, what did you get for bannetons from them, did you get some of their Slovakian bannetons - I'm wondering about how the quality compares to the German ones? (I'm assuming when you say bannetons you're talking about the willow type ones, for stripe patterns)

Pam is really the wrong way to go for a banneton IMO.


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## kokopuffs (Aug 4, 2000)

Thanks Mr. Stir:

I got a German one that's being exchanged for one that's larger and not damaged like the one I received. And no, they haven't been sprayed with PAM. The German ones come in sizes larger than the Slovakian ones.

THANKS! for mentioning the use of rye flour in place of PAM Baking or whatever. And the KA dvd on Artisan breadmaking demonstrates boule making to achieve a good degree of surface tension on the proofing dough.


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